Since August 2011,I was working with limited pharmaceutical company as confirmed medical representative and about one year later my division was taken by my new employer ( which is a public limited group company of France and MNC) on July 2012 and no new appointment letter till date (I.e August 2014) is issued by new employer but given only a welcome letter signed by MD in Xerox form. Now my company while giving yearly increment(which also last year got without signing any "Terms and conditions" letter), attached another paper named as "Terms and conditions" and telling to sing and return it to them otherwise increment will not be given. This paper contains" appointment letter" like terms and conditions. While asking to the HR department, they are telling " though there is no terms and conditions to get increment but you hv to signed the attached paper which contains those term and conditions otherwise the increment which in arrears from Jan 2014 will not be given" and also telling that "company forgot to take this signed during takeover period so now they are doing this", and while asking for appointment letter they replied that "previous company's appointment letter and that Xerox welcome letter is enough to prove me employee of this company, no need to issue separate appointment letter." **(new employer issuing its appointment letter to those who joined after that 'take over')
My questions- 1) should company issue new appointment letter to me or not?
2) should I sign this "terms and conditions" letter to get increment?
3) is the old appointment letter and welcome letter is enough?
4) can my company take any legal steps against me for not signing and terminate me?
Thanks in advance.
From India, Kolkata
My questions- 1) should company issue new appointment letter to me or not?
2) should I sign this "terms and conditions" letter to get increment?
3) is the old appointment letter and welcome letter is enough?
4) can my company take any legal steps against me for not signing and terminate me?
Thanks in advance.
From India, Kolkata
HAI SAHIL,
1) should company issue new appointment letter to me or not?
IN ANY ACT THRERE IS NO FIXED FORMAT FOR APPOINTMENT LETTER AND NOT MENTIONED IN ANY ACT TO ISSUE THE SAME TO THE EMPLOYEES. SO THINK AS IS IT SO NECESSARY TO CONTINUE IN THE NEW COMPANY OR IN POST.
2) should I sign this "terms and conditions" letter to get increment?
TERMS AND CONDITIONS ARE NECESSARY BETWEEN EMPLOYEE AND EMPLOYER, IF SITUATION DEMANDS EMPLOYEE SHOULD ABIDE THE WRITTEN TERMS AND CONDITIONS. THERE IS NO HARM TO SIGN WHETHER IT IS IN LETTER FORM OR AGREEMENT TO GET FURTHER BENEFITS.
3) is the old appointment letter and welcome letter is enough?
ANY DATED LETTER IS ENOUGH FOR EMPLOYERS TO ALLOW THE EMPLOYEE IN HIS ORGANISATION.
4) can my company take any legal steps against me for not signing and terminate me?
IT IS DEPENDS UPON UR LUCK FOR NOT SIGNING AS DESIRED BY AGAINST THE WILL OF EMPLOYER.
FOR SMOOTH RELATIONS ONE SHOULD SHOW LOYALTY TO THE ORGANISATION. IT SAVE THE EMPLOYEE FORM ALL TYPES OF HURDLES.
From India, Visakhapatnam
471) should company issue new appointment letter to me or not?
IN ANY ACT THRERE IS NO FIXED FORMAT FOR APPOINTMENT LETTER AND NOT MENTIONED IN ANY ACT TO ISSUE THE SAME TO THE EMPLOYEES. SO THINK AS IS IT SO NECESSARY TO CONTINUE IN THE NEW COMPANY OR IN POST.
2) should I sign this "terms and conditions" letter to get increment?
TERMS AND CONDITIONS ARE NECESSARY BETWEEN EMPLOYEE AND EMPLOYER, IF SITUATION DEMANDS EMPLOYEE SHOULD ABIDE THE WRITTEN TERMS AND CONDITIONS. THERE IS NO HARM TO SIGN WHETHER IT IS IN LETTER FORM OR AGREEMENT TO GET FURTHER BENEFITS.
3) is the old appointment letter and welcome letter is enough?
