Hi everyone,
I recently encountered an issue. The company does not have an HR manager yet. Some HR responsibilities have been assigned to the Assistant Operations Manager (AOM). However, the AOM is making decisions without being objective. For instance, he terminated an employee because the employee declined to participate in a training session she had already completed in the past, for which she had received a certificate.
What steps can be taken in this situation where things seem to be spiraling out of control? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Regards,
Vishkrish
From Suriname, Paramaribo
Acknowledge(0)
Amend(0)
6I recently encountered an issue. The company does not have an HR manager yet. Some HR responsibilities have been assigned to the Assistant Operations Manager (AOM). However, the AOM is making decisions without being objective. For instance, he terminated an employee because the employee declined to participate in a training session she had already completed in the past, for which she had received a certificate.
What steps can be taken in this situation where things seem to be spiraling out of control? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Regards,
Vishkrish
From Suriname, Paramaribo
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Dear Vishkrish,
You have written about the incident, but what is your designation? What is your leadership doing? Without tacit approval from leadership, do you think any employee could be fired so easily? Is it possible that the management was seeking an opportunity to dismiss that employee, and her refusal to attend the training made it convenient for them?
There are so many questions. Leadership demands upholding rationality, which is quite challenging and not easy. This is why only one leader emerges from hundreds.
Thanks,
Dinesh V Divekar
From India, Bangalore
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
You have written about the incident, but what is your designation? What is your leadership doing? Without tacit approval from leadership, do you think any employee could be fired so easily? Is it possible that the management was seeking an opportunity to dismiss that employee, and her refusal to attend the training made it convenient for them?
There are so many questions. Leadership demands upholding rationality, which is quite challenging and not easy. This is why only one leader emerges from hundreds.
Thanks,
Dinesh V Divekar
From India, Bangalore
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Dear Vishkrish,
This is in addition to what I have written earlier. Acquiring the course certificate is not the end result of the training. What matters is whether productivity is improved or not.
Did AOM re-nominate that employee for the training as she did not show any improvement in her work? Was there any customer dissatisfaction? Was there any goof up from her side? We need information on this count as well.
If her re-nomination is to improve her productivity, then I feel that AOM did not do anything wrong as such. However, he should have called the employee and explained the reasons why it was important to take training a second time. This, probably, he did not do.
Anyway, firing an employee for failing to attend the training is a bit excessive, no doubt, but in India, I doubt whether an employee would even get a warning letter for being absent from a training course, even if it were the first time nomination.
Thanks,
Dinesh V Divekar
From India, Bangalore
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
This is in addition to what I have written earlier. Acquiring the course certificate is not the end result of the training. What matters is whether productivity is improved or not.
Did AOM re-nominate that employee for the training as she did not show any improvement in her work? Was there any customer dissatisfaction? Was there any goof up from her side? We need information on this count as well.
If her re-nomination is to improve her productivity, then I feel that AOM did not do anything wrong as such. However, he should have called the employee and explained the reasons why it was important to take training a second time. This, probably, he did not do.
Anyway, firing an employee for failing to attend the training is a bit excessive, no doubt, but in India, I doubt whether an employee would even get a warning letter for being absent from a training course, even if it were the first time nomination.
Thanks,
Dinesh V Divekar
From India, Bangalore
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Please ask the employee to meet the AOM and find out the reasons. I don't think that the termination is for not attending the training program. As rightly mentioned by our friend Dinesh, the employee might not have shown any improvement; hence, she might have been asked to attend the training.
Any violation of orders shall be viewed as insubordination and not honoring the orders of superiors. An employee who is unable to comply needs to communicate properly. Staying away without any prior permission or intimation is not acceptable and advisable. However, termination for that reason, especially without any notice or opportunity, goes against the set rules and laws.
Please ask the employee to talk to him and resolve the issue. If the employee goes to court, reinstatement is likely to be the result.
