Hi,
HR Professional are tuned over the period of time in our practise and apprach towards our task.( Thats why we prefer the HR from the same Industries in most cases)
Manpower Mapping
Job Analysis, Description
Setting of KPI, KRA,
Performance Appraisal
I do agree with the above answers given by the members However i would like to add that the MP,JA,KPI,KRI are inter related and can not be valued seperately.
When we go for recruiting a person for a particular dept esp for technical grade we always consult the Department head to justify a new requirement and the Job discription from them and the duties to be performed by the NEW recruite and in the PROCESS OF Several stages of interview these are screened and if found satisfactory then we board him in.........So i beleive it all starts from there....based on these and additional duties we entrust with them will be the part of his KRA and KPI.....Performance appraisal and so on......And it certainly helps the HR to carry on his further jobs like.We develope the following according to the company or organisational policies and procedures ...
Manpower Mapping
Job Analysis, Description
Setting of KPI, KRA,
Performance Appraisal
Regards,
Benance
From United Arab Emirates, Abu Dhabi
HR Professional are tuned over the period of time in our practise and apprach towards our task.( Thats why we prefer the HR from the same Industries in most cases)
Manpower Mapping
Job Analysis, Description
Setting of KPI, KRA,
Performance Appraisal
I do agree with the above answers given by the members However i would like to add that the MP,JA,KPI,KRI are inter related and can not be valued seperately.
When we go for recruiting a person for a particular dept esp for technical grade we always consult the Department head to justify a new requirement and the Job discription from them and the duties to be performed by the NEW recruite and in the PROCESS OF Several stages of interview these are screened and if found satisfactory then we board him in.........So i beleive it all starts from there....based on these and additional duties we entrust with them will be the part of his KRA and KPI.....Performance appraisal and so on......And it certainly helps the HR to carry on his further jobs like.We develope the following according to the company or organisational policies and procedures ...
Manpower Mapping
Job Analysis, Description
Setting of KPI, KRA,
Performance Appraisal
Regards,
Benance
From United Arab Emirates, Abu Dhabi
Hi
What a Hr does actually, he/she have some specific knowledge but litlle bit of each field that is introductry.
if u talk about interview then there are various rounds like aptitude, gd technical and HR.
U ask about technical knowledge of HR personnel, but as far as concern to recruitment in technical round there are technician who checks the knowledge of the candidate and in HR round they count your soft skills like your communication skill your attitude your behaviour etc.
But if u r asking bout planning phase for recruitment then there is involvement of department heads and they match the qualification and skill according to job.
For any further information and fast reply you can mail me at
From India, Delhi
What a Hr does actually, he/she have some specific knowledge but litlle bit of each field that is introductry.
if u talk about interview then there are various rounds like aptitude, gd technical and HR.
U ask about technical knowledge of HR personnel, but as far as concern to recruitment in technical round there are technician who checks the knowledge of the candidate and in HR round they count your soft skills like your communication skill your attitude your behaviour etc.
But if u r asking bout planning phase for recruitment then there is involvement of department heads and they match the qualification and skill according to job.
For any further information and fast reply you can mail me at
From India, Delhi
Hi there,
First thing first, nothing is impossible.
Well, when u knows the profile very well, then I don’t think so it’s very difficult for you to do these things. You are very right to certain extend that, how can HR do all these things alone. HR is lonely sole in the office but HR person is one man army for all. Irrespective of him to be in team, he is moderator of all the departments. All these function required the Decision making skills, which HR have to do all the way.
For all this, you definitely need the help of the head of the respective departments. Like for the recruitment HR person don’t take the Technical round, it just take the HR round of evaluation. Same as this.
• Manpower Mapping
Like for Man Power Mapping, you must have the MIS report ready for all the months. Your Organization structure should be so strong that Team Leader, should have Task base week and they should know where they are lacking in the resources. But you are the end responsible in organizing everything and tracing it for the present requirement and future. And then to take further action on it like allocation of resources, recruitments and all.
• Job Analysis, Description
• Setting of KPI, KRA,
• Performance Appraisal
These all tasks are Team Task, that u have to play with all other members.
And more when u added” For eg. For preparing job description, it just takes the qualifications, from DEPT HEAD,, because a dept head knows more than HR whether a Diploma candidate would be suitable or a Degree or PG .... then so it collects the data compiles it and documents it... “
You are the end responsible for the entire task, but its doesn’t mean that u are only piling the papers on the desk. Sometime it is this piling paper and sometime is more then any profile.
Creating leader in the organization, making future planning on the base on that pile of papers, insuring the middle level management is strong enough to take lead, right induction and training to new joining.
I hope, I have done justice to your question. :?:
Regards,
Hetal Shah
From India, Calcutta
2First thing first, nothing is impossible.
