Hi there,
My question for you guys is, can night shift (call center) (male) employees be detained from going out of the campus gate for a break? Will there be any policy where campus gates are locked at night and doesn't allow its employees out? I believe if he is absconding from work, we have to answer/face the music. Under what legal scope can the employer act in an enslaving manner? Is there any law to protect employees from such actions?
Thanks,
Bob
From India, Hyderabad
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My question for you guys is, can night shift (call center) (male) employees be detained from going out of the campus gate for a break? Will there be any policy where campus gates are locked at night and doesn't allow its employees out? I believe if he is absconding from work, we have to answer/face the music. Under what legal scope can the employer act in an enslaving manner? Is there any law to protect employees from such actions?
Thanks,
Bob
From India, Hyderabad
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Simply mention in the appointment letter or in a memo that in case an employee goes out of the office campus in the break time the company is not liable in any manner in case of any mishap.
From India, Delhi
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617From India, Delhi
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The campus can be locked for safety reasons. That way, no unwanted person can enter at night and cause a problem. Regardless of what you write in a memo, the company is responsible for any mishap, even if it occurs outside the campus. The police inquiry itself will disrupt the working environment. The disruption caused by any injury to the concerned person is an additional problem.
From a safety standpoint, if the campus gates are locked, the keys must be available in a public place with easy access in case of an emergency (e.g., fire) if people need to leave quickly. This should be taken into consideration.
Incidentally, being allowed to leave the campus during a shift is not enslavement. No one and nothing forces the employee to come to work, and they may decide not to come the next day.
From India, Mumbai
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From a safety standpoint, if the campus gates are locked, the keys must be available in a public place with easy access in case of an emergency (e.g., fire) if people need to leave quickly. This should be taken into consideration.
Incidentally, being allowed to leave the campus during a shift is not enslavement. No one and nothing forces the employee to come to work, and they may decide not to come the next day.
From India, Mumbai
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Dear Mr. Bob,
The input of the knowledgeable member is absolutely correct. You can leave the campus during the night shift unless it is stated in your code of conduct or standing order as gross misconduct. However, my question is: why would anyone need to leave the campus without the consent of the supervisor?
Regards,
Dinesh
From India, Calcutta
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The input of the knowledgeable member is absolutely correct. You can leave the campus during the night shift unless it is stated in your code of conduct or standing order as gross misconduct. However, my question is: why would anyone need to leave the campus without the consent of the supervisor?
Regards,
Dinesh
From India, Calcutta
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Nothing is wrong with locking gates at night; security considerations are a primary concern. The key should be available for exit in case of fire or injury. It is the management's responsibility to ensure the availability of the key. Locking gates in houses does not equate to a jail or denial of freedom. If a worker leaves their work spot without permission, the supervisor can report and take appropriate action. In my opinion, there is no issue with keeping factory gates locked for basic security purposes. The company can likely arrange for some tea or coffee for employees on night shifts.
From India, Pune
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From India, Pune
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Mr. Bob,
Your question is about the locking of the campus gates to detain the employees from absconding, not for security reasons. By doing so, you would be committing a criminal offense by treating your employees as detainees, captives, and prisoners. You can't do that. Locking gates for security reasons can be understood, but not for detaining employees. Locking employees cannot be used as a substitute for effective supervision by management. It's better to make your supervision and disciplinary system effective rather than resorting to locking employees, which is illegal.
Suppose an employee falls ill or a fire breaks out in the office premises, would the employee or his colleagues wait for the permission of sleeping management executives to unlock the gates to take him to the hospital or to get out of the inferno or smoking environment?
Must not resort to such illegal practice of locking employees.
From India, Delhi
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Your question is about the locking of the campus gates to detain the employees from absconding, not for security reasons. By doing so, you would be committing a criminal offense by treating your employees as detainees, captives, and prisoners. You can't do that. Locking gates for security reasons can be understood, but not for detaining employees. Locking employees cannot be used as a substitute for effective supervision by management. It's better to make your supervision and disciplinary system effective rather than resorting to locking employees, which is illegal.
Suppose an employee falls ill or a fire breaks out in the office premises, would the employee or his colleagues wait for the permission of sleeping management executives to unlock the gates to take him to the hospital or to get out of the inferno or smoking environment?
Must not resort to such illegal practice of locking employees.
