Hi sunayna,
Your question of "I wonder what took me so long to come" seems to be stepped out of your imagination. I will answer it through my imagination.
This world has a huge population. Out of this huge population, quite a lot of people die every year, more so in the 16th century when, according to the past life prediction, you were born and assumed the occupation of a poison manufacturer of all things (He Haw). Well, God has the responsibility of creating new people with new faces and new traits every day, possibly every hour or minute. Well, if so many people died back then, may be you died and your case was kept pending for so many centuries, because a whole lot of people had cases pending before yours.
Have you seen today's newspaper "Hindusthan times". It has an article saying there are 2.5 cr cases pending in the Supreme Court. Well, that's just India... Imagine the world!
Hope that answered your question. This is by far the most hilarious theory I have ever come up with.
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
1Your question of "I wonder what took me so long to come" seems to be stepped out of your imagination. I will answer it through my imagination.
This world has a huge population. Out of this huge population, quite a lot of people die every year, more so in the 16th century when, according to the past life prediction, you were born and assumed the occupation of a poison manufacturer of all things (He Haw). Well, God has the responsibility of creating new people with new faces and new traits every day, possibly every hour or minute. Well, if so many people died back then, may be you died and your case was kept pending for so many centuries, because a whole lot of people had cases pending before yours.
Have you seen today's newspaper "Hindusthan times". It has an article saying there are 2.5 cr cases pending in the Supreme Court. Well, that's just India... Imagine the world!
Hope that answered your question. This is by far the most hilarious theory I have ever come up with.
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
"Have you seen today's newspaper "Hindusthan times". It has an article saying there are 2.5 cr cases pending in the Supreme Court. Well, that's just India... Imagine the world!"
Hi Vinisha
Now theorise about the future. Can these cases as well as those which are getting piled up every day be ever disposed of in accordance with law? Can the litigants ever get justice? Courts want appointment of more judges. Goverments say they do not have so much money. What will happen to us?
regards
From India, Delhi
Hi Vinisha
Now theorise about the future. Can these cases as well as those which are getting piled up every day be ever disposed of in accordance with law? Can the litigants ever get justice? Courts want appointment of more judges. Goverments say they do not have so much money. What will happen to us?
regards
From India, Delhi
Hi Dr.,
2.5 cr cases pending in the Supreme Court only. When the cases in the high courts and civil courts are totalled up, it's left to our individual guesses what the number would come to.
The present state of affairs may well just continue into the future. The Government, as it claims to not have any money, may consider doing some serious financial planning for the kind of expenditure it meets (the unnecessary ones is what I am hinting at). Appointing more judges may cover a few more cases, bring down the number of pending cases, but in a vast country like India, the number of pending cases would still be huge. Besides, the quality of justice delivered is also important. Every other day, we hear of justice, either through the papers or through word going around.
As for the public, most have learnt not to bother. Some fight for a while and then give up. The expenses on seeking justice are not minimal. Some continue to bear the injustice. While a few others tread the injustice path to deal with this injustice.
"What will happen to us?" - the answer depends on who you are. If you constitute the handful super rich and upper class, well, you would be delivered justice or justice may just be "customized" to your convenience. If you constitute the majority of lower middle class, you may just not bother to seek justice and continue bearing the injustice. So the question does not apply. If you constitute the poor, you may start fighting for justice but then give up because you don't have enough money to continue pursuing it. And if you consitute the determined few, it is a matter of luck and situation, what will happen to you.
Ah see! Whether you get justice or no, depends to a great extent on how much "livelihood" you earn.
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
2.5 cr cases pending in the Supreme Court only. When the cases in the high courts and civil courts are totalled up, it's left to our individual guesses what the number would come to.
The present state of affairs may well just continue into the future. The Government, as it claims to not have any money, may consider doing some serious financial planning for the kind of expenditure it meets (the unnecessary ones is what I am hinting at). Appointing more judges may cover a few more cases, bring down the number of pending cases, but in a vast country like India, the number of pending cases would still be huge. Besides, the quality of justice delivered is also important. Every other day, we hear of justice, either through the papers or through word going around.
