Dear All,
I recently had an issue where my account manager wrote an email degrading my personal reputation in the company. I am escalating the matter to the HR team, but I am uncertain if I will receive any justice. Are there any laws that protect employees from such harassment, and can I take legal action against the manager or the company? I would appreciate serious suggestions on this matter.
Regards,
Sandeep Tiwari
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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6I recently had an issue where my account manager wrote an email degrading my personal reputation in the company. I am escalating the matter to the HR team, but I am uncertain if I will receive any justice. Are there any laws that protect employees from such harassment, and can I take legal action against the manager or the company? I would appreciate serious suggestions on this matter.
Regards,
Sandeep Tiwari
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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Dear Sandeep,
At the workplace, we must maintain professionalism. If a manager sends you a derogatory email that degrades your personal reputation, it is most unfortunate. However, filing a lawsuit is at too early a stage. I recommend that you follow the procedure. However, before recommending a solution, we need to know the type of industry you work in, your designation, the number of persons that report to you, and whether your company has approved Standing Orders.
While you may find it difficult to explain the contents of the email, it is important for us to know whether the contents degraded your personal reputation. Occasionally, in a fit of anger, managers may send an email. Was it a case of a momentary lapse of judgment? To whom was the email sent, on what subject was it sent, and why did personal reputation come into the picture in the official contents of the email? Is it really a degradation of your reputation, or is it perception?
As a first step, you may submit an application to HR with a printout attached to your application. Submission of a hard copy is preferred over a soft copy. Keep a duplicate copy signed by HR with you. This is called a grievance by a junior employee against the manager. Give the heading of your application as "Grievance Against __________ (designation of the manager)" or "Grievance Against the Reporting Authority."
Upon receipt of your application, your HR will conduct an investigation. If you are not satisfied with the outcome of the investigation or with the punishment awarded to the defaulting manager, you may submit a second application to the highest authority of your company requesting a review.
If you are not satisfied with the outcome of the review, then you need to take the matter outside of your company. Find out the labor office in your area. Approach the Labor Officer (LO) and explain your problem in sequence. Carry with you evidence of all types, including proof that you are an employee of your company. Upon hearing your complaint, the LO might issue a letter to your company. This is known as an industrial dispute. On a specified day, he will call both parties, listen to viewpoints from both sides, and give his verdict. If you are not satisfied with the verdict, you may then send a notice from a lawyer. Your lawyer will provide you with further guidance.
Final Comments: While I have outlined the procedure for settling the grievance above, I recommend settling the matter without taking it too far. It could affect your career. Taking on a manager could prove risky. Managers are representatives of the management. Incensed by your application, your management might retaliate in some way. Therefore, consider the support that your manager receives from the top.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
From India, Bangalore
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At the workplace, we must maintain professionalism. If a manager sends you a derogatory email that degrades your personal reputation, it is most unfortunate. However, filing a lawsuit is at too early a stage. I recommend that you follow the procedure. However, before recommending a solution, we need to know the type of industry you work in, your designation, the number of persons that report to you, and whether your company has approved Standing Orders.
While you may find it difficult to explain the contents of the email, it is important for us to know whether the contents degraded your personal reputation. Occasionally, in a fit of anger, managers may send an email. Was it a case of a momentary lapse of judgment? To whom was the email sent, on what subject was it sent, and why did personal reputation come into the picture in the official contents of the email? Is it really a degradation of your reputation, or is it perception?
As a first step, you may submit an application to HR with a printout attached to your application. Submission of a hard copy is preferred over a soft copy. Keep a duplicate copy signed by HR with you. This is called a grievance by a junior employee against the manager. Give the heading of your application as "Grievance Against __________ (designation of the manager)" or "Grievance Against the Reporting Authority."
Upon receipt of your application, your HR will conduct an investigation. If you are not satisfied with the outcome of the investigation or with the punishment awarded to the defaulting manager, you may submit a second application to the highest authority of your company requesting a review.