Well, when u knows the profile very well, then I don’t think so it’s very difficult for you to do these things. You are very right to certain extend that, how can HR do all these things alone. HR is lonely sole in the office but HR person is one man army for all. Irrespective of him to be in team, he is moderator of all the departments. All these function required the Decision making skills, which HR have to do all the way.
For all this, you definitely need the help of the head of the respective departments. Like for the recruitment HR person don’t take the Technical round, it just take the HR round of evaluation. Same as this.
• Manpower Mapping
Like for Man Power Mapping, you must have the MIS report ready for all the months. Your Organization structure should be so strong that Team Leader, should have Task base week and they should know where they are lacking in the resources. But you are the end responsible in organizing everything and tracing it for the present requirement and future. And then to take further action on it like allocation of resources, recruitments and all.
• Job Analysis, Description
• Setting of KPI, KRA,
• Performance Appraisal
These all tasks are Team Task, that u have to play with all other members.
And more when u added” For eg. For preparing job description, it just takes the qualifications, from DEPT HEAD,, because a dept head knows more than HR whether a Diploma candidate would be suitable or a Degree or PG .... then so it collects the data compiles it and documents it... “
You are the end responsible for the entire task, but its doesn’t mean that u are only piling the papers on the desk. Sometime it is this piling paper and sometime is more then any profile.
Creating leader in the organization, making future planning on the base on that pile of papers, insuring the middle level management is strong enough to take lead, right induction and training to new joining.
I hope, I have done justice to your question. :?:
Regards,
Hetal Shah
From India, Calcutta
Hi Ravi
I must say that you have put forward a very interesting topic .I would like to add my cooments on the same .I would just like to add that an HR person usually speacializes in a particular field before he gets into core HR functions like recruitment performance appraisal Job analysis etc like for eg to find a java designer you need not know how to do coding in Java but you must be aware that they work on technologies like swing core java etc to design projects(seniors in the IT field ,please correct me if I am wrong.Now lets come to the job description part once you know what are the technologies the incumbent should be aware of you can simply put his roles and responsiblities as
1.Should be able to design a project in Java single handedly
2 Should be able to deliver a project on time
3 Should be able to answer the queries of the junior members of the team ....etc
Job specification
Should have 5-7 yrs of experience
Should have experience working with core java and swing for at least 2-3 yrs
Should have knowledge about MVC framework
Should be a BE/B.Tech/MCA etc
Above I have cited just a small example, it is not an exhaustive one though .
With the passage of time you will get to know that which technologies are required for which job role like in case you are looking for a web developer you will look for someone who has worked on PHP ,.net or java .This is one way of learning the technical aspects .Another way of learning the technical aspects is to sit with the senior technical members for some time and try to get inputs from them .The techies are usually very busy the whole day, so if you really wish to olearn then you have to be very polite with them
Now lets come to the performance appraisal part .As one of the members of this site has rightly pointed out competency mapping is the best way toi find out the technical as well as behavioral attributes against which you can rate a prticular employee.I have done an entire project on the same but Iam unable to give you all the details right now.I did the project in an engineering industry and faced a similar problem like yours as I was not aware about the technical aspects of the job .If you want I will send a copy of that project report to your personal id
I hope this my post helps in clearing your doubts. You cal also write to me
Thanks and Regards
Indrani Chakraborty
From India, Pune
I must say that you have put forward a very interesting topic .I would like to add my cooments on the same .I would just like to add that an HR person usually speacializes in a particular field before he gets into core HR functions like recruitment performance appraisal Job analysis etc like for eg to find a java designer you need not know how to do coding in Java but you must be aware that they work on technologies like swing core java etc to design projects(seniors in the IT field ,please correct me if I am wrong.Now lets come to the job description part once you know what are the technologies the incumbent should be aware of you can simply put his roles and responsiblities as
1.Should be able to design a project in Java single handedly
2 Should be able to deliver a project on time
3 Should be able to answer the queries of the junior members of the team ....etc
Job specification
Should have 5-7 yrs of experience
Should have experience working with core java and swing for at least 2-3 yrs
Should have knowledge about MVC framework
Should be a BE/B.Tech/MCA etc
Above I have cited just a small example, it is not an exhaustive one though .
With the passage of time you will get to know that which technologies are required for which job role like in case you are looking for a web developer you will look for someone who has worked on PHP ,.net or java .This is one way of learning the technical aspects .Another way of learning the technical aspects is to sit with the senior technical members for some time and try to get inputs from them .The techies are usually very busy the whole day, so if you really wish to olearn then you have to be very polite with them
Now lets come to the performance appraisal part .As one of the members of this site has rightly pointed out competency mapping is the best way toi find out the technical as well as behavioral attributes against which you can rate a prticular employee.I have done an entire project on the same but Iam unable to give you all the details right now.I did the project in an engineering industry and faced a similar problem like yours as I was not aware about the technical aspects of the job .If you want I will send a copy of that project report to your personal id
I hope this my post helps in clearing your doubts. You cal also write to me
Thanks and Regards
Indrani Chakraborty
From India, Pune
Hi ,
I understand your situation. I have done my Bcom and then MBA(HR) from a Bschool. To tell you frnkly i dont know even the basics of computer. But i was recruited by a com where Labview was used for their business(LABview is the most advanced software)
But i learnt evrything from the dept heads. i use to learn from them during my lunch hours and sit with them in late hours. Now i am very comfortable.