As for the public, most have learnt not to bother. Some fight for a while and then give up. The expenses on seeking justice are not minimal. Some continue to bear the injustice. While a few others tread the injustice path to deal with this injustice.
"What will happen to us?" - the answer depends on who you are. If you constitute the handful super rich and upper class, well, you would be delivered justice or justice may just be "customized" to your convenience. If you constitute the majority of lower middle class, you may just not bother to seek justice and continue bearing the injustice. So the question does not apply. If you constitute the poor, you may start fighting for justice but then give up because you don't have enough money to continue pursuing it. And if you consitute the determined few, it is a matter of luck and situation, what will happen to you.
Ah see! Whether you get justice or no, depends to a great extent on how much "livelihood" you earn.
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
viniiiiiii
you are proving now...that you are my friend
lol :mrgreen:
by the way, i would like to believe that GOd found me sweet and decided to keep me up in heaven with his other angels..
what say? :mrgreen:
and not due to some pending cases :no:
and by the way, i dont understand, there is such a simple solution to the pending case ka problem. Why not have more COURTs...???
i mean ther is talent in india, lawyers are overflowing out of courts...why not do something there. ???
From India, Mumbai
you are proving now...that you are my friend
lol :mrgreen:
by the way, i would like to believe that GOd found me sweet and decided to keep me up in heaven with his other angels..
what say? :mrgreen:
and not due to some pending cases :no:
and by the way, i dont understand, there is such a simple solution to the pending case ka problem. Why not have more COURTs...???
i mean ther is talent in india, lawyers are overflowing out of courts...why not do something there. ???
From India, Mumbai
Hi Sunayna,
That is a very obvious and simple solution - just establish more courts - no dearth of lawyers. Ofcourse involves hell a lot of expense.
But we cannot have such simple ideas implemented. We got to appoint a commission which will go into the reasons - why so many cases are pending (in the first place)? Where did they come from etc etc etc etc etc .................................................. .................................................. .
The commission will have a tenure of few years and the first report will be submitted (few years delayed) etc etc etc ................. and it goes on!!!!
Thanks
Bala
From India, Madras
That is a very obvious and simple solution - just establish more courts - no dearth of lawyers. Ofcourse involves hell a lot of expense.
But we cannot have such simple ideas implemented. We got to appoint a commission which will go into the reasons - why so many cases are pending (in the first place)? Where did they come from etc etc etc etc etc .................................................. .................................................. .
The commission will have a tenure of few years and the first report will be submitted (few years delayed) etc etc etc ................. and it goes on!!!!
Thanks
Bala
From India, Madras
Hi Bala & Sunayna,
Well Sunayna, good suggestion but Bala has a point too. Things don't just get completed fast in our country. And complicating simple things is again loved by most!
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
Well Sunayna, good suggestion but Bala has a point too. Things don't just get completed fast in our country. And complicating simple things is again loved by most!
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
Would like to put some quotes:
"The ability to simplify means to eliminate the unnecessary so that the necessary may speak" - Hans Hofmann
"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius—and a lot of courage—to move in the opposite direction." - E. F. Schumacker
"Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity." - Charles Mingus
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
"The ability to simplify means to eliminate the unnecessary so that the necessary may speak" - Hans Hofmann
"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius—and a lot of courage—to move in the opposite direction." - E. F. Schumacker
"Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity." - Charles Mingus
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
Hi Vinisha!
I get really impressed by your insight. However, let me put my insight. First of all le me correct the information. About 2.5 crore cases are pending in lower courts. About 35 lakhs in high courts. I have no idea about pending Supreme Court cases.
No Government can appoint judges and provide infrastructure proportionate to the court cases. Any such expectation is a wild goose chase.
Next, can a litigant get justice? Here I agree with you that it is a matter of luck not because of overload on the courts but because of confusion in law. Every other discipline of knowledge wants to eliminate confusion in favour of clarity whereas by and large practice of law wants to maintain confusion because confusion pays huge dividends to those who are associated with practice of law. Confusion favours wrong doers and reinforces wrong doing. You just can not be sure as to what is just, fair and reasonable in law. So beware of law.