ANY DATED LETTER IS ENOUGH FOR EMPLOYERS TO ALLOW THE EMPLOYEE IN HIS ORGANISATION.
4) can my company take any legal steps against me for not signing and terminate me?
IT IS DEPENDS UPON UR LUCK FOR NOT SIGNING AS DESIRED BY AGAINST THE WILL OF EMPLOYER.
FOR SMOOTH RELATIONS ONE SHOULD SHOW LOYALTY TO THE ORGANISATION. IT SAVE THE EMPLOYEE FORM ALL TYPES OF HURDLES.
From India, Visakhapatnam
Thanks for your reply.
-the issue that I discussed is not a individual issue of me but it's for all the employee.
FEW MORE QUESTION ON THIS ISSUE IS-
1)can company return back increment after giving for three month ?
2) as we are now under new organisation after acquisition so as per your reply why it's not needed that new organisation should issue new appointment letter to us?
3) is only salary slip, old company's appointment letter, new (aquiring) company's welcome letter is enough to prove me confirmed employee of new company?
From India, Kolkata
-the issue that I discussed is not a individual issue of me but it's for all the employee.
FEW MORE QUESTION ON THIS ISSUE IS-
1)can company return back increment after giving for three month ?
2) as we are now under new organisation after acquisition so as per your reply why it's not needed that new organisation should issue new appointment letter to us?
3) is only salary slip, old company's appointment letter, new (aquiring) company's welcome letter is enough to prove me confirmed employee of new company?
From India, Kolkata
1)can company return back increment after giving for three month ?
WHY NOT, THEIR INTENTION IS NOT TO STOP THE INCREMENT OR CURTAIL THE BENEFITS WITHOUT NOTICE.
2) as we are now under new organisation after acquisition so as per your reply why it's not needed that new organisation should issue new appointment letter to us?
NOT REQUIRED TO ISSUE NEW APPOINTMENT LETTER, IF REQUIRED THEY MAY ISSUE ANY IDENTITY CARD WITH NEW COMPANY NAME. IDENTITY CARD IS ALSO CAN SATISFY THE EMPLOYEE.
3) is only salary slip, old company's appointment letter, new (aquiring) company's welcome letter is enough to prove me confirmed employee of new company?
PROVING OR NOT PROVING ONES EMPLOYMENT IN THE ORGANISATIONS DOES NOT ARISE IN THE COMPANY UNTIL UNLESS QUITTING THE EMPLOYMENT EITHER OF SIDE.
MAKING INCREMENT IS WELL IN CONTINUING THE EMPLOYMENT WHATEVER THE OLD OR NEW EMPLOYMENT IS WELCOMING ONE.
attribution https://www.citehr.com/504662-appoin...#ixzz3CAsYewme
From India, Visakhapatnam
WHY NOT, THEIR INTENTION IS NOT TO STOP THE INCREMENT OR CURTAIL THE BENEFITS WITHOUT NOTICE.
2) as we are now under new organisation after acquisition so as per your reply why it's not needed that new organisation should issue new appointment letter to us?
NOT REQUIRED TO ISSUE NEW APPOINTMENT LETTER, IF REQUIRED THEY MAY ISSUE ANY IDENTITY CARD WITH NEW COMPANY NAME. IDENTITY CARD IS ALSO CAN SATISFY THE EMPLOYEE.
3) is only salary slip, old company's appointment letter, new (aquiring) company's welcome letter is enough to prove me confirmed employee of new company?
PROVING OR NOT PROVING ONES EMPLOYMENT IN THE ORGANISATIONS DOES NOT ARISE IN THE COMPANY UNTIL UNLESS QUITTING THE EMPLOYMENT EITHER OF SIDE.
MAKING INCREMENT IS WELL IN CONTINUING THE EMPLOYMENT WHATEVER THE OLD OR NEW EMPLOYMENT IS WELCOMING ONE.
attribution https://www.citehr.com/504662-appoin...#ixzz3CAsYewme
From India, Visakhapatnam
Hi Sahil
According to me in most of Merger & Acquisition cases employees’ aspect is also taken into consideration. Acquiring company takes assets and liabilities of merging company and people aspect is also part of it. There is concept of Original Hire Date which is used for continuity of service and calculating various employee benefits. Please find point wise revert as following.