Regards - Kamesh
From India, Hyderabad
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Any violation of orders shall be viewed as insubordination and not honoring the orders of superiors. An employee who is unable to comply needs to communicate properly. Staying away without any prior permission or intimation is not acceptable and advisable. However, termination for that reason, especially without any notice or opportunity, goes against the set rules and laws.
Please ask the employee to talk to him and resolve the issue. If the employee goes to court, reinstatement is likely to be the result.
Regards - Kamesh
From India, Hyderabad
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Dear Dinesh,
Thank you for your reply.
What I know is that the employee is someone around 50, with experience and a good understanding of customer care. There are no complaints from customers' side. The potential issue could be that due to her experience and age, she is not accepted in the "youngleading" department, which she has already noticed and shared with others she could trust in that office.
She also mentioned that she is lacking respect in the office, including from the trainer during the first-day training session she attended.
The Assistant Operations Manager (AOM) instructed her to write a letter to the management explaining why she does not want to attend the training (the employee was unaware of this requirement). She was planning to do so but was then informed that she was being terminated.
Based on a brief assessment I conducted, it appears to me that the AOM lacks leadership qualities, does not collaborate with supervisors, relies on rewards and punishment, and struggles with communicating effectively with staff (as confirmed during the training). In conclusion, it seems that he may also benefit from additional training.
Thank you.
Vishkrish
From Suriname, Paramaribo
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Thank you for your reply.
What I know is that the employee is someone around 50, with experience and a good understanding of customer care. There are no complaints from customers' side. The potential issue could be that due to her experience and age, she is not accepted in the "youngleading" department, which she has already noticed and shared with others she could trust in that office.
She also mentioned that she is lacking respect in the office, including from the trainer during the first-day training session she attended.
The Assistant Operations Manager (AOM) instructed her to write a letter to the management explaining why she does not want to attend the training (the employee was unaware of this requirement). She was planning to do so but was then informed that she was being terminated.
Based on a brief assessment I conducted, it appears to me that the AOM lacks leadership qualities, does not collaborate with supervisors, relies on rewards and punishment, and struggles with communicating effectively with staff (as confirmed during the training). In conclusion, it seems that he may also benefit from additional training.
Thank you.
Vishkrish
From Suriname, Paramaribo
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Dear Kamesh,
Thank you for your reply. I agree with what you are saying; it might also be the case. The employee informed the AOM about it and only asked for one day to think about it again. Hence, that was the result.
Then I have one question: Is it mandatory to give any notice to the employee in this case? The employee was in her probation period. Or is direct termination okay?
Regards, Vishkrish
From Suriname, Paramaribo
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Thank you for your reply. I agree with what you are saying; it might also be the case. The employee informed the AOM about it and only asked for one day to think about it again. Hence, that was the result.
Then I have one question: Is it mandatory to give any notice to the employee in this case? The employee was in her probation period. Or is direct termination okay?
Regards, Vishkrish
From Suriname, Paramaribo
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Dear Vishkrish,
Thanks for sharing your experience. In the absence of any HR person, one can understand the chaos, confusion, and anarchy present in the company. It makes a nice brief case study on the importance of having an HR department and HR professional on board. However, it may be difficult for small companies; in which case they may hire the (part-time) services of an HR consultant.
I would like to know:
Who looks after the financial matters of your company? Is it again delegated to any Asst. Operations Manager? If the answer is NO; and that it is looked after by a professional finance person or supervised by a Chartered Accountant; then the question arises that why just anybody is deemed to be competent enough to handle HR matters?
It would be difficult to teach just anyone about Human Resource Management without the rigors of theoretical background and education and practical training that is found in a good B-school. Firefighting and finding solutions to hundreds of issues that may keep cropping up is not the right way to deal with human resources. It only shows how companies underscore the importance of their employees as well as the practice of HRM.
It is similar to the situation where doctors with fake degrees or unqualified people treat patients.
Warm regards.
From India, Delhi
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Thanks for sharing your experience. In the absence of any HR person, one can understand the chaos, confusion, and anarchy present in the company. It makes a nice brief case study on the importance of having an HR department and HR professional on board. However, it may be difficult for small companies; in which case they may hire the (part-time) services of an HR consultant.