Can there be alternatives then?
regards
From India, Delhi
I get really impressed by your insight. However, let me put my insight. First of all le me correct the information. About 2.5 crore cases are pending in lower courts. About 35 lakhs in high courts. I have no idea about pending Supreme Court cases.
No Government can appoint judges and provide infrastructure proportionate to the court cases. Any such expectation is a wild goose chase.
Next, can a litigant get justice? Here I agree with you that it is a matter of luck not because of overload on the courts but because of confusion in law. Every other discipline of knowledge wants to eliminate confusion in favour of clarity whereas by and large practice of law wants to maintain confusion because confusion pays huge dividends to those who are associated with practice of law. Confusion favours wrong doers and reinforces wrong doing. You just can not be sure as to what is just, fair and reasonable in law. So beware of law.
Can there be alternatives then?
regards
From India, Delhi
Hi Dr,
Thank you for the compliment and for clearing out the statistics. The number of pending cases in the Supreme Courts stood around one lakh in 1991, however, they have been reduced to 29000 as of 21st March. (Quite a relief). I apologise for the wrong information.
When you said the discipline of law tries its best to create confusion, I remembered a feeling I had when I has Law as a subject in the first year of our course. It was called Introduction to Business Law. Most failed to understant what it all meant and our Prof. didn't make it any easier for most. Though I do appreciate him to try to make the subject more interesting by making it challenging for us.
The reason most found it so difficult was because, firstly, the formation of statements seemed intended on, not educating, but hampering understanding. There were 3-4 different statements intertwined within one another that it makes comprehension a far possibility for a layman. Secondly, just like you will find a marketing executive talking only in a marketing jargon which might slip the understanding of a layman, individuals educated or dealing with law, follow the same principle. I do not yet understand the reason for the same, but it hardly helps in contributing to understanding.
I have a feeling not to expect much change in the approach of the law-makers and "law-literates" of the country. But alternatives to what is my question. If you are talking about alternatives to seeking justice, I have already mentioned those in one of the previous posts in the same thread. If your talking about alternatives to simplify and promote comprehension for the common man/ woman:
1. Law Literates can attempt to give up the complicated words and put it forth in simple terms. Afterall, the law wasn't formed for a handful but for the millions of people/ masses of India.
2. As I said before, the approach of law makers towards the usage of statements in law, can be and must be changed. But as I have already said, we may not keep much expectations.
3. NGOs working towards delivering justice to people may make efforts to involve the aggrieved party and make them understand all those laws that may pertain to their state.
4. People themselves can make an effort towards understanding. The matter in law books may be complicated, but with a little patience and determination to learn and understand, it surely becomes an easy task. Of course, this is applicable only to the literate population of our country.
5. For the illiterate, a system demanding transparency of law must be put into place. Although, implementing the system may again take a lot of time.
Another thing just struck my mind. I heard a lot about the Right to Information Act recently implemented but haven't had a chance to research much on it and hence, can't really say much on its relevance. But if it is relevant, I will definitely post soon.
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
Thank you for the compliment and for clearing out the statistics. The number of pending cases in the Supreme Courts stood around one lakh in 1991, however, they have been reduced to 29000 as of 21st March. (Quite a relief). I apologise for the wrong information.
When you said the discipline of law tries its best to create confusion, I remembered a feeling I had when I has Law as a subject in the first year of our course. It was called Introduction to Business Law. Most failed to understant what it all meant and our Prof. didn't make it any easier for most. Though I do appreciate him to try to make the subject more interesting by making it challenging for us.
The reason most found it so difficult was because, firstly, the formation of statements seemed intended on, not educating, but hampering understanding. There were 3-4 different statements intertwined within one another that it makes comprehension a far possibility for a layman. Secondly, just like you will find a marketing executive talking only in a marketing jargon which might slip the understanding of a layman, individuals educated or dealing with law, follow the same principle. I do not yet understand the reason for the same, but it hardly helps in contributing to understanding.
I have a feeling not to expect much change in the approach of the law-makers and "law-literates" of the country. But alternatives to what is my question. If you are talking about alternatives to seeking justice, I have already mentioned those in one of the previous posts in the same thread. If your talking about alternatives to simplify and promote comprehension for the common man/ woman:
1. Law Literates can attempt to give up the complicated words and put it forth in simple terms. Afterall, the law wasn't formed for a handful but for the millions of people/ masses of India.