If you are not satisfied with the outcome of the review, then you need to take the matter outside of your company. Find out the labor office in your area. Approach the Labor Officer (LO) and explain your problem in sequence. Carry with you evidence of all types, including proof that you are an employee of your company. Upon hearing your complaint, the LO might issue a letter to your company. This is known as an industrial dispute. On a specified day, he will call both parties, listen to viewpoints from both sides, and give his verdict. If you are not satisfied with the verdict, you may then send a notice from a lawyer. Your lawyer will provide you with further guidance.
Final Comments: While I have outlined the procedure for settling the grievance above, I recommend settling the matter without taking it too far. It could affect your career. Taking on a manager could prove risky. Managers are representatives of the management. Incensed by your application, your management might retaliate in some way. Therefore, consider the support that your manager receives from the top.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
From India, Bangalore
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Dear Sandeep,
You may please take cognizance of the following:
Firstly, sending mail in a derogatory manner in an organization is uncalled for; he has exceeded his limits.
You can take up the matter with the Vigilance Department/Employee Relations/Grievance cell, whichever is applicable in your company. They will conduct an inquiry and submit the report.
In case the Accounts Manager is at fault, action against him will definitely be taken by the Management to ensure that such incidents do not occur again.
It is too early to proceed with legal action against the said official or the company.
Please remain calm and follow the company rules and procedures. After all, everybody is a human being, and to err is human; to forgive a person is truly a great quality.
All the best.
From India, Bangalore
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You may please take cognizance of the following:
Firstly, sending mail in a derogatory manner in an organization is uncalled for; he has exceeded his limits.
You can take up the matter with the Vigilance Department/Employee Relations/Grievance cell, whichever is applicable in your company. They will conduct an inquiry and submit the report.
In case the Accounts Manager is at fault, action against him will definitely be taken by the Management to ensure that such incidents do not occur again.
It is too early to proceed with legal action against the said official or the company.
Please remain calm and follow the company rules and procedures. After all, everybody is a human being, and to err is human; to forgive a person is truly a great quality.
All the best.
From India, Bangalore
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email are not recognized as legal document by court/labor office/govt of India. Tc
From India, Bangalore
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From India, Bangalore
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First thing is to try to sort out the matter within the company. Put up a written complaint to management and ask them to inquire into the matter of damaging email. Is the email sent to you or to many others? What are the wordings of the email? Civil and criminal laws provide you protection. But this case is not fit to go to court and should be settled in-house only. (Prima facie opinion)
From India, Pune
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From India, Pune
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Thanks Dinesh for the responce. As suggested by you, currently the matter is with HR and they are discussing this with cluster head. I’ll have a meeting with Clustor head very soon to discuss the matter along with HR team.
Just to brief a bit about myself and the matter, I am into IT, Currently as a test manager, onsite. I was heading the delivery in SAP competency for my company for UK and Ireland region before I moved to onsite the current role I am doing. There was a testing new bidding for a testing project coming up in US and since company didn’t had anyone suitable to travel for project defense, I was asked to travel. When asked, I told testing competency to get in touch with account manager as I report to him and get buying from him. Competency did the same and I got a call from my account manager to discuss about it. Then, I received a mail from cluster head to travel as he is the one who has discussed with my manager. I took his mail as approval and travelled. I have done arrangements with client at onsite for the work which will be stopped during my absence and shared the responsibility with other team mates. Up on my return, my account manager started claiming that he was not aware about the trip and why I travelled and my trip has bought bad rapport with customer. He gave me all the stories which he could have given which where just cooked up stories. When I went and checked with customer they were cool about it and have extended my contract also. Because of all this episode, my account manager thought that I don’t respect seniors and he wrote a nasty mail to me keeping all the higher authorities as well as HR in loop. When I discussed the same with HR team, They also agreed that the language used is harsh and unofficial. So the matter is up for discussion. In short, he is begging for the respect just because he is higher in hierarchy and don’t believe in hierarchy in service industry for respect.
This episode has made me dull for about a week and resulted in bad week with my family and other work collegues. This is spoiling my personal as well as professional image and as far as I understand, no one in the organization, Whatever is the position, has the right to humiliate you in public through any medium. I know I am fighting a tough war where I’ll not gain much other than my satisfaction, but I’ll still be happy to gain the satisfaction and loosing this job. All I asked HR is either an apology mail from my manager on top of the same mail which he wrote or convience me that it was my fault in the entire episode.