From India, Delhi
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Greatly appreciate all your responses. Thanks a lot.
My point goes further beyond locking campus gate for security reasons, which is understandable, that the security personnel wouldn't allow the employees to go out to smoke/have snacks, etc., on the instructions of the campus manager "night time... not allowed." So the question is, can the management force its workers to stay within the premises? The concern reached HR like this, saying you can take action if absconding but can't prevent employees from going out, especially with no prior information about such restrictions.
Please comment.
Thanks!!
From India, Hyderabad
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My point goes further beyond locking campus gate for security reasons, which is understandable, that the security personnel wouldn't allow the employees to go out to smoke/have snacks, etc., on the instructions of the campus manager "night time... not allowed." So the question is, can the management force its workers to stay within the premises? The concern reached HR like this, saying you can take action if absconding but can't prevent employees from going out, especially with no prior information about such restrictions.
Please comment.
Thanks!!
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Bob,
Greatly appreciate all your responses. Thanks a lot.
My point goes further beyond locking campus gate for security reasons, which is understandable. The security personnel wouldn't allow the employees to go out to smoke/have snacks, etc., on the instructions of the campus manager, saying 'night time... not allowed.' So the question is, can the management force its workers to stay within the premises? The concern reached HR in such a way, stating that action can be taken if someone absconds but cannot prevent them from going out, especially with no prior information about such restrictions.
Please comment.
Thanks!!
From India, Delhi
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Greatly appreciate all your responses. Thanks a lot.
My point goes further beyond locking campus gate for security reasons, which is understandable. The security personnel wouldn't allow the employees to go out to smoke/have snacks, etc., on the instructions of the campus manager, saying 'night time... not allowed.' So the question is, can the management force its workers to stay within the premises? The concern reached HR in such a way, stating that action can be taken if someone absconds but cannot prevent them from going out, especially with no prior information about such restrictions.
Please comment.
Thanks!!
From India, Delhi
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I do not know why people don't give full information in the first place instead of making members of the forum run around in circles!
The company is fully within its rights in asking security not to allow anyone out of the premises. That does not make you a slave. You have come to work, not to walk in the garden. The company expects you to put in a full day's (or shift's) work. Allowing the employees to go out for smoke and snacks will result in a massive loss of time and create chaotic work schedules. I am pretty sure that once allowed, people will be taking smoking breaks every hour.
That said, the employees are entitled to breaks once every 5 hours of work. Provision must be made for food/snacks, tea, and coffee at reasonable intervals. You have not stated which state you are in, so you need to read your state shop act for details of the mandatory requirements. However, to the best of my knowledge, all call centers provide a good canteen and coffee/tea machines, so there should be no reason to step out.
From India, Mumbai
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The company is fully within its rights in asking security not to allow anyone out of the premises. That does not make you a slave. You have come to work, not to walk in the garden. The company expects you to put in a full day's (or shift's) work. Allowing the employees to go out for smoke and snacks will result in a massive loss of time and create chaotic work schedules. I am pretty sure that once allowed, people will be taking smoking breaks every hour.
That said, the employees are entitled to breaks once every 5 hours of work. Provision must be made for food/snacks, tea, and coffee at reasonable intervals. You have not stated which state you are in, so you need to read your state shop act for details of the mandatory requirements. However, to the best of my knowledge, all call centers provide a good canteen and coffee/tea machines, so there should be no reason to step out.
From India, Mumbai
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Employees are not animals to be kept inside a compound during working hours. You should have enough break-out space for people. Allow them to mix with each other. As regards smoking, you can dissuade people from smoking through posters. As a responsible employer (if you are!), whether it is day or night shift, provision should be made for snacks, coffee, tea, etc. One cannot function effectively on a hungry stomach. By the way, why do people come to work? To earn their livelihood, eat, and survive... Even machines and equipment require a break. Governments keep making amendments to various acts mainly because of employers who want to run the business with an iron hand. That won't work for long!
Best wishes
From India, Bengaluru
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Best wishes
From India, Bengaluru
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Just install a log-in attendance/performance tracking system on each PC, which will automatically record the actual time spent on the job on a daily basis. This system will help keep track of records and allow for confronting the concerned employees with facts and figures! It's a one-time investment, and many BPOs have already installed the above system!
