kenn when u suffer u know and will not speak so big big things and type such values, honesty etc,,, once u suffer then u know,,
From India, Pune
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57From India, Pune
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Chandan, Kenn, I liked your answers. Ravi and alike, how will it not help if you report the demand to the Anti-Corruption Cell or use RTI? Though rightly said by Kenn, it will take time, but then will it not be worth it?
Mridulika, you've expressed your 'thoda, thoda' opinion. Thanks. Expecting more opinions from the rest.
Prashant
From India, Delhi
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Mridulika, you've expressed your 'thoda, thoda' opinion. Thanks. Expecting more opinions from the rest.
Prashant
From India, Delhi
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Bribery is the easy option out, but then why do we always look at the easy way out? As an HR head, what culture and values do you want to set for your team? I think the correct way to go about government officials is contacts and not bribes. Find contacts, and the work would get done fast.
Because, if you take the decision once to give a bribe, where does the buck stop?
From India, Lucknow
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Because, if you take the decision once to give a bribe, where does the buck stop?
From India, Lucknow
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Dear Ravi,
I think you should stay out of this because the way you write suggests the ethics you follow and honesty are a million light years away from you.
This is for all other HR people except Ravi.
There is nothing like personal ethics as far as business is concerned.
I won't quote the name of the organization, but we all know its name, and even a movie was produced on its life.
Now, if we take that example, the company has reached the zenith within a time span of 20 years and is still expanding. The owners are among the richest people.
So, if we follow ethics, there is hardly any scope for development and growth. Let's recall the movie "CORPORATE"...
If we were to mark, there are heights of bribery and politics for, within, and against the competitors.
What is the climax? Bipasha Basu ends up having a miserable life, the only reason being that she took the blame for something she never committed because she thought the company would bail her out and help her, due to the long service she had provided to the company.
Now, let's say if the bribe is not given, the organization might take several months to dig out the papers and the deals it wants.
Any organization would not like to waste time. The cost-effective way is to find contacts in the political party and get your work done. If there are none, bribing is not wrong unless it is under the table.
I hope this will help us gain some insights into the way corporates work.
Regards,
Zalak Dave
From India, Madurai
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I think you should stay out of this because the way you write suggests the ethics you follow and honesty are a million light years away from you.
This is for all other HR people except Ravi.
There is nothing like personal ethics as far as business is concerned.
I won't quote the name of the organization, but we all know its name, and even a movie was produced on its life.
Now, if we take that example, the company has reached the zenith within a time span of 20 years and is still expanding. The owners are among the richest people.
So, if we follow ethics, there is hardly any scope for development and growth. Let's recall the movie "CORPORATE"...
If we were to mark, there are heights of bribery and politics for, within, and against the competitors.
What is the climax? Bipasha Basu ends up having a miserable life, the only reason being that she took the blame for something she never committed because she thought the company would bail her out and help her, due to the long service she had provided to the company.
Now, let's say if the bribe is not given, the organization might take several months to dig out the papers and the deals it wants.
Any organization would not like to waste time. The cost-effective way is to find contacts in the political party and get your work done. If there are none, bribing is not wrong unless it is under the table.
I hope this will help us gain some insights into the way corporates work.
Regards,
Zalak Dave
From India, Madurai
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I think I can provide the solution if you really are in this dilemma.
You can convince the management by showing them the criticality of document & if it is an NOC or License or Approval for something then you can do it through consultant.
Also if it is in Factory then any of the contractors can help you to get the document & see if this really is a condition then be yourself. Ask yourself what do you want?
You want to pay bribe or not? If you don’t want to pay then don’t pay. :icon1:
From India
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You can convince the management by showing them the criticality of document & if it is an NOC or License or Approval for something then you can do it through consultant.
Also if it is in Factory then any of the contractors can help you to get the document & see if this really is a condition then be yourself. Ask yourself what do you want?
You want to pay bribe or not? If you don’t want to pay then don’t pay. :icon1:
From India
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Dear Prashant,
Please inform management about any deficiencies, discrepancies, or concealed information in the documents currently in the possession of the official. If you refuse to offer a bribe, what are the potential consequences?
If you are completely confident that the documents you are handling with the government official are error-free and contain no hidden information, then you may approach management. If the official in question is requesting a bribe, but you are certain that the work can be completed without it, please communicate this to the management.
Thank you.
From India, Ludhiana
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Please inform management about any deficiencies, discrepancies, or concealed information in the documents currently in the possession of the official. If you refuse to offer a bribe, what are the potential consequences?