I am waiting for HR to response and am ready to go to court also against company if I am not getting what I deserve. I just want to know if we can take this to court and fight against company. This will be case against the company as a whole or just the manager. Which court I can appear for such things.
I hope I clarified myself and if you think you should see the mail to decide whether it is humiliating or not, I can forward that too.
Regards,
Sandeep Tiwari
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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Just to brief a bit about myself and the matter, I am into IT, Currently as a test manager, onsite. I was heading the delivery in SAP competency for my company for UK and Ireland region before I moved to onsite the current role I am doing. There was a testing new bidding for a testing project coming up in US and since company didn’t had anyone suitable to travel for project defense, I was asked to travel. When asked, I told testing competency to get in touch with account manager as I report to him and get buying from him. Competency did the same and I got a call from my account manager to discuss about it. Then, I received a mail from cluster head to travel as he is the one who has discussed with my manager. I took his mail as approval and travelled. I have done arrangements with client at onsite for the work which will be stopped during my absence and shared the responsibility with other team mates. Up on my return, my account manager started claiming that he was not aware about the trip and why I travelled and my trip has bought bad rapport with customer. He gave me all the stories which he could have given which where just cooked up stories. When I went and checked with customer they were cool about it and have extended my contract also. Because of all this episode, my account manager thought that I don’t respect seniors and he wrote a nasty mail to me keeping all the higher authorities as well as HR in loop. When I discussed the same with HR team, They also agreed that the language used is harsh and unofficial. So the matter is up for discussion. In short, he is begging for the respect just because he is higher in hierarchy and don’t believe in hierarchy in service industry for respect.
This episode has made me dull for about a week and resulted in bad week with my family and other work collegues. This is spoiling my personal as well as professional image and as far as I understand, no one in the organization, Whatever is the position, has the right to humiliate you in public through any medium. I know I am fighting a tough war where I’ll not gain much other than my satisfaction, but I’ll still be happy to gain the satisfaction and loosing this job. All I asked HR is either an apology mail from my manager on top of the same mail which he wrote or convience me that it was my fault in the entire episode.
I am waiting for HR to response and am ready to go to court also against company if I am not getting what I deserve. I just want to know if we can take this to court and fight against company. This will be case against the company as a whole or just the manager. Which court I can appear for such things.
I hope I clarified myself and if you think you should see the mail to decide whether it is humiliating or not, I can forward that too.
Regards,
Sandeep Tiwari
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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My advice again is to sort out such matters in-house. Court is no paradise. You will face delays, "tareek pe tareek," and have to relive this experience for long periods of time. Insist that HR remedies the matter and move on in life. I can understand the anger and humiliation, but the remedy is not a legal battle.
From India, Pune
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From India, Pune
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Dear Sandeep,
I welcome you to CiteHR.com!
I presume you joined us to seek a remedy for your problem. I have gone through the thread.
No doubt, your ego is bruised, and you are feeling hurt. Do you know there are places in India where people feel hurt and humiliated if you do not wish them or acknowledge their presence? Sometimes, they become so aggressive they might even attack or hurt you physically. I am sure you must be aware of such places, which are so well highlighted in Bollywood movies! Are you one of such people?
"He wrote a nasty email to me keeping all the higher authorities as well as HR in the loop," and this was a humiliation for you! Your self-respect and self-image are so weak and fragile that you felt humiliated and had a strained relationship with family and friends.
Now, you want to teach him a lesson, you are looking for revenge! All because of an email that your senior sent. To repeat:
"He wrote a nasty email to me keeping all the higher authorities as well as HR in the loop."
So what does this episode in your flourishing career depict about you as a person? Your education, temperament, personality? Your MATURITY to handle criticism and others' opinions, however erroneous their opinion may be? Please think it over again.
Just a critical email CONSTITUTES harassment? That email was not obscene, nor are you a female worker in a company who is protected by the "Prevention of Sexual Harassment at Workplace."
