Hi Friends,
It is not intended to hurt anybody.
Lot of retired people from defence services, I mean, not of core-HR people, are joining the Organizations at senior level to become HR Heads, after retirement. Some are opting at pre-matured retirement time and some at post-retirement age.
They might have possess administrative capabilities but many of them might not have the in-depth experience and exposure on different aspects of HR domain.
Is it a good sign in the current and future HR trends?
The environment in which they worked earlier, is totally from the industry. How can they cope up with HR culture in the industry and How can they build HR in the industry culture?
Does it lead to conflict of thought-process between them and career professional?
Is it not arresting the HR career professionals?
Trust me, I am not saying that they are not capable.
Like to get the views from the industry fraternity colleagues.
Regards
Sure
From India, Hyderabad
1It is not intended to hurt anybody.
Lot of retired people from defence services, I mean, not of core-HR people, are joining the Organizations at senior level to become HR Heads, after retirement. Some are opting at pre-matured retirement time and some at post-retirement age.
They might have possess administrative capabilities but many of them might not have the in-depth experience and exposure on different aspects of HR domain.
Is it a good sign in the current and future HR trends?
The environment in which they worked earlier, is totally from the industry. How can they cope up with HR culture in the industry and How can they build HR in the industry culture?
Does it lead to conflict of thought-process between them and career professional?
Is it not arresting the HR career professionals?
Trust me, I am not saying that they are not capable.
Like to get the views from the industry fraternity colleagues.
Regards
Sure
From India, Hyderabad
Dear Sure,
The field of HR as is concentrated on the man management. There are two ways to learn it..one being very young but competitive understand the concepts through formal education and the other to learn it on the job in the most toughest of the situations. In the corporates humans behave in an environment which is controlled & much civilized. In the security forces when deployed in god forbidden places the actual innate human qualities find way. Trust me it requires tremendous skill to manage people in those situations.
But on the other hand the corporate scenario demands legal HR process to be followed, Training & development procedures & methodology, etc which are different from that of the SF. That's the reason why the GOI is sending senior/offcrs with decent experience to Management Departments to learn what is important for the corporates.
Regards,
Vishwesh
From India, Pune
The field of HR as is concentrated on the man management. There are two ways to learn it..one being very young but competitive understand the concepts through formal education and the other to learn it on the job in the most toughest of the situations. In the corporates humans behave in an environment which is controlled & much civilized. In the security forces when deployed in god forbidden places the actual innate human qualities find way. Trust me it requires tremendous skill to manage people in those situations.
But on the other hand the corporate scenario demands legal HR process to be followed, Training & development procedures & methodology, etc which are different from that of the SF. That's the reason why the GOI is sending senior/offcrs with decent experience to Management Departments to learn what is important for the corporates.
Regards,
Vishwesh
From India, Pune
Dear Vishwesh,
Thanks for your comments, you have rendered it upto your knowledge to the best of it on the subject matter.
Let me say something on this aspect, the defence sector is the only place where u find the organisation is divided into only three verticles administration, technical and operations whereas corporate is divided into many verticles. The administration people has to handle the whole lot of gamut of subjects, in defence what 1 person is handling the same is handled by more than 5 people in the corporate and like e.g., corporate has hr, administration, facilities, legal, finance all separately whereas in defence it is dealt under one table and a single person is handling.
What we need today is to encourage these soldiers after their brightest n splendid service to the nation coming to the corporate give way an opportunity so that they can be tuned well as per the situation and they will render an exemplary service to the corporate by putting their vision and expertise of defence and other brainwave too.
Hope you all agree with my comments.
Thanks and Regards,
From India, Secunderabad
Thanks for your comments, you have rendered it upto your knowledge to the best of it on the subject matter.
Let me say something on this aspect, the defence sector is the only place where u find the organisation is divided into only three verticles administration, technical and operations whereas corporate is divided into many verticles. The administration people has to handle the whole lot of gamut of subjects, in defence what 1 person is handling the same is handled by more than 5 people in the corporate and like e.g., corporate has hr, administration, facilities, legal, finance all separately whereas in defence it is dealt under one table and a single person is handling.
What we need today is to encourage these soldiers after their brightest n splendid service to the nation coming to the corporate give way an opportunity so that they can be tuned well as per the situation and they will render an exemplary service to the corporate by putting their vision and expertise of defence and other brainwave too.
Hope you all agree with my comments.
Thanks and Regards,
From India, Secunderabad
Dear Mr. Giridhar,
Well said!!!