Regards,
Santosh
From India, Mumbai
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Regards,
Santosh
From India, Mumbai
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Dear Bob,
I do agree with Banerjee. It is important for employee safety. You can publish on the Notice Board that without the Head of Department/Admin/HR in charge, one cannot go out without permission.
As far as smoking is concerned, a separate booth can be provided. No one can challenge if something goes wrong outside the gate as the employer is liable for how one has gone out while on duty. It is safe to avoid management action against the HR Department/Police Action if an individual culprit gets involved under the IPC Act.
A similar incident occurred during the daytime in one of the factories. However, due to the correct procedures and the Security Occurrence book noting, management became safe.
Regards
From India, Mumbai
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I do agree with Banerjee. It is important for employee safety. You can publish on the Notice Board that without the Head of Department/Admin/HR in charge, one cannot go out without permission.
As far as smoking is concerned, a separate booth can be provided. No one can challenge if something goes wrong outside the gate as the employer is liable for how one has gone out while on duty. It is safe to avoid management action against the HR Department/Police Action if an individual culprit gets involved under the IPC Act.
A similar incident occurred during the daytime in one of the factories. However, due to the correct procedures and the Security Occurrence book noting, management became safe.
Regards
From India, Mumbai
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All call enters I know have similar practices. Specially those that are not in the heart of the city
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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Dear Madan Gopalaswamy,
Practice and the legal implications of the practice are two different things. I have already stated that it is acceptable from a security point of view, but not as forced confinement of the employees. The organization has to enforce discipline ethically, which needs to be observed by the employees voluntarily, not by keeping them forcibly confined to a place. If they still tend to break discipline, they should be made subject to penal action as per the conduct and discipline rules prescribed for the employees.
From India, Delhi
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Practice and the legal implications of the practice are two different things. I have already stated that it is acceptable from a security point of view, but not as forced confinement of the employees. The organization has to enforce discipline ethically, which needs to be observed by the employees voluntarily, not by keeping them forcibly confined to a place. If they still tend to break discipline, they should be made subject to penal action as per the conduct and discipline rules prescribed for the employees.
From India, Delhi
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I agree with Mr. Banerjee; most of the service sector establishments that operate 24x7 have a smoking zone and a canteen within the premises. Here, employees can smoke, rest, and eat during their scheduled breaks. In the hotel industry, we provide two breaks of 15 minutes each during the night for light snacks and tea after every 3 hours of work. The employer does not permit smoking breaks, but employees can smoke in the designated smoking zone during their scheduled break.
From India, Ahmadabad
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From India, Ahmadabad
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Hi,
I agree with Dhingra. It is high time employees know their rights and that they are not pet animals to be confined and led around with a thread around the neck, being told where to go for natural calls. Many companies have wrong practices, and because a certain section of society has been made to feel that "because I pay you, you will do what I want," we have not learned enough from Western office culture, attributes, and attitudes, but everything else.
There are many good suggestions on providing amenities, but even having provided those, "no company on this earth can dictate to employees on certain aspects of their life and the way they wish to live." As for employee work and performance, attendance, targets, etc., I feel they must have their own standards to measure, but not at the cost of employee liberty.
Ukmitra
Ukmitra
From Saudi Arabia, Riyadh
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I agree with Dhingra. It is high time employees know their rights and that they are not pet animals to be confined and led around with a thread around the neck, being told where to go for natural calls. Many companies have wrong practices, and because a certain section of society has been made to feel that "because I pay you, you will do what I want," we have not learned enough from Western office culture, attributes, and attitudes, but everything else.
There are many good suggestions on providing amenities, but even having provided those, "no company on this earth can dictate to employees on certain aspects of their life and the way they wish to live." As for employee work and performance, attendance, targets, etc., I feel they must have their own standards to measure, but not at the cost of employee liberty.
Ukmitra
Ukmitra
From Saudi Arabia, Riyadh
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Western culture should be adopted to the extent possible, but the liberty of employees during working hours should not be at the risk of the employer or the employee. God forbid if any mishap happens during the working hours of the said employee, the employer is questioned by the law enforcement team and the family members as well. Keeping that in mind, basic facilities can be provided within the premises where the employee can relieve themselves without leaving the premises.
I know of a factory where employees were sent outside the factory premises during breaks. One employee committed suicide by jumping in front of a running train in an attempt to avail compensation from the factory.