My humble suggestion would be to simply ignore such small incidents. These keep happening frequently in one's life and career. However good and hardworking you are, you can NOT STILL MAKE everyone love you or like you.
It would give you much more and richer dividends if you focus on your tasks instead of making everyone, including yourself, unhappy, sorrowful, and gloomy by focusing on an unsavory email sent by one of your seniors. If you are REALLY THAT GOOD, then instead of getting affected, YOU SHOULD SHOW him that his nasty email doesn't affect your spirits and motivation, nor does it have any value except revealing his own nastiness.
Warm regards.
From India, Delhi
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I welcome you to CiteHR.com!
I presume you joined us to seek a remedy for your problem. I have gone through the thread.
No doubt, your ego is bruised, and you are feeling hurt. Do you know there are places in India where people feel hurt and humiliated if you do not wish them or acknowledge their presence? Sometimes, they become so aggressive they might even attack or hurt you physically. I am sure you must be aware of such places, which are so well highlighted in Bollywood movies! Are you one of such people?
"He wrote a nasty email to me keeping all the higher authorities as well as HR in the loop," and this was a humiliation for you! Your self-respect and self-image are so weak and fragile that you felt humiliated and had a strained relationship with family and friends.
Now, you want to teach him a lesson, you are looking for revenge! All because of an email that your senior sent. To repeat:
"He wrote a nasty email to me keeping all the higher authorities as well as HR in the loop."
So what does this episode in your flourishing career depict about you as a person? Your education, temperament, personality? Your MATURITY to handle criticism and others' opinions, however erroneous their opinion may be? Please think it over again.
Just a critical email CONSTITUTES harassment? That email was not obscene, nor are you a female worker in a company who is protected by the "Prevention of Sexual Harassment at Workplace."
My humble suggestion would be to simply ignore such small incidents. These keep happening frequently in one's life and career. However good and hardworking you are, you can NOT STILL MAKE everyone love you or like you.
It would give you much more and richer dividends if you focus on your tasks instead of making everyone, including yourself, unhappy, sorrowful, and gloomy by focusing on an unsavory email sent by one of your seniors. If you are REALLY THAT GOOD, then instead of getting affected, YOU SHOULD SHOW him that his nasty email doesn't affect your spirits and motivation, nor does it have any value except revealing his own nastiness.
Warm regards.
From India, Delhi
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Raj Kumar,
Extremely well-written and conveys the whole solution to nasty emails or verbal arguments. Ego should not be so fragile. No wonder our judicial system is so overwhelmed with cases that take decades to resolve. One email, however nasty, should not derail your composure and equanimity. Give a detailed reply to the Accounts Manager, keeping all other addressees in the loop. This is my prima facie opinion on the topic.
From India, Pune
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Extremely well-written and conveys the whole solution to nasty emails or verbal arguments. Ego should not be so fragile. No wonder our judicial system is so overwhelmed with cases that take decades to resolve. One email, however nasty, should not derail your composure and equanimity. Give a detailed reply to the Accounts Manager, keeping all other addressees in the loop. This is my prima facie opinion on the topic.
From India, Pune
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Good reply has been given by Mr. Rajkumar. In Corporate company these kind of nasty mail is a routine job. You should be bold enough to revert on such kind of mails.
From Japan
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From Japan
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I am not so sure that "............action shall definitely be taken by the top management against the manager...". I beg to differ. Normally, if it is a matter between non-managerial staff and a manager, then the top management seldom takes any punitive action against the manager, even if he is at fault. At most, they shall ask him (that too verbally) not to do this again! However, if by any chance the unit head has some grudge against this manager, then he/she shall use this opportunity to settle scores with him.
From India, New Delhi
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From India, New Delhi
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Dear Sandeep,
Shri Raj Kumar Hansdah has very aptly advised you. By the way, do you not feel that you have become overly sentimental and emotional in this case? Also, it may not be with any wrong intention on your part, but don't you feel that you have skipped one step for the purpose of close coordination within the organization by ignoring the instructions of some superior, when you say, "I got a call from my account manager to discuss it. Then, I received an email from the cluster head to travel as he is the one who has discussed with my manager. I took his email as approval and traveled." Just think, did that email state anywhere that there was no need for you to meet the account manager?
