Greetings Seniors,
We are in the process of shortlisting candidates on behalf of our clients, and I have a unique case to present. The candidate is a graduate with over 15 years of experience in the IT industry. He has traveled to numerous countries and worked for top-level MNCs. His experience verification has yielded positive results. However, he has informed us that his original graduation documents have been lost, and he has been unsuccessful in obtaining duplicates from the university. Despite his efforts over the past three years, the university has been unable to locate records dating back 20 years.
Have any of you encountered similar cases before? Would it be advisable for me to recommend his profile to our client?
With Regards, Kamal
From India, Bhubaneswar
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We are in the process of shortlisting candidates on behalf of our clients, and I have a unique case to present. The candidate is a graduate with over 15 years of experience in the IT industry. He has traveled to numerous countries and worked for top-level MNCs. His experience verification has yielded positive results. However, he has informed us that his original graduation documents have been lost, and he has been unsuccessful in obtaining duplicates from the university. Despite his efforts over the past three years, the university has been unable to locate records dating back 20 years.
Have any of you encountered similar cases before? Would it be advisable for me to recommend his profile to our client?
With Regards, Kamal
From India, Bhubaneswar
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As per my advice you can consider this candidate...may be his problem is authentic..but to be in the safe side you can take an acknowledgement letter from him to be safe in future.
From India, Delhi
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From India, Delhi
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I agree with Ravishank... it is impossible for your candidate not to be able to secure copies of his credentials from the University.
I am working with the HR of a University. Diplomas, Transcripts of Records, and Graduation documents are intact regardless of the years. They even keep electronic records of those documents.
Therefore, insist on asking for those credentials; otherwise, don't put your company in jeopardy.
From Philippines, Blumentritt
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I am working with the HR of a University. Diplomas, Transcripts of Records, and Graduation documents are intact regardless of the years. They even keep electronic records of those documents.
Therefore, insist on asking for those credentials; otherwise, don't put your company in jeopardy.
From Philippines, Blumentritt
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I beg to differ.
I did my Post Grad Dip in Management from a Polytechnic (now a university) in the UK in 1970. When I inquired about some details of my qualification in the 1990s, I was told that they did not have the details. I have my certificate and a sheet giving the grade. In those days, there was no Xerox facility. If by chance I had lost my certificates, I would have been in soup.
Have a nice day.
Simhan
A retired academic in the UK
From United Kingdom
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1639I did my Post Grad Dip in Management from a Polytechnic (now a university) in the UK in 1970. When I inquired about some details of my qualification in the 1990s, I was told that they did not have the details. I have my certificate and a sheet giving the grade. In those days, there was no Xerox facility. If by chance I had lost my certificates, I would have been in soup.
Have a nice day.
Simhan
A retired academic in the UK
From United Kingdom
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Simhan is right ... do some inquiry ... if tracing of his achievement and experience is positive, consider him ... there are universities which do not have good standards of record keeping.
From Pakistan, Karachi
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From Pakistan, Karachi
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You may try writing to the university/college to see if they can help you. Another thing you could do is to write to the first couple of companies that he/she worked at and understand if he submitted his degree copy.
From United States, New York
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From United States, New York
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Hi there, you may want to try writing to the university/college to see if they can help you. Another thing you could do is to write to the first couple of companies that he/she worked at and understand if he submitted his degree copy.
One more thing you can do is to ask the candidate to give you the names of fellow students from the college he went to and their contact details. This could also help in verifying whether the candidate actually completed his degree.
From United States, New York
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One more thing you can do is to ask the candidate to give you the names of fellow students from the college he went to and their contact details. This could also help in verifying whether the candidate actually completed his degree.
From United States, New York
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When I joined a Private Sector, having worked about 5 years in Government and 24 years in the Public Sector, they never asked for my degree certificate. Please go ahead and appoint him if he is suited for the job.
- John Samuel
From India, Madras
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- John Samuel
From India, Madras
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Its very simple. Do a reference check in his previous companies(Right from the first company he joined as fresher). You will surely get to know whether its fact or fake.
From India, Madras
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From India, Madras
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Dear Friend,
Endorsing the aforementioned views, I suggest having an affidavit from the candidate stating the reason for losing the certificate and the proposed action to be taken if the stated reason is incorrect.
Regards
From India, Vadodara
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Endorsing the aforementioned views, I suggest having an affidavit from the candidate stating the reason for losing the certificate and the proposed action to be taken if the stated reason is incorrect.
Regards
From India, Vadodara
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Dear Kamal,
What is more valuable to you, his one-page certificate or his 15+ years of rich experience and knowledge? As you mentioned, he has worked with top-level MNCs. If you verified that, then it's okay, dear.
From India, Kashipur
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What is more valuable to you, his one-page certificate or his 15+ years of rich experience and knowledge? As you mentioned, he has worked with top-level MNCs. If you verified that, then it's okay, dear.
From India, Kashipur
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You need to first carry out his background verification, which is inclusive of his education, employment, references, etc. Besides this, ask him to submit to your company an Affidavit stating that his educational qualification is so and so, but he is unable to produce the originals for whatever reasons. Also, the clause that he is liable for action against him if the information furnished by him is found to be incorrect should be included in the affidavit.