From India, Ahmadabad
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I know of a factory where employees were sent outside the factory premises during breaks. One employee committed suicide by jumping in front of a running train in an attempt to avail compensation from the factory.
From India, Ahmadabad
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Dear Mr. Bob,
Thank you for raising a question. Regardless of the shift time, an employee can relax during their break time if there is a canteen inside the premises or adjacent to their office for a break or for a cup of tea, or for any other reason. However, the eight-hour shift duration is calculated inclusive of break time.
The closure of gates is not directly related to work freedom. For security reasons in the factory/office, it is the management's primary responsibility to make decisions concerning the safety and security of employees and the premises. Any feeling of being a slave or similar thoughts are dismissed.
In coordination with the duty manager, supervisor, or relevant authority, an employee can exit on a permission slip or record their entry and exit in the security gate register. According to the law, the management is accountable for any incidents occurring during the employee's duty period, whether legal or illegal (within or outside the premises). The restriction on such activities is precisely to avoid unnecessary legal implications and to prevent becoming vulnerable to unforeseen events. This policy solely pertains to the safety and security protocols of the management and is not indicative of mistreatment. Ultimately, it is for the welfare of the employees and should be taken in a positive light. Mr. Bannerjee also mentioned that it poses an unnecessary burden on the management in case of any misconduct, a sentiment I agree with. Unwarranted inquiries and actions could disrupt the management's operations.
Typically, factories provide tea and snacks as a welfare measure for the workers.
Jai Hind
Sathish G
From India, Chennai
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Thank you for raising a question. Regardless of the shift time, an employee can relax during their break time if there is a canteen inside the premises or adjacent to their office for a break or for a cup of tea, or for any other reason. However, the eight-hour shift duration is calculated inclusive of break time.
The closure of gates is not directly related to work freedom. For security reasons in the factory/office, it is the management's primary responsibility to make decisions concerning the safety and security of employees and the premises. Any feeling of being a slave or similar thoughts are dismissed.
In coordination with the duty manager, supervisor, or relevant authority, an employee can exit on a permission slip or record their entry and exit in the security gate register. According to the law, the management is accountable for any incidents occurring during the employee's duty period, whether legal or illegal (within or outside the premises). The restriction on such activities is precisely to avoid unnecessary legal implications and to prevent becoming vulnerable to unforeseen events. This policy solely pertains to the safety and security protocols of the management and is not indicative of mistreatment. Ultimately, it is for the welfare of the employees and should be taken in a positive light. Mr. Bannerjee also mentioned that it poses an unnecessary burden on the management in case of any misconduct, a sentiment I agree with. Unwarranted inquiries and actions could disrupt the management's operations.
Typically, factories provide tea and snacks as a welfare measure for the workers.
Jai Hind
Sathish G
From India, Chennai
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Hello Bob,
Any reasons for your silence after so many members have given their suggestions/views?
You mentioned this is a Call Center—BPO.
The usual facilities that every/most BPOs have are what Saswata Banerjee already mentioned.
Is this BPO any different... and if so, in what aspect(s)—meaning no canteen, smoking corner, etc.?
Unless you provide full details, whatever suggestions/advice you receive in this forum is likely to be erroneous or half-baked. Then please don't blame anyone for the fallouts.
Regarding your usage of the terms/words 'enslaved,' 'detained,' 'captives,' etc., forget for a moment that this is a night shift.
Would employees in any company working in day/general shifts have the right to walk out of the office as they please without the boss's permission? I am not referring to a BPO environment here.
The security aspect becomes important if it's a night shift.
Now, add/include the BPO aspect here.
What surprises/baffles me is some members' remarks about the state of affairs in India vis-a-vis Western practices. The BPO environment, by its very nature, requires employees to be present at the desk during the whole shift—that's part of the game. During breaks, someone else substitutes him/her so that the clients in the USA, NA, Europe, etc., don't feel the gaps—sort of seamless operations.
In principle, this is the primary reason for breaks in BPOs to be very planned and systematic, unlike in other software or non-IT companies where there's some flexibility on this count.
As far as I know about the BPO sector, the number of planned/scheduled breaks in a shift in BPOs is higher than in software companies, where the purpose of breaks is different. The coder can continue his/her work even into late nights after a long afternoon, while in a BPO, the employee can't/doesn't have that advantage/facility.