The "testing competency" might have contacted the Account Manager at your request to get in touch with him, but the responsibility to ensure proper invoicing and accounting rests with the accounts department. The Accounts Manager would have been interested only in avoiding any communication gap in a triangle of the 'accounts manager,' 'competency,' and you, as you were supposed to visit on site for the purpose of testing/delivery in SAP competency, whatever it may be.
Since you also hold the status of a manager, just think, for the purpose of proper coordination, as part of your responsibility, if you had asked someone to meet you for discussion before proceeding on-site to ensure proper testing and his superior directed him to proceed, would you not feel ignored by the said person?
If the competency approved your tour/travel, that did not mean the element of coordination between the other concerned departments was dispensed with unless formally desired.
In any organization, close coordination between the concerned departments is a must. Though the competency has done its duty by approving your travel, it would not have restrained you or disapproved your meeting with the Account Manager.
Therefore, in case you wish to proceed against your company's Account Manager or even the company for your satisfaction, even if the incident hurt your ego, I anticipate that you would only be jeopardizing your career and be a loser at the organizational level as well as potentially in court on one or both of the following counts:
1) Insubordination on your part, having ignored the instructions of the concerned superior authority; and/or
2) Not discharging your responsibility with due diligence and in keeping pace with the requirements of some other related department.
Sometimes compromises with one's position become imperative. So, my elderly advice is to make sure not to take any step that may jeopardize your own position and reputation. Better weigh the pros and cons of your idea properly before you decide to proceed further. Sometimes bitterness in relations between one and the other party may prove quite harmful to the interests of each one in the future due to the development of revengeful attitudes. No one can anticipate when one would need the help of an adversary in some difficult time.
From India, Delhi
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Shri Raj Kumar Hansdah has very aptly advised you. By the way, do you not feel that you have become overly sentimental and emotional in this case? Also, it may not be with any wrong intention on your part, but don't you feel that you have skipped one step for the purpose of close coordination within the organization by ignoring the instructions of some superior, when you say, "I got a call from my account manager to discuss it. Then, I received an email from the cluster head to travel as he is the one who has discussed with my manager. I took his email as approval and traveled." Just think, did that email state anywhere that there was no need for you to meet the account manager?
The "testing competency" might have contacted the Account Manager at your request to get in touch with him, but the responsibility to ensure proper invoicing and accounting rests with the accounts department. The Accounts Manager would have been interested only in avoiding any communication gap in a triangle of the 'accounts manager,' 'competency,' and you, as you were supposed to visit on site for the purpose of testing/delivery in SAP competency, whatever it may be.
Since you also hold the status of a manager, just think, for the purpose of proper coordination, as part of your responsibility, if you had asked someone to meet you for discussion before proceeding on-site to ensure proper testing and his superior directed him to proceed, would you not feel ignored by the said person?
If the competency approved your tour/travel, that did not mean the element of coordination between the other concerned departments was dispensed with unless formally desired.
In any organization, close coordination between the concerned departments is a must. Though the competency has done its duty by approving your travel, it would not have restrained you or disapproved your meeting with the Account Manager.
Therefore, in case you wish to proceed against your company's Account Manager or even the company for your satisfaction, even if the incident hurt your ego, I anticipate that you would only be jeopardizing your career and be a loser at the organizational level as well as potentially in court on one or both of the following counts:
1) Insubordination on your part, having ignored the instructions of the concerned superior authority; and/or
2) Not discharging your responsibility with due diligence and in keeping pace with the requirements of some other related department.
Sometimes compromises with one's position become imperative. So, my elderly advice is to make sure not to take any step that may jeopardize your own position and reputation. Better weigh the pros and cons of your idea properly before you decide to proceed further. Sometimes bitterness in relations between one and the other party may prove quite harmful to the interests of each one in the future due to the development of revengeful attitudes. No one can anticipate when one would need the help of an adversary in some difficult time.