2. As I said before, the approach of law makers towards the usage of statements in law, can be and must be changed. But as I have already said, we may not keep much expectations.
3. NGOs working towards delivering justice to people may make efforts to involve the aggrieved party and make them understand all those laws that may pertain to their state.
4. People themselves can make an effort towards understanding. The matter in law books may be complicated, but with a little patience and determination to learn and understand, it surely becomes an easy task. Of course, this is applicable only to the literate population of our country.
5. For the illiterate, a system demanding transparency of law must be put into place. Although, implementing the system may again take a lot of time.
Another thing just struck my mind. I heard a lot about the Right to Information Act recently implemented but haven't had a chance to research much on it and hence, can't really say much on its relevance. But if it is relevant, I will definitely post soon.
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
hi,
I came across this article by Mr. Dinkar Shukla pertaining to the discussion of "Fast Track Courts", a possible solution to the increasing number of pending cases in the courts. It has been implementing and as of now, the Government has decided to continue with these courts till March 2010. A part of the article, I have taken from the site.
"A novel experiment aimed at clearing the massive backlog in court cases has just begun in the country with the setting up of nearly 450 ‘fast track’ courts in various states. At least one thousand more fast track courts will become functional by the end of June this year. They await the completion of construction of court rooms, selection of judges and provision of necessary infrastructure. A total of 1,734 such courts are being set up at the instance of the Government of India under a wholly centrally-funded scheme. The remaining around 300 such courts are expected to come into existence in the course of the current year.
Fast track courts are meant to expeditiously clear the colossal scale of pendency in the district and subordinate courts under a time-bound programme. A laudable objective of the five-year experimental scheme is to take up on top priority basis sessions and other cases involving undertrials. These cases will be taken up in the first year itself. An estimated 1.80 lakh undertrials are languishing in various jails in the country. A majority of them are behind bars on account of petty or minor offences not warranting prolonged imprisonment. Yet many of them are under lock up in the absence of trial.
The fast track courts are expected to substantially reduce the number of undertrials in jails at the end of the first year. A vast majority of them will be set free, thereby reducing expenditure as well as burden on jails. The State Governments are spending an aggregate of over Rs. 361 crore per annum on the imprisoned undertrials at the rate of Rs. 55 per head per day. Besides saving a bulk of this expenditure, the expeditious disposal of cases relating to undertrials will address a serious human rights problem.
What made the scheme feasible was the outright grant of Rs. 502.90 crore by the Eleventh Finance Commission. The grant has been provided for the creation of 1,734 additional courts specifically for the disposal of pending cases. In doing so the Finance body accepted the recommendation of the Department of Justice, Ministry of Law, and the pleas of State governments. Sharing the concern of the Governments over the pendancy of over two crore cases, the Eleventh Finance Commission had in its report concurred with the view that remedial measures are urgently called for. Apart from the ‘special problem’ grant of Rs. 502.90 crore, the Commission also recommended that nearly ten per cent vacancies of judicial officers in the existing set up be filled forthwith to check further accumulation of cases.
Under the government’s action plan, the fast track courts will take up as their next priority sessions cases pending for two years or more, particularly in which the accused persons have been on bail. According to an official figure, the total number of cases pending in the nearly 13,000 district and subordinate courts in the country is a whopping 2.40 crore (latest estimate). Of these, over 50 lakh criminal and over 25 lakh civil cases are pending for a period ranging from one to three years. These are in addition to over 10 lakh pending sessions cases. The others are more than three years’ old. The 21 High Courts account for over 34 lakh pending cases. Over ten per cent of these are more than ten years’ old.
Judges
The scheme envisages the appointment of ad hoc judges from among retired sessions/additional sessions judges, judges promoted on ad hoc basis and posted in these courts or from among members of the Bar. Selection of judges will be done by the High Courts. The Centre has directed the State Governments that consequential vacancies resulting from ad hoc promotion of judges be filled through a special drive. This is called for in order that further pendency is not created in existing courts of magistrates and civil judges.