If you are completely confident that the documents you are handling with the government official are error-free and contain no hidden information, then you may approach management. If the official in question is requesting a bribe, but you are certain that the work can be completed without it, please communicate this to the management.
Thank you.
From India, Ludhiana
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Dear Prashant,
Do one thing if you don't mind. Appoint one employee (or an ex-employee) who belongs to that government agency (someone with good contacts with PF/ESI establishments) as an external consultant on a monthly basis. Route your work through them and get out of the mess.
I tell you – this will help you to a larger extent.
With regards,
Jayesh Yohannan
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Do one thing if you don't mind. Appoint one employee (or an ex-employee) who belongs to that government agency (someone with good contacts with PF/ESI establishments) as an external consultant on a monthly basis. Route your work through them and get out of the mess.
I tell you – this will help you to a larger extent.
With regards,
Jayesh Yohannan
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Dear Zalak,
Was the first movie Guru? - about Reliance?
:-)
Okay, guys, I am sorry, there is a serious discussion going on, and I was just being playful.
In reality, my friend had faced this problem, where he had to pay a huge amount to government officials to get an FPO license - despite giving all the right documents. We approached another higher official, and the best part was he demanded more + 1 Biryani in a famous hotel in Coimbatore.
So in such situations, we had no other choice.
When we fought against the first person and tried seeking justice, and a better person to deal with the license and verify our docs - we only realized we had to pay more.
Please correct me if I am wrong.. if in case, the Head HR says no to a bribe, is there another way out to get the approvals/procedures done smoothly? (despite giving all proper docs)?
NO - DO YOU KNOW WHY? Are all corporates doing the right thing? Paying tax on time? Being "Corporate Social Responsible"?
If a few of you have raised your hands, do you think that these few are enough to fight against such corruption?
NO... because... it's not one person who is asking for a bribe... it is just 1 out of 1000 who says no to a bribe. The change must start from the corporate itself. If all corporates follow the right procedures and say no to such things, such illegal activities will cease. But the problem is a few think why they should waste "time" over it - and pay the bribe.
And Prashant, I did not answer your question. With just 2 years of experience.. if I were asked to deal with such a situation, I would be emotional, and - that may cloud my judgment of the situation! :)
Thanks
From India, Madras
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Was the first movie Guru? - about Reliance?
:-)
Okay, guys, I am sorry, there is a serious discussion going on, and I was just being playful.
In reality, my friend had faced this problem, where he had to pay a huge amount to government officials to get an FPO license - despite giving all the right documents. We approached another higher official, and the best part was he demanded more + 1 Biryani in a famous hotel in Coimbatore.
So in such situations, we had no other choice.
When we fought against the first person and tried seeking justice, and a better person to deal with the license and verify our docs - we only realized we had to pay more.
Please correct me if I am wrong.. if in case, the Head HR says no to a bribe, is there another way out to get the approvals/procedures done smoothly? (despite giving all proper docs)?
NO - DO YOU KNOW WHY? Are all corporates doing the right thing? Paying tax on time? Being "Corporate Social Responsible"?
If a few of you have raised your hands, do you think that these few are enough to fight against such corruption?
NO... because... it's not one person who is asking for a bribe... it is just 1 out of 1000 who says no to a bribe. The change must start from the corporate itself. If all corporates follow the right procedures and say no to such things, such illegal activities will cease. But the problem is a few think why they should waste "time" over it - and pay the bribe.
And Prashant, I did not answer your question. With just 2 years of experience.. if I were asked to deal with such a situation, I would be emotional, and - that may cloud my judgment of the situation! :)
Thanks
From India, Madras
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And everyone... relax about Ravi. Who knows, maybe he had a worse situation. When this happens in reality for our own purpose, we will know the pain... the pain which comes from - your heart saying no, and your mind still wanting to get that approval done, because that's what you dreamt about and that's why you tried so hard. Just for someone's signature - we will feel like a fool at the end. Some people are able to pay, so they pay for saving time... others have to pay, else their competitor will pay and get THAT COMPETITIVE EDGE!
From India, Madras
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From India, Madras
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Great info, Ravi (not the killing part), but on how to approach and take action against these corrupt people. But sometimes they prefer gifts and dinner parties. Despite being really rich and having enough monetary support to help them have dinner every day at a 3-star or 5-star restaurant, they still prefer others doing it for them. That is what makes me feel bad. It's not that they don't have the money to do it so they are demanding. It's like they have so much that even the next three generations can live peacefully with that money, but still demand such things from average people like us. I think if every corporate says no to such activities, then the corrupt government officials will start behaving the way they are meant to behave!
From India, Madras
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From India, Madras
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