From India, Delhi
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From your post, I understand that you are not based in India, but are based in the UK. Humiliating a subordinate or harassing may be something which may be acceptable in India, but it is not so in developed countries. You are protected by workplace mental and harassment guidelines and statutes. You may go ahead and file a written complaint with the authorities. The legal process in the UK is swift and fair. Please take all the evidence and meet up with a good lawyer. You are also entitled to fair compensation for the humiliation you have gone through, and this could amount to at least a couple of million pounds. I have had to handle such a case in my UK office, and both the concerned employee and the superior who harassed him were incidentally Indians. The concerned employee was awarded a compensation of GBP 2.5 million. Besides, he was declared a protected employee and was not allowed to be terminated. So please go ahead and contact a lawyer who handles workplace issues.
From United+States, San+Francisco
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From United+States, San+Francisco
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Respected Members,
The anonymity of the author of the latest advice indicates as if the author of this advice is not sure whether his advice is correct or not. Moreover, it reveals as if he has no sufficient courage and confidence to render advice to the querist with his real identity! Anyway, it is up to the querist if he prefers to adhere to the advice of some anonymous person.
From India, Delhi
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The anonymity of the author of the latest advice indicates as if the author of this advice is not sure whether his advice is correct or not. Moreover, it reveals as if he has no sufficient courage and confidence to render advice to the querist with his real identity! Anyway, it is up to the querist if he prefers to adhere to the advice of some anonymous person.
From India, Delhi
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I am really sorry to see so many responses asking to let it go. I am sure you all are senior enough to understand the self-respect, and anyone trying to hurt that will definitely not be taken lightly. I believe that because most of the guys prefer to keep mum in such incidents, we have so many such incidents, and we Indians with a 'chalta hai' attitude started taking it for granted. I am sorry to most of you who tried preaching me the same attitude. Sorry again to see the response and thought about what you are teaching to your kids. I am in the UK, and in the Western world, self-respect is beyond everything.
I read a response where someone said you are not a woman to feel harassed. Sir, self-respect comes irrespective of your self, and I'd request everyone to understand that I'll not allow anyone to walk past me just because he is my account manager and up in hierarchy.
Please don't waste your time in responding to me to tolerate this for whatever reasons you have but just tell me the process. I guarantee that I'll be responsible for the result and no one else. If Citehr suggests to me that I am wasting my time here by posting this query, I am happy to quit and search for my solution.
Sorry if I hurt anyone with my response, but for me, it's much more acceptable to fight and get a result than sit and evaluate today and think tomorrow 'ki kas I could have done it.' I believe in my ability and I command the dignity of labor.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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I read a response where someone said you are not a woman to feel harassed. Sir, self-respect comes irrespective of your self, and I'd request everyone to understand that I'll not allow anyone to walk past me just because he is my account manager and up in hierarchy.
Please don't waste your time in responding to me to tolerate this for whatever reasons you have but just tell me the process. I guarantee that I'll be responsible for the result and no one else. If Citehr suggests to me that I am wasting my time here by posting this query, I am happy to quit and search for my solution.
Sorry if I hurt anyone with my response, but for me, it's much more acceptable to fight and get a result than sit and evaluate today and think tomorrow 'ki kas I could have done it.' I believe in my ability and I command the dignity of labor.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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Dear Sandeep,
Although it is a sheer waste of my time, as against your advice to members, but still I prefer to waste time to give my observation on your latest post.
Very wise decision, if you have decided to quit and search your own solution by using your own wisdom. Of course, you can understand your own position well, rather than any one else can, being not in direct touch with you. Nobody can or will compel you to adhere to the advice or suggestion of any one of the members of this forum. Nobody would even ask you to guarante whether you will be responsible for the results or not even as against your resolve, as any one of us has no right to ask you on that aspect. BUT, I must point out to you that your latest post speaks about your frustration and confusion, as revealed from your statement: Rather, you have given vent to your perplexion more from the following contradictory statement, which states as:
"Please dont waste your time in responding me to tolrate this for whatever reasons you have but just tell me the process. I gurantee that I'll be responsible for the result and no one else. If Citehr suggests me that I am wasting my time here by posting this query, I am happy to quit and search for my own solution."