In the Armed forces there are various profiles we are aware. According to me only an offcr who has a work exp ranging from 10-20 and above years will be the best individual who has had a taste of man management & process orientation & compliance. The reason is as soon as an officer joins his unit for the next 4-5 years he will have very few chances of actual management at a certain higher level if not company level. Thus that type of man management is totally different.
Also clashes happen in any field or at anytime because expectations do not match. For the same there is a training need to all the ex SF guys before & during their tenure with any of the corporates.
Regards,
Vishwesh Deshmukh
Corporate Trainer - Conversational Techniques, Effective application of Body Language & Indirect Hypnosis
Pune
From India, Pune
Well said!!!
In the Armed forces there are various profiles we are aware. According to me only an offcr who has a work exp ranging from 10-20 and above years will be the best individual who has had a taste of man management & process orientation & compliance. The reason is as soon as an officer joins his unit for the next 4-5 years he will have very few chances of actual management at a certain higher level if not company level. Thus that type of man management is totally different.
Also clashes happen in any field or at anytime because expectations do not match. For the same there is a training need to all the ex SF guys before & during their tenure with any of the corporates.
Regards,
Vishwesh Deshmukh
Corporate Trainer - Conversational Techniques, Effective application of Body Language & Indirect Hypnosis
Pune
From India, Pune
Dear VSure,
The kind of exposure an Army officer gets cannot be matched in any sphere of life. He has to be a Leader, Manager, Brother ,father and a Mother to the men he leads and they are from all states, religion, caste and creed. I cannot expect you to realise, feel or understand the trials, tribulation and extreme pressures we are put through during Operations whether against the enemy or our own misguided Indians. All your senses, expertise and innovations of Man management comes to the fore.
It seems that you have come across an exception-there are one in every walk of life-trust me we do make good leaders, Managers and at par (with civilians) HR Personnel.
One more observation-this topic should not have been raised is this section "Organising Cooperate Events" but under the Human Resource..???
Regards,
Colonel Jude Mayne
From India, Bangalore
The kind of exposure an Army officer gets cannot be matched in any sphere of life. He has to be a Leader, Manager, Brother ,father and a Mother to the men he leads and they are from all states, religion, caste and creed. I cannot expect you to realise, feel or understand the trials, tribulation and extreme pressures we are put through during Operations whether against the enemy or our own misguided Indians. All your senses, expertise and innovations of Man management comes to the fore.
It seems that you have come across an exception-there are one in every walk of life-trust me we do make good leaders, Managers and at par (with civilians) HR Personnel.
One more observation-this topic should not have been raised is this section "Organising Cooperate Events" but under the Human Resource..???
Regards,
Colonel Jude Mayne
From India, Bangalore
Hi,
I am sure that Ex service men are equally competent as their counterparts in the corporate sectors. Adaptability is the core word for defense personnels and I bet they are good at it. Besides "Only the one who obeys can command" and I guess soldiers are synonyms for obedience.
Regards
From India, Shimla
I am sure that Ex service men are equally competent as their counterparts in the corporate sectors. Adaptability is the core word for defense personnels and I bet they are good at it. Besides "Only the one who obeys can command" and I guess soldiers are synonyms for obedience.
Regards
From India, Shimla
I completely agree with your post... even i was denied to get into a postion in a very good company, only because of lateral ego of the head hr who was a retired army personnel.. The reasonm is i was the only selected person in the company for thepost and this person had convinced the upper management with some false informations and had forced to rejest me...
he didnt even had the conceptual ideas which i had told him.. he was asking doubts to be cleared...
From India, Bangalore
he didnt even had the conceptual ideas which i had told him.. he was asking doubts to be cleared...
From India, Bangalore
Dear All
I have raised the topic in 'Human Resource Management' section on 25th Jan '10, after I have posted the same topic in 'Organizing Corporate Events' earlier, without knowing the posting procedures. Leave it aside, I have something to add to the topic, on going through the comments posted so far.
I do not have any doubts on the competency levels of the retired army officers. My concern is, how they will fit into various aspects of the HR domain in the industry... that too in private sector, whether it is manufacturing or IT or Services (Hotels etc) etc. They are experts in the Administration. HR in the private sector is not the Man Management alone. HR is totally a separate subject. HR is a wide arena of various aspects including legal compliance, compensation practices/trends, talent acquisition/management, retension strategies, performance management, HR metrics, engagement initiatives, latest HR trends, and so on. Practices / discipline procedures being followed in the corporate industries would be totally different from the defence services. Legal implications would be different. Handling Unions, Locals, liaision with the government, quasi-govt agencies... getting things done by undue means, etc.... to which the defence seniors may not be acquanited with. People mind-set in private sector would be different. Management in private sector ... their attitudes, attitudinal changes... dynamics... would be different...