As per the Centre’s action plan, the fast track courts will be required to dispose of 14 sessions trial cases and/or 20 to 25 criminal/civil cases every month. The State Governments and High Courts have been requested to make effective arrangement for representation on behalf of the prosecution and to ensure quick process service.
Keeping in view the overall grant of the Finance Commission, a sum of Rs. 29 lakh is earmarked for each additional court. The major portion of the amount is to be spent on salaries of judicial officers and other staff ( a peshkar or superintendent and a peon). This works out to Rs. 4.80 lakh per year or a total of Rs. 24 lakh in five years. The remaining outlay is meant for the construction of court room (Rs. 3.4 lakh) and computer and library facilities (Rs. 1.60 lakh). The annual expenditure on the fast track courts will work out to Rs. 100 crore. The calculation is based on the assumption that while 1,450 fast track courts will become functional by June end most of the remaining will come up in the course of the current year. The States, which are lagging behind their targets, are being persuaded by the Centre to speed up the work.
Attributes
A unique feature of the scheme is that it is going to prove to be cost effective. This is so because the new courts have been charged with the exclusive work of disposing of undertrial cases in the first year of their existence. A large majority of undertrials being those who had been booked for petty/minor offences, they are bound to be discharged forthwith as most of them have been behind bars for periods which are longer than the punishment warranted by the offence. In plain terms, this will mean a huge saving in jail expenditure. As stated earlier, the State Governments are spending an aggregate of Rs. 361 crore annually on the 1.80 lakh undertrials.
Indian jails are, in fact, brimming with prisoners. Against the sanctioned capacity of 2.56 lakh, jails in the country are crowded by more than five lakh inmates. This is resulting in all sorts of complications. Keeping this factor in view the States had together sought from the Eleventh Finance Commission an aggregate of Rs. 3,700 crore upgradation grant to improve facilities and infrastructure relating to jails. The Finance body, however, provided 116 crore for a five-year period. This may be small consolation. But the fact remains that a Finance Commission has for the first time set apart a special grant for upgradation of conditions in jails.
The Finance Commission has hoped that the establishment of additional courts and reforms in laws and procedures would result in substantial reduction, if not elimination, of pending court cases over a period of five years. The Union Law and Justice Minister, Shri Arun Jaitley, recently hinted that the experiment could be extended beyond five years, if necessary. He also hinted that a long-term road map is being charted out by the Government for judicial reforms. With all this, the people will await the time when the wheels of justice will begin to move faster and faster."
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
I came across this article by Mr. Dinkar Shukla pertaining to the discussion of "Fast Track Courts", a possible solution to the increasing number of pending cases in the courts. It has been implementing and as of now, the Government has decided to continue with these courts till March 2010. A part of the article, I have taken from the site.
"A novel experiment aimed at clearing the massive backlog in court cases has just begun in the country with the setting up of nearly 450 ‘fast track’ courts in various states. At least one thousand more fast track courts will become functional by the end of June this year. They await the completion of construction of court rooms, selection of judges and provision of necessary infrastructure. A total of 1,734 such courts are being set up at the instance of the Government of India under a wholly centrally-funded scheme. The remaining around 300 such courts are expected to come into existence in the course of the current year.
Fast track courts are meant to expeditiously clear the colossal scale of pendency in the district and subordinate courts under a time-bound programme. A laudable objective of the five-year experimental scheme is to take up on top priority basis sessions and other cases involving undertrials. These cases will be taken up in the first year itself. An estimated 1.80 lakh undertrials are languishing in various jails in the country. A majority of them are behind bars on account of petty or minor offences not warranting prolonged imprisonment. Yet many of them are under lock up in the absence of trial.
The fast track courts are expected to substantially reduce the number of undertrials in jails at the end of the first year. A vast majority of them will be set free, thereby reducing expenditure as well as burden on jails. The State Governments are spending an aggregate of over Rs. 361 crore per annum on the imprisoned undertrials at the rate of Rs. 55 per head per day. Besides saving a bulk of this expenditure, the expeditious disposal of cases relating to undertrials will address a serious human rights problem.