As of contrdiction, on one hand you have desired the members to tell you the process, but on the other hand you have stated, "I am happy to quit and search for my own solution."
Question arises, when you have advised the members of CiteHR, not to waste their time, as you intend not to adhere to any advice, how you expect the members to waste their time to suggest you the process to deal with your problem legally? Moreover, when you are talking about the self respect with specific reference to the UK & western world as compared to your condemned Indian, "CHALTA HAI ATTITUDE," how you can expect the members to waste their time to suggest you the process based on chalta hai attitude? Still further, when you are in UK, the laws of UK only can be invoked, while the Indians with the so called "chalta hai attitude" can be expected to suggest you only the Indian process with reference to the Indian laws that may not be valid in UK..
So, any advice from Indian members may not suit you the "chalta hai" attitudinal process. So, it will be better for you to consult some local UK lawyer and file a case in the court of law by using your own wisdom.
BUT DON'T FORGET, the Indian members of this forum have not charged you any fee, nor asked you to pay any, nor have been benefitted in any way in advising you voluntarily, nor any of your proposed action against the manager or your company is expected to adversely affect them in any way, if you consider them to have given you advice with their chalta hai attitude.
OF COURSE, I can advise you with reference to British Laws also, but keeping in view of your future career I did not prefer to do so. But, had you preferred to consult me in person, I would have charged my consultation fee of not less than GBP £ 200 for my advice and that too without any responsibility how that would affect you.
MIND IT, voluntary advice is always sincere and can be benficial. Your lawyer can advice you only how to proceed legally, but won't tell you the pros & cons of that process, whether that benfits you or adversely affect your future career.
Any way, you are the master of yourself, by using your own wisdon. take your own decision how to proceed administratively or legally with the help of some UK based lawyer.
Best of luck !!!!!
From India, Delhi
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Although it is a sheer waste of my time, as against your advice to members, but still I prefer to waste time to give my observation on your latest post.
Very wise decision, if you have decided to quit and search your own solution by using your own wisdom. Of course, you can understand your own position well, rather than any one else can, being not in direct touch with you. Nobody can or will compel you to adhere to the advice or suggestion of any one of the members of this forum. Nobody would even ask you to guarante whether you will be responsible for the results or not even as against your resolve, as any one of us has no right to ask you on that aspect. BUT, I must point out to you that your latest post speaks about your frustration and confusion, as revealed from your statement: Rather, you have given vent to your perplexion more from the following contradictory statement, which states as:
"Please dont waste your time in responding me to tolrate this for whatever reasons you have but just tell me the process. I gurantee that I'll be responsible for the result and no one else. If Citehr suggests me that I am wasting my time here by posting this query, I am happy to quit and search for my own solution."
As of contrdiction, on one hand you have desired the members to tell you the process, but on the other hand you have stated, "I am happy to quit and search for my own solution."
Question arises, when you have advised the members of CiteHR, not to waste their time, as you intend not to adhere to any advice, how you expect the members to waste their time to suggest you the process to deal with your problem legally? Moreover, when you are talking about the self respect with specific reference to the UK & western world as compared to your condemned Indian, "CHALTA HAI ATTITUDE," how you can expect the members to waste their time to suggest you the process based on chalta hai attitude? Still further, when you are in UK, the laws of UK only can be invoked, while the Indians with the so called "chalta hai attitude" can be expected to suggest you only the Indian process with reference to the Indian laws that may not be valid in UK..
So, any advice from Indian members may not suit you the "chalta hai" attitudinal process. So, it will be better for you to consult some local UK lawyer and file a case in the court of law by using your own wisdom.
BUT DON'T FORGET, the Indian members of this forum have not charged you any fee, nor asked you to pay any, nor have been benefitted in any way in advising you voluntarily, nor any of your proposed action against the manager or your company is expected to adversely affect them in any way, if you consider them to have given you advice with their chalta hai attitude.
OF COURSE, I can advise you with reference to British Laws also, but keeping in view of your future career I did not prefer to do so. But, had you preferred to consult me in person, I would have charged my consultation fee of not less than GBP £ 200 for my advice and that too without any responsibility how that would affect you.