I would like to know:
Who looks after the financial matters of your company? Is it again delegated to any Asst. Operations Manager? If the answer is NO; and that it is looked after by a professional finance person or supervised by a Chartered Accountant; then the question arises that why just anybody is deemed to be competent enough to handle HR matters?
It would be difficult to teach just anyone about Human Resource Management without the rigors of theoretical background and education and practical training that is found in a good B-school. Firefighting and finding solutions to hundreds of issues that may keep cropping up is not the right way to deal with human resources. It only shows how companies underscore the importance of their employees as well as the practice of HRM.
It is similar to the situation where doctors with fake degrees or unqualified people treat patients.
Warm regards.
From India, Delhi
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
I think I see where the thermal problem is:
(Derived reading between the lines)
- You have a senior customer service agent who is 50 years old in a team that is young.
- She is overconfident and expects everyone to respect her just because she is 50 years old, irrespective of her proven ability (apparent from her comment that the trainer does not respect her on the first day of training).
- Resistant to management's instructions.
- Bad-mouthing management (apparent from the fact that even in probation, she has gone around telling people that management does not like her because she is old).
On top of that, when asked to take a training that the company is paying for, she refused to take it on the grounds that she has a certificate in it (not mentioned how old that certificate is) and knows the subject. Despite being told she still needs to take the training, she continues to argue and refuses to do so.
Obviously from the manager's point of view, she is a wrong hire.
It's best for him to terminate her immediately before she causes further problems.
I suspect I would have done the same in his place.
From India, Mumbai
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
(Derived reading between the lines)
- You have a senior customer service agent who is 50 years old in a team that is young.
- She is overconfident and expects everyone to respect her just because she is 50 years old, irrespective of her proven ability (apparent from her comment that the trainer does not respect her on the first day of training).
- Resistant to management's instructions.
- Bad-mouthing management (apparent from the fact that even in probation, she has gone around telling people that management does not like her because she is old).
On top of that, when asked to take a training that the company is paying for, she refused to take it on the grounds that she has a certificate in it (not mentioned how old that certificate is) and knows the subject. Despite being told she still needs to take the training, she continues to argue and refuses to do so.
Obviously from the manager's point of view, she is a wrong hire.
It's best for him to terminate her immediately before she causes further problems.
I suspect I would have done the same in his place.
From India, Mumbai
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Well, the question is not clear. Based on that, I can say that if a training program is mandatory and helps the employee improve performance, then the employee should go for it or can request to postpone it if possible. In such a situation where the employee is not performing well even after attending training, having a certificate, and then directly denying to join further training, then nothing wrong has been done by your AOM. The company is willing to improve your performance by providing you training programs, spending budgets, and wanting to retain you. However, if the employee is not ready to improve or join training, then it is viable to replace them with new talent by letting them go.
Ensure single line breaks between paragraphs.
From India, Lucknow
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Ensure single line breaks between paragraphs.
From India, Lucknow
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Dear Raj Kumar,
Thank you for your feedback. By the way, financial matters are handled by the Accountant. The Senior Manager called her back, and she joined the company again. The Assistant Manager also did not consult anyone before firing the employee. There always seems to be a communication problem between the Assistant Manager and all the supervisors. Strange but true.
I agree that there is a need for an HR department.
From Suriname, Paramaribo
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Thank you for your feedback. By the way, financial matters are handled by the Accountant. The Senior Manager called her back, and she joined the company again. The Assistant Manager also did not consult anyone before firing the employee. There always seems to be a communication problem between the Assistant Manager and all the supervisors. Strange but true.
I agree that there is a need for an HR department.
From Suriname, Paramaribo
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)Engage with peers to discuss and resolve work and business challenges collaboratively - share and document your knowledge. Our AI-powered platform, features real-time fact-checking, peer reviews, and an extensive historical knowledge base. - Join & Be Part Of Our Community.
Basics of firing employees.doc