Also, you can ask him to submit the photocopies, at least (preferably attested copies), of his educational credentials.
From India, Mumbai
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Also, you can ask him to submit the photocopies, at least (preferably attested copies), of his educational credentials.
From India, Mumbai
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Dear Kamal,
The best thing you could do is let your client decide whether they want this kind of person. As such, you are not going to decide whether to appoint him or not, right? Explain this case in detail to the client and let them decide.
Sandeep Kulkarni
From India, Vadodara
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The best thing you could do is let your client decide whether they want this kind of person. As such, you are not going to decide whether to appoint him or not, right? Explain this case in detail to the client and let them decide.
Sandeep Kulkarni
From India, Vadodara
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You may try writing to the university/college to see if they can help you. Another thing you could do is to write to the first couple of companies that he/she worked at and understand if he submitted his degree copy. After that, you can decide whether it is true or false.
J. Ramakrishna Manager - HR & IR Lakshmi Precision Tools Ltd Coimbatore Tamil Nadu
From India, Coimbatore
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J. Ramakrishna Manager - HR & IR Lakshmi Precision Tools Ltd Coimbatore Tamil Nadu
From India, Coimbatore
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So irresponsible the candidate is! Don't take the risk of putting him on board anywhere. The universities always maintain archives out of which a duplicate could well be collected on application. The statement of the individual appears to be totally dubious.
Regards
From India, Pondicherry
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Regards
From India, Pondicherry
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Hi,
Evaluate the merit first. As such, the qualifications that are being verified are no longer relevant, particularly in the IT industry.
We all know how certificates are fabricated in some parts of our country. The other day, overnight, in Australia, a University closed down, leaving many Indian students in lurch.
As true professionals, our job is to find the right fit between capability and the tasks ahead.
We are in a knowledge-based society now, where being well-informed is not enough. There is a reason to validate records, but it need not be stultifying.
Apart from the actual records, many other issues can be easily verified. If we have the capability to evaluate merit, we will go beyond incidentals, I am sure.
It is true that not all universities maintain records properly. Besides, it speaks something about the candidate as to how he maintains his learning recognitions.
Having said that, we still have the task of finding the right fit between true capability and the task to be performed, with or without certificates.
Sanjiv Bosamia
From India, Pune
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Evaluate the merit first. As such, the qualifications that are being verified are no longer relevant, particularly in the IT industry.
We all know how certificates are fabricated in some parts of our country. The other day, overnight, in Australia, a University closed down, leaving many Indian students in lurch.
As true professionals, our job is to find the right fit between capability and the tasks ahead.
We are in a knowledge-based society now, where being well-informed is not enough. There is a reason to validate records, but it need not be stultifying.
Apart from the actual records, many other issues can be easily verified. If we have the capability to evaluate merit, we will go beyond incidentals, I am sure.
It is true that not all universities maintain records properly. Besides, it speaks something about the candidate as to how he maintains his learning recognitions.
Having said that, we still have the task of finding the right fit between true capability and the task to be performed, with or without certificates.
Sanjiv Bosamia
From India, Pune
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Hi Kamal,
I have looked at the problem from a different angle. Whether he is lying or telling the truth is very difficult to judge. The basic point is that you have liked the candidate, and he must have produced documents to you in support of his work experience in senior positions with MNCs both in India and abroad. Other companies that had given him appointments must have checked his testimonials, and only then did he get the opportunity to work in those companies. It is impossible that he has outwitted all those companies with a bluff.
For your safety, you can ask the person to submit to you an affidavit from a first-class Judicial Magistrate stating that the statement in connection with his educational qualification is correct and that he is unable to submit any proof as he has lost all the originals. This should be signed by both the candidate and two of his friends or relatives.
From India, Calcutta
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I have looked at the problem from a different angle. Whether he is lying or telling the truth is very difficult to judge. The basic point is that you have liked the candidate, and he must have produced documents to you in support of his work experience in senior positions with MNCs both in India and abroad. Other companies that had given him appointments must have checked his testimonials, and only then did he get the opportunity to work in those companies. It is impossible that he has outwitted all those companies with a bluff.
For your safety, you can ask the person to submit to you an affidavit from a first-class Judicial Magistrate stating that the statement in connection with his educational qualification is correct and that he is unable to submit any proof as he has lost all the originals. This should be signed by both the candidate and two of his friends or relatives.
From India, Calcutta
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Hi,
Anybody can get a duplicate copy of a certificate from the University. Whether it's been 20 years or 25 years, they can definitely obtain it. The University will issue the duplicate certificate, and they must maintain the records perfectly.
As per his resume, you may verify with his past companies, and a detailed interview would be a better choice. He knows very well that certificates are a must.
Mano Kavin
From India, Coimbatore
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Anybody can get a duplicate copy of a certificate from the University. Whether it's been 20 years or 25 years, they can definitely obtain it. The University will issue the duplicate certificate, and they must maintain the records perfectly.