1) Can company return back increment after giving for three month?
---No, ideally employer cannot return increment after giving it (Hope payment is not due to any mistake). If still employer is doing this than what reason is given to employee..Demotion? so more information required for this.
2) as we are now under new organisation after acquisition so as per your reply why it's not needed that new organisation should issue new appointment letter to us?
---It is not mandatory to issue new appointment letter to employees. Old appointment letter with supporting document is sufficient in most of cases.
3) is only salary slip, old company's appointment letter, new (aquiring) company's welcome letter is enough to prove me confirmed employee of new company.
---If employee is already confirmed before acquisition than automatically they will not become probationer. If new company is planning for resizing than it will be not much helpful whether employee is confirmed or probationer. In most appointment letters there is exit clause and as per exit clause both party can terminate contract with providing notice or compensation for it.
From India, Hyderabad
According to me in most of Merger & Acquisition cases employees’ aspect is also taken into consideration. Acquiring company takes assets and liabilities of merging company and people aspect is also part of it. There is concept of Original Hire Date which is used for continuity of service and calculating various employee benefits. Please find point wise revert as following.
1) Can company return back increment after giving for three month?
---No, ideally employer cannot return increment after giving it (Hope payment is not due to any mistake). If still employer is doing this than what reason is given to employee..Demotion? so more information required for this.
2) as we are now under new organisation after acquisition so as per your reply why it's not needed that new organisation should issue new appointment letter to us?
---It is not mandatory to issue new appointment letter to employees. Old appointment letter with supporting document is sufficient in most of cases.
3) is only salary slip, old company's appointment letter, new (aquiring) company's welcome letter is enough to prove me confirmed employee of new company.
---If employee is already confirmed before acquisition than automatically they will not become probationer. If new company is planning for resizing than it will be not much helpful whether employee is confirmed or probationer. In most appointment letters there is exit clause and as per exit clause both party can terminate contract with providing notice or compensation for it.
From India, Hyderabad
-Can I post the terms and conditions paper to show you that , is it safe in wordings to sign it?
From India, Kolkata
From India, Kolkata
Hi white eagle,
As I have written in first thread that, company is giving terms and condition paper with this year increment letter and telling to sign and return to them (on asking HR come to know that this is the terms and conditions paper which company should have signed at the time of takeover 2 years back but they forgot).In one side they are telling that in Annexure 1 which is showing increment details have no terms and conditions but if I not sign the Annexure 2 that contains different terms and conditions like appointment letter-leave policy, termination of confirmed employee, travel policy etc , company will not give increment. So, in April 2014 after giving 3 months arrear increment (effected from Jan 2014) they deduct the total increment amount of last 3 months (jan-march) from salary of April 2014.
-there are some very much confusing terms and conditions in Annexure 2, so we are not signing.
-but HR telling us to sing it to get increment. (Though there is no terms and conditions in getting increment, as per HR'S mail).*(we got our last increment without signing ny terms and condition)
-1) can company do this deduction?
2) can put this terms and conditions paper with increment paper?
Plz reply.
From India, Kolkata
As I have written in first thread that, company is giving terms and condition paper with this year increment letter and telling to sign and return to them (on asking HR come to know that this is the terms and conditions paper which company should have signed at the time of takeover 2 years back but they forgot).In one side they are telling that in Annexure 1 which is showing increment details have no terms and conditions but if I not sign the Annexure 2 that contains different terms and conditions like appointment letter-leave policy, termination of confirmed employee, travel policy etc , company will not give increment. So, in April 2014 after giving 3 months arrear increment (effected from Jan 2014) they deduct the total increment amount of last 3 months (jan-march) from salary of April 2014.
-there are some very much confusing terms and conditions in Annexure 2, so we are not signing.