We can win with positive discipline. We can not sustain with strict force. Over a period, it will lead to unrest among the employees, heads etc.
Ex-servicemen are experts in their own fort and may not be the right fit to head the HR function in toto in any industry vertical. But they are the best for the Administration part of HR domain. Whereas the ex-servicemen, who are technical like Engineers, Scientists, do wonders in the private sector also since they does the same or related job in the defence.
Further views / comments please.
Regards
Sure
From India, Hyderabad
I have raised the topic in 'Human Resource Management' section on 25th Jan '10, after I have posted the same topic in 'Organizing Corporate Events' earlier, without knowing the posting procedures. Leave it aside, I have something to add to the topic, on going through the comments posted so far.
I do not have any doubts on the competency levels of the retired army officers. My concern is, how they will fit into various aspects of the HR domain in the industry... that too in private sector, whether it is manufacturing or IT or Services (Hotels etc) etc. They are experts in the Administration. HR in the private sector is not the Man Management alone. HR is totally a separate subject. HR is a wide arena of various aspects including legal compliance, compensation practices/trends, talent acquisition/management, retension strategies, performance management, HR metrics, engagement initiatives, latest HR trends, and so on. Practices / discipline procedures being followed in the corporate industries would be totally different from the defence services. Legal implications would be different. Handling Unions, Locals, liaision with the government, quasi-govt agencies... getting things done by undue means, etc.... to which the defence seniors may not be acquanited with. People mind-set in private sector would be different. Management in private sector ... their attitudes, attitudinal changes... dynamics... would be different...
We can win with positive discipline. We can not sustain with strict force. Over a period, it will lead to unrest among the employees, heads etc.
Ex-servicemen are experts in their own fort and may not be the right fit to head the HR function in toto in any industry vertical. But they are the best for the Administration part of HR domain. Whereas the ex-servicemen, who are technical like Engineers, Scientists, do wonders in the private sector also since they does the same or related job in the defence.
Further views / comments please.
Regards
Sure
From India, Hyderabad
Dear All Hope the members have gone through the mails posted on the topic. Hope the beloved members have agreed with my views. Can I take like that ? Regards Sure
From India, Hyderabad
From India, Hyderabad
Hello Sure,
I disagree and regret to condemn your statement "Ex-servicemen are experts in their own fort(true) and may not be the right fit to head the HR function in toto in any industry vertical"(absolutely wrong). In my view and experience, every Indian should undergo defence training for a shortwhile to understand the basics of HR, Strategy, Management and so called by you the "positive discipline..". Defence is the only place where discipline is with freedom.
Not even an officer, but a soldier who has taken up his civil life after his defence services, starterd his HR career as an officer with his limited earned qualification from defence, has risen to the level of Head HR in a span of 10 years and susequntly Headed HR in two other MNC corporates. It is true that he may not know the diplomacy(neither he has learnt nor was taught) to achieve a fast track growth. But surely he can do wonders in heading a HR Team by the virtues of discipline & management taught or learnt by him in defence.(namely loyalty, integrety, trust worthyness, agility, leadership, uprightness, aplomb, etc)
Please do correct your opinion. We have volumes of live examples to disprove your statement.
Regards,
Aloysius
From India, Pondicherry
I disagree and regret to condemn your statement "Ex-servicemen are experts in their own fort(true) and may not be the right fit to head the HR function in toto in any industry vertical"(absolutely wrong). In my view and experience, every Indian should undergo defence training for a shortwhile to understand the basics of HR, Strategy, Management and so called by you the "positive discipline..". Defence is the only place where discipline is with freedom.
Not even an officer, but a soldier who has taken up his civil life after his defence services, starterd his HR career as an officer with his limited earned qualification from defence, has risen to the level of Head HR in a span of 10 years and susequntly Headed HR in two other MNC corporates. It is true that he may not know the diplomacy(neither he has learnt nor was taught) to achieve a fast track growth. But surely he can do wonders in heading a HR Team by the virtues of discipline & management taught or learnt by him in defence.(namely loyalty, integrety, trust worthyness, agility, leadership, uprightness, aplomb, etc)
Please do correct your opinion. We have volumes of live examples to disprove your statement.
Regards,
Aloysius
From India, Pondicherry
Community Support and Knowledge-base on business, career and organisational prospects and issues - Register and Log In to CiteHR and post your query, download formats and be part of a fostered community of professionals.
Joining formality.zip
JOINING KIT.doc
Ex Employee joining back..ppt