As per his resume, you may verify with his past companies, and a detailed interview would be a better choice. He knows very well that certificates are a must.
Mano Kavin
From India, Coimbatore
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Surely, he can get copies of certificates from his earliest companies duly attested by them or has he said the same story therealso
From India, Bangalore
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From India, Bangalore
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Completely agree. I think your time is better spent verifying the candidate's experience and work history as that carries much more weight in the practical workplace. Competence and the right fit are more relevant than a 15-year-old degree.
From Hong Kong, Central District
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From Hong Kong, Central District
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Hi Kamal,
I would like to look at this problem from a different angle. Whether he is lying or telling the truth is very difficult to judge by yourself, but a lie will not withstand for a long time. With the lie, he cannot work with his past employer. As you feel he has the experience, there is no need for him to create such. To verify, you may ask for the police report of the certificate lost, a copy of the application to the University for the New Certificate may be with university stamping, or you can just refer to his previous employer. If you feel he is suitable for your client, let your client decide whether they want him or not. All of this is just to avoid putting yourself in trouble.
On the other hand, after fifteen years of experience, with trips to a few countries for a job, expertise in your client's required field, the certificates play no role. Think practically; your search and stance will be based on just paper or for the right people.
If you are going to employ someone based just on papers, you know it is not tough to create fake certificates. If he does so, can he get this job or what?
Experts/law followers, excuse me for my opinion.
I feel practical experience is key.
James.
From Qatar, Doha
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I would like to look at this problem from a different angle. Whether he is lying or telling the truth is very difficult to judge by yourself, but a lie will not withstand for a long time. With the lie, he cannot work with his past employer. As you feel he has the experience, there is no need for him to create such. To verify, you may ask for the police report of the certificate lost, a copy of the application to the University for the New Certificate may be with university stamping, or you can just refer to his previous employer. If you feel he is suitable for your client, let your client decide whether they want him or not. All of this is just to avoid putting yourself in trouble.
On the other hand, after fifteen years of experience, with trips to a few countries for a job, expertise in your client's required field, the certificates play no role. Think practically; your search and stance will be based on just paper or for the right people.
If you are going to employ someone based just on papers, you know it is not tough to create fake certificates. If he does so, can he get this job or what?
Experts/law followers, excuse me for my opinion.
I feel practical experience is key.
James.
From Qatar, Doha
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Whenever you are shortlisting candidates for your clients, you should be ethical and transparent. If a candidate is unable to produce their graduation certificate, please obtain full details from them regarding the year of passing, name of the institution, and whether they had submitted the certificate to any of their previous employers. Obtain a few references from the candidate, especially from their classmates in graduation and their seniors. Inquire with their institutions and references to confirm that they have indeed qualified in the graduation examination. Additionally, you may obtain an affidavit from the candidate certifying that they have passed the graduation examination. It is possible that they might have lost their certificates, but this should not count against them if they are otherwise suitable for the job. You can recommend their case if they are otherwise suitable for the post and you are reasonably sure that they possess the required qualifications.
P. DHAR
From India, Mumbai
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P. DHAR
From India, Mumbai
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Dear Kamal,
You say the candidate is suitable in all aspects. When did he lose his certificates? One suggestion is getting the graduation check with his first/early employers - there is a likelihood that he would have submitted a set of copies. Also, as you have done an experience check, some of the past employers would have collected some copies of his academic accomplishments. Again, I assume he would have some postgraduate qualifications - does he have any record of these? MNCs normally do not employ without a background check of graduation records, etc.
After you complete this exercise, you could place all the facts before the client and leave the final decision to them (Concerned persons in the client company). Hope I have been of some help in your dilemma.
Regards,
H Prasad
Senior Trainer & Consultant
From India, Delhi
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You say the candidate is suitable in all aspects. When did he lose his certificates? One suggestion is getting the graduation check with his first/early employers - there is a likelihood that he would have submitted a set of copies. Also, as you have done an experience check, some of the past employers would have collected some copies of his academic accomplishments. Again, I assume he would have some postgraduate qualifications - does he have any record of these? MNCs normally do not employ without a background check of graduation records, etc.
After you complete this exercise, you could place all the facts before the client and leave the final decision to them (Concerned persons in the client company). Hope I have been of some help in your dilemma.
Regards,
H Prasad
Senior Trainer & Consultant
From India, Delhi
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Hi,You client will have some thing like probation period, Let work speak.At time trust on others work.
From India, Calcutta
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From India, Calcutta
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I feel you should talk to the candidate and ask him for his college details from where he appeared for his graduation exams. Any university in India provides a duplicate copy of the mark sheet, and it can be procured easily. My personal recommendation will be not to consider the candidate without proper certificates.
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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I believe it would be unfair to deny him a job simply because he is unable to present his certificates. In this scenario, the Right to Natural Justice should take precedence. Instead, he could request a letter from the university stating that they are unable to locate his documents and therefore cannot provide them. Alternatively, he may seek some form of a No Objection Certificate (NOC) that would not only establish his innocence but also serve the intended purpose effectively.
From United Kingdom
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From United Kingdom
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