-but HR telling us to sing it to get increment. (Though there is no terms and conditions in getting increment, as per HR'S mail).*(we got our last increment without signing ny terms and condition)
-1) can company do this deduction?
2) can put this terms and conditions paper with increment paper?
Plz reply.
From India, Kolkata
Hi,
Whenever companies are merged, there is elaborate document where every details are provided concerned to all resources, most of the merger cases new entity are bound to keep existing employees on the terms of the previous company for at least six months and after that new entity is free to force employees on their terms. Now it seems after expiry of said period they are asking to sign their terms and conditions.
I hope in this case welcome letter is given to each employee, New identity cards and monthly pay slip might be issued by the New company. I hope date of joining remains as per old company. You needn't worry to sign until terms and conditions are not detrimental to your career.Legally there is no problem at all, you may deny their terms at this stage and they can't force you since they have already accepted you through welcome letter on the previous appointment terms otherwise they could have asked you sign the new terms.
thanks
From India, Jaipur
Whenever companies are merged, there is elaborate document where every details are provided concerned to all resources, most of the merger cases new entity are bound to keep existing employees on the terms of the previous company for at least six months and after that new entity is free to force employees on their terms. Now it seems after expiry of said period they are asking to sign their terms and conditions.
I hope in this case welcome letter is given to each employee, New identity cards and monthly pay slip might be issued by the New company. I hope date of joining remains as per old company. You needn't worry to sign until terms and conditions are not detrimental to your career.Legally there is no problem at all, you may deny their terms at this stage and they can't force you since they have already accepted you through welcome letter on the previous appointment terms otherwise they could have asked you sign the new terms.
thanks
From India, Jaipur
Thanks a lot for ur concerns.
-Now what should our stand point in this situation where they are asking to sign Annexure 2 (terms and conditions paper) to get back in the incremental salary along with the arrears from Jan 2014??
-can we go for any legal procedure to get back our increment with arrears?
(* increment was given this is proved in our March 2014's salary slip with details breakups in basic, hra, convenience allowances, then they had deducted it by showing "other deduction" in April's salary as we didn't sign in Annexure 2 (term and conditions paper)*{*there is three part of the papers a) increment letter b) CTC breakups details (Annexure 1) c) Annexure 2 (terms and conditions)}
From India, Kolkata
-Now what should our stand point in this situation where they are asking to sign Annexure 2 (terms and conditions paper) to get back in the incremental salary along with the arrears from Jan 2014??
-can we go for any legal procedure to get back our increment with arrears?
(* increment was given this is proved in our March 2014's salary slip with details breakups in basic, hra, convenience allowances, then they had deducted it by showing "other deduction" in April's salary as we didn't sign in Annexure 2 (term and conditions paper)*{*there is three part of the papers a) increment letter b) CTC breakups details (Annexure 1) c) Annexure 2 (terms and conditions)}
From India, Kolkata
Hi,
Specific terms & conditions of service are given in appointment letter and other general service regulation are given in Employee Handbook, mostly these things might be already there in employee handbook, please check your handbook, it may help you. Still if you find they are unreasonable and are contrary to existing law of land, then it will not be having any legal standing at all despite you have signed or not.
Still I will advise you, if you find peace by signing these conditions better buy it, you will be tired and frustrated by our legal system and you will loose your peace. Mostly these conditions are added by companies to maintain discipline in the organisation, these conditions may not be having any legal bearing at all.
Thanks
From India, Jaipur
Specific terms & conditions of service are given in appointment letter and other general service regulation are given in Employee Handbook, mostly these things might be already there in employee handbook, please check your handbook, it may help you. Still if you find they are unreasonable and are contrary to existing law of land, then it will not be having any legal standing at all despite you have signed or not.
Still I will advise you, if you find peace by signing these conditions better buy it, you will be tired and frustrated by our legal system and you will loose your peace. Mostly these conditions are added by companies to maintain discipline in the organisation, these conditions may not be having any legal bearing at all.
Thanks
From India, Jaipur
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