What made the scheme feasible was the outright grant of Rs. 502.90 crore by the Eleventh Finance Commission. The grant has been provided for the creation of 1,734 additional courts specifically for the disposal of pending cases. In doing so the Finance body accepted the recommendation of the Department of Justice, Ministry of Law, and the pleas of State governments. Sharing the concern of the Governments over the pendancy of over two crore cases, the Eleventh Finance Commission had in its report concurred with the view that remedial measures are urgently called for. Apart from the ‘special problem’ grant of Rs. 502.90 crore, the Commission also recommended that nearly ten per cent vacancies of judicial officers in the existing set up be filled forthwith to check further accumulation of cases.
Under the government’s action plan, the fast track courts will take up as their next priority sessions cases pending for two years or more, particularly in which the accused persons have been on bail. According to an official figure, the total number of cases pending in the nearly 13,000 district and subordinate courts in the country is a whopping 2.40 crore (latest estimate). Of these, over 50 lakh criminal and over 25 lakh civil cases are pending for a period ranging from one to three years. These are in addition to over 10 lakh pending sessions cases. The others are more than three years’ old. The 21 High Courts account for over 34 lakh pending cases. Over ten per cent of these are more than ten years’ old.
Judges
The scheme envisages the appointment of ad hoc judges from among retired sessions/additional sessions judges, judges promoted on ad hoc basis and posted in these courts or from among members of the Bar. Selection of judges will be done by the High Courts. The Centre has directed the State Governments that consequential vacancies resulting from ad hoc promotion of judges be filled through a special drive. This is called for in order that further pendency is not created in existing courts of magistrates and civil judges.
As per the Centre’s action plan, the fast track courts will be required to dispose of 14 sessions trial cases and/or 20 to 25 criminal/civil cases every month. The State Governments and High Courts have been requested to make effective arrangement for representation on behalf of the prosecution and to ensure quick process service.
Keeping in view the overall grant of the Finance Commission, a sum of Rs. 29 lakh is earmarked for each additional court. The major portion of the amount is to be spent on salaries of judicial officers and other staff ( a peshkar or superintendent and a peon). This works out to Rs. 4.80 lakh per year or a total of Rs. 24 lakh in five years. The remaining outlay is meant for the construction of court room (Rs. 3.4 lakh) and computer and library facilities (Rs. 1.60 lakh). The annual expenditure on the fast track courts will work out to Rs. 100 crore. The calculation is based on the assumption that while 1,450 fast track courts will become functional by June end most of the remaining will come up in the course of the current year. The States, which are lagging behind their targets, are being persuaded by the Centre to speed up the work.
Attributes
A unique feature of the scheme is that it is going to prove to be cost effective. This is so because the new courts have been charged with the exclusive work of disposing of undertrial cases in the first year of their existence. A large majority of undertrials being those who had been booked for petty/minor offences, they are bound to be discharged forthwith as most of them have been behind bars for periods which are longer than the punishment warranted by the offence. In plain terms, this will mean a huge saving in jail expenditure. As stated earlier, the State Governments are spending an aggregate of Rs. 361 crore annually on the 1.80 lakh undertrials.
Indian jails are, in fact, brimming with prisoners. Against the sanctioned capacity of 2.56 lakh, jails in the country are crowded by more than five lakh inmates. This is resulting in all sorts of complications. Keeping this factor in view the States had together sought from the Eleventh Finance Commission an aggregate of Rs. 3,700 crore upgradation grant to improve facilities and infrastructure relating to jails. The Finance body, however, provided 116 crore for a five-year period. This may be small consolation. But the fact remains that a Finance Commission has for the first time set apart a special grant for upgradation of conditions in jails.
The Finance Commission has hoped that the establishment of additional courts and reforms in laws and procedures would result in substantial reduction, if not elimination, of pending court cases over a period of five years. The Union Law and Justice Minister, Shri Arun Jaitley, recently hinted that the experiment could be extended beyond five years, if necessary. He also hinted that a long-term road map is being charted out by the Government for judicial reforms. With all this, the people will await the time when the wheels of justice will begin to move faster and faster."
Regards,
Vinisha.
From India,
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