So this is how we have to manage.Every thing can be learned. So you to talk with the experts of that domain. HR cant learn be an expert but he is the only person in com to co-ordinate all the experts. There lies the difference and advnatages which other managers dont have.
hope this will help you out.
Thanks
Gayathiri
From India, Madras
I understand your situation. I have done my Bcom and then MBA(HR) from a Bschool. To tell you frnkly i dont know even the basics of computer. But i was recruited by a com where Labview was used for their business(LABview is the most advanced software)
But i learnt evrything from the dept heads. i use to learn from them during my lunch hours and sit with them in late hours. Now i am very comfortable.
So this is how we have to manage.Every thing can be learned. So you to talk with the experts of that domain. HR cant learn be an expert but he is the only person in com to co-ordinate all the experts. There lies the difference and advnatages which other managers dont have.
hope this will help you out.
Thanks
Gayathiri
From India, Madras
Dear Ravi,
It is a interesting question and i think you have got the answer by now. I would like to relate your question to recruitment also where in when you take a interview of any candidate you will for sure ask him atleast one or two technical question. So i feel which ever company we work i mean field we will have a little knowledge for sure which will help us analyse certain things, but again without the help of technical people we wont be able to make decisions. As quoted by some of other friends it is true that we can learn certain things by experience which will make us to learn certain technical things.
Similarly when it comes to KRA,KRI, man power planning and various other things we will be the one to start and end the process but we wont be making any decisions with out the help of technical people. Hope i am right and it is little more clear to you.
Regards
Amith R.
From India, Bangalore
It is a interesting question and i think you have got the answer by now. I would like to relate your question to recruitment also where in when you take a interview of any candidate you will for sure ask him atleast one or two technical question. So i feel which ever company we work i mean field we will have a little knowledge for sure which will help us analyse certain things, but again without the help of technical people we wont be able to make decisions. As quoted by some of other friends it is true that we can learn certain things by experience which will make us to learn certain technical things.
Similarly when it comes to KRA,KRI, man power planning and various other things we will be the one to start and end the process but we wont be making any decisions with out the help of technical people. Hope i am right and it is little more clear to you.
Regards
Amith R.
From India, Bangalore
Hello dear Ravi….
If some of our friends believe that they will have to hire technical person with MBA then for every technical area you will have to hire separate HR person. For example if you talk about engineering field then here you require engineer + MBA(HR), for finance you need finance person with MBA(HR) and so on…..
So this is not the way to HR. I believe that HR is a part of establishment who knows all the workings of the organization, its business and its requirements whereas the knowledge of all these areas and understanding of all these processes will come to you gradually with the passage of time. You can’t master all these areas at once. People have passed whole of their live while designing and giving you and me all these concepts of HR.
At least 1-2 years are required to understand and get somewhat command on these areas so work hard and try to learn and develop these in coordination with departments and your seniors.
Even you get command on all these areas; still you can’t implement these yourself. HR’s job is to integrate and bring all other departments at a single platform of HR. so do anything with their acceptance and will otherwise after putting so much efforts, you will again face difficulties.
So Coordination and working together with departments is the best way to design newer systems and implement them as well it will open you way towards learning all these concepts and technical knowledge.
Regards
Khalid
From Pakistan, Lahore
If some of our friends believe that they will have to hire technical person with MBA then for every technical area you will have to hire separate HR person. For example if you talk about engineering field then here you require engineer + MBA(HR), for finance you need finance person with MBA(HR) and so on…..
So this is not the way to HR. I believe that HR is a part of establishment who knows all the workings of the organization, its business and its requirements whereas the knowledge of all these areas and understanding of all these processes will come to you gradually with the passage of time. You can’t master all these areas at once. People have passed whole of their live while designing and giving you and me all these concepts of HR.
At least 1-2 years are required to understand and get somewhat command on these areas so work hard and try to learn and develop these in coordination with departments and your seniors.
Even you get command on all these areas; still you can’t implement these yourself. HR’s job is to integrate and bring all other departments at a single platform of HR. so do anything with their acceptance and will otherwise after putting so much efforts, you will again face difficulties.
So Coordination and working together with departments is the best way to design newer systems and implement them as well it will open you way towards learning all these concepts and technical knowledge.