If there are any specific issues/situations that need resolution, the best way is to sit together with the affected employees and figure out solutions/options. Making sweeping statements/generalizations not only doesn't align but could also lead to hardening of stances, potentially causing IR issues.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Any reasons for your silence after so many members have given their suggestions/views?
You mentioned this is a Call Center—BPO.
The usual facilities that every/most BPOs have are what Saswata Banerjee already mentioned.
Is this BPO any different... and if so, in what aspect(s)—meaning no canteen, smoking corner, etc.?
Unless you provide full details, whatever suggestions/advice you receive in this forum is likely to be erroneous or half-baked. Then please don't blame anyone for the fallouts.
Regarding your usage of the terms/words 'enslaved,' 'detained,' 'captives,' etc., forget for a moment that this is a night shift.
Would employees in any company working in day/general shifts have the right to walk out of the office as they please without the boss's permission? I am not referring to a BPO environment here.
The security aspect becomes important if it's a night shift.
Now, add/include the BPO aspect here.
What surprises/baffles me is some members' remarks about the state of affairs in India vis-a-vis Western practices. The BPO environment, by its very nature, requires employees to be present at the desk during the whole shift—that's part of the game. During breaks, someone else substitutes him/her so that the clients in the USA, NA, Europe, etc., don't feel the gaps—sort of seamless operations.
In principle, this is the primary reason for breaks in BPOs to be very planned and systematic, unlike in other software or non-IT companies where there's some flexibility on this count.
As far as I know about the BPO sector, the number of planned/scheduled breaks in a shift in BPOs is higher than in software companies, where the purpose of breaks is different. The coder can continue his/her work even into late nights after a long afternoon, while in a BPO, the employee can't/doesn't have that advantage/facility.
If there are any specific issues/situations that need resolution, the best way is to sit together with the affected employees and figure out solutions/options. Making sweeping statements/generalizations not only doesn't align but could also lead to hardening of stances, potentially causing IR issues.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Thank you all for your insightful information. I was only busy with the ongoing issue in my company hence I was not in active discussion.
I agree with most of you. The tone in my statements was a couple of times undermined. I can understand because you are only reading my experience with a neutral mind, but you can take my words as such unchanged. So coming to more details asked, this is a starter company, a Callcentre with no complete infrastructure yet. For snacks, canteen close by 9pm. There is a coffee machine which doesn't mix sugar and milk properly, etc., to name a few. It has a smoking zone.
To summarize, I believe, as I mentioned "for a break," no employer can say "night time not allowed to go out". As some of the panelists have said, there should be a register to enter in and out timing, a system to record workers' working hours, and a no liability note by the employee at the gate. If such night shift policies exist, they should be informed to all for consent to have an argument from the management side.
Thanks
Regards,
Bob
From India, Hyderabad
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I agree with most of you. The tone in my statements was a couple of times undermined. I can understand because you are only reading my experience with a neutral mind, but you can take my words as such unchanged. So coming to more details asked, this is a starter company, a Callcentre with no complete infrastructure yet. For snacks, canteen close by 9pm. There is a coffee machine which doesn't mix sugar and milk properly, etc., to name a few. It has a smoking zone.
To summarize, I believe, as I mentioned "for a break," no employer can say "night time not allowed to go out". As some of the panelists have said, there should be a register to enter in and out timing, a system to record workers' working hours, and a no liability note by the employee at the gate. If such night shift policies exist, they should be informed to all for consent to have an argument from the management side.
Thanks
Regards,
Bob
From India, Hyderabad
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I agree with Mr. Dhingra.
Surely during day shift or night shift and during the break, it should be permissible for an employee to go out if he wants to and have a fresh tea/coffee/snacks or even for a walk. I do not see management making it compulsory to stay within the confines.
At best, for security reasons, the management can issue an advisory to all its employees, telling them that it is dangerous to go out during nighttime during the breaks. During the shift, it will have to be after following proper procedure.
A S Bhat
From India, Pune
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Surely during day shift or night shift and during the break, it should be permissible for an employee to go out if he wants to and have a fresh tea/coffee/snacks or even for a walk. I do not see management making it compulsory to stay within the confines.
At best, for security reasons, the management can issue an advisory to all its employees, telling them that it is dangerous to go out during nighttime during the breaks. During the shift, it will have to be after following proper procedure.
A S Bhat
From India, Pune
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Factories work amendment for employing female worker in Night shift.pdf