Regards
Khalid
From Pakistan, Lahore
Here the things that HR person can do to solve your problem:
Strategic Analysis of Business
Building Rapport is most important
Then make the Finding (Plans, Policies, Procedures, Resources, etc) from which you will know what are the things that you need to do
When you have all the details and have relationship with necessary personnel then you can do manpower mapping with the help of other key member is your organization
For Job Analysis and Description: If it is the old job that you can just see that the person in that job is doing, ask to his supervisors for comment and find out how it can be done in better way. Then you can make good job analysis and description which is strategically aligned with the business plan.
For Performance Appraisal: I think you can divide the portion in three parts. One which is job specific to be filled by the respective line manager and another which is Behavioral, attitude and communication you can do it by yourself and another make the employee do it self appraisal. In this way you can find out that the employee things and what the supervisor things and then make suggestions and comments.
I hope this will solve your problem. But I think you need to post separate question for each section. You have asked so many questions at once so I think many of us are confused what you are really asking. So be more specific.
Thanks you.
Samir
Strategic Analysis of Business
Building Rapport is most important
Then make the Finding (Plans, Policies, Procedures, Resources, etc) from which you will know what are the things that you need to do
When you have all the details and have relationship with necessary personnel then you can do manpower mapping with the help of other key member is your organization
For Job Analysis and Description: If it is the old job that you can just see that the person in that job is doing, ask to his supervisors for comment and find out how it can be done in better way. Then you can make good job analysis and description which is strategically aligned with the business plan.
For Performance Appraisal: I think you can divide the portion in three parts. One which is job specific to be filled by the respective line manager and another which is Behavioral, attitude and communication you can do it by yourself and another make the employee do it self appraisal. In this way you can find out that the employee things and what the supervisor things and then make suggestions and comments.
I hope this will solve your problem. But I think you need to post separate question for each section. You have asked so many questions at once so I think many of us are confused what you are really asking. So be more specific.
Thanks you.
Samir
hi...
c... from all the above views.... I will give my opinion in simple terms....
first step.... collect checklist of all the works and functions done by the departments. individually....
second step.... when checklist comes.. split them and allot jobs to the concerned person based on qualification, experience, competency
Third step... then design their skills, responsibilties, duties based on the above parameters(second step)...
Fourth Step.... after designing responbilties..etc.... put some indicators to analyse and then review frequently....
but remember one thing.... before doing all this.....YOU SHOULD KNOW ALL THE DEPARTMENTS FUNCTIONS N THEN START THE HR WORK...
MASTER IN ONE BUT SHOULD BE JACK OF ALL .
by this no line man or no shop level can bluff you.....
cheers
Srikanth
From India, Bharat
c... from all the above views.... I will give my opinion in simple terms....
first step.... collect checklist of all the works and functions done by the departments. individually....
second step.... when checklist comes.. split them and allot jobs to the concerned person based on qualification, experience, competency
Third step... then design their skills, responsibilties, duties based on the above parameters(second step)...
Fourth Step.... after designing responbilties..etc.... put some indicators to analyse and then review frequently....
but remember one thing.... before doing all this.....YOU SHOULD KNOW ALL THE DEPARTMENTS FUNCTIONS N THEN START THE HR WORK...
MASTER IN ONE BUT SHOULD BE JACK OF ALL .
by this no line man or no shop level can bluff you.....
cheers
Srikanth
From India, Bharat
Hi Ravi,
your query is absolutely valid.
One thing you must note about HR and that is ,HR can not work in isolation like other departments.It has to work in co ordination with all departments of the organization.
HR person is expected to know the HR processes like Manpower planning,
Job Analysis, Job Description, Setting of KPI, KRA, Performance Appraisal etc.,which is not expected from proffessionals from other departments.
For all HR processes HR person requires data.And that data he/she collects from various departments.this way HR person's responsibility to use that data in meaningfull way.The data provided is by various experts would be very raw data.It is HR's duty to analyse it and make use out of it,which is not possible for even those people from where you have got it..!
This way HR can view the organization from focul point,which other departments can't.
Regards,
Archana
From India, Pune
your query is absolutely valid.
One thing you must note about HR and that is ,HR can not work in isolation like other departments.It has to work in co ordination with all departments of the organization.
HR person is expected to know the HR processes like Manpower planning,
Job Analysis, Job Description, Setting of KPI, KRA, Performance Appraisal etc.,which is not expected from proffessionals from other departments.
For all HR processes HR person requires data.And that data he/she collects from various departments.this way HR person's responsibility to use that data in meaningfull way.The data provided is by various experts would be very raw data.It is HR's duty to analyse it and make use out of it,which is not possible for even those people from where you have got it..!
This way HR can view the organization from focul point,which other departments can't.
Regards,
Archana
From India, Pune
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