MIND IT, voluntary advice is always sincere and can be benficial. Your lawyer can advice you only how to proceed legally, but won't tell you the pros & cons of that process, whether that benfits you or adversely affect your future career.
Any way, you are the master of yourself, by using your own wisdon. take your own decision how to proceed administratively or legally with the help of some UK based lawyer.
Best of luck !!!!!
From India, Delhi
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Dear Mr. Dhingra,
Your email regarding being anonymous and its reflection on one's confidence and courage is uncalled for. This site provides an option to remain anonymous, and every person has the choice to do so. We are not here to seek publicity or consulting assignments by sharing our contact details; we are here to add value, not promote our business. I have received unwanted emails from consultants when I have not remained anonymous. As a CHRO of an MNC, the last thing we want is to be inundated with unsolicited messages from consultants. I hope my response to your intimidation/provocation will put this matter to rest. In the past, other consultants have also tried to provoke anonymous contributors to disclose their identity. What matters is whether the posted content adds value; the identity of the poster is irrelevant.
Thank you.
From United+States, San+Francisco
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Your email regarding being anonymous and its reflection on one's confidence and courage is uncalled for. This site provides an option to remain anonymous, and every person has the choice to do so. We are not here to seek publicity or consulting assignments by sharing our contact details; we are here to add value, not promote our business. I have received unwanted emails from consultants when I have not remained anonymous. As a CHRO of an MNC, the last thing we want is to be inundated with unsolicited messages from consultants. I hope my response to your intimidation/provocation will put this matter to rest. In the past, other consultants have also tried to provoke anonymous contributors to disclose their identity. What matters is whether the posted content adds value; the identity of the poster is irrelevant.
Thank you.
From United+States, San+Francisco
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Dear Mr. Anonymous,
Asking for advice while remaining anonymous is understood, but not giving advice by hiding your identity. That, as per my belief, indicates only a lack of courage and confidence. Anyway, that may be your belief or choice to remain anonymous! If that is your choice, you cannot also deprive others of having the choice to make observations on anonymous advice in the open to all forum.
From India, Delhi
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Asking for advice while remaining anonymous is understood, but not giving advice by hiding your identity. That, as per my belief, indicates only a lack of courage and confidence. Anyway, that may be your belief or choice to remain anonymous! If that is your choice, you cannot also deprive others of having the choice to make observations on anonymous advice in the open to all forum.
From India, Delhi
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Dear Mr. Dhingra,
Thank you for offering me the discounted consultation fees for consulting, but trust me, seeing your free advice, you will be the last person for me to come to. Not to offend you or others like you, but I feel that you are dragging the matter in an unwanted direction. For me, my respect is above everything else, and it is hurt by this incident. I will not force you to put yourself in my place, but I just request that our thoughts are not matching, and I can't take your suggestions positively as they are making zero impact on me. So please feel free not to advise me any further. I have received a few responses here without resorting to personal attacks on personality and without any prejudice, which I will follow.
Thanks for your time anyhow, and I must confess your sense of humor is really nice, and I liked it.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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Thank you for offering me the discounted consultation fees for consulting, but trust me, seeing your free advice, you will be the last person for me to come to. Not to offend you or others like you, but I feel that you are dragging the matter in an unwanted direction. For me, my respect is above everything else, and it is hurt by this incident. I will not force you to put yourself in my place, but I just request that our thoughts are not matching, and I can't take your suggestions positively as they are making zero impact on me. So please feel free not to advise me any further. I have received a few responses here without resorting to personal attacks on personality and without any prejudice, which I will follow.
Thanks for your time anyhow, and I must confess your sense of humor is really nice, and I liked it.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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Dear Mr. Dhingra,
This site has given a choice to remain anonymous, and that is one of the prime reasons for senior professionals to be part of the site. If this choice was not given, we would not be members here.
If I were a consultant and seeking to take advantage of the new wave social networking platform to market myself, I would surely post my details. However, I am not a consultant, and I don't want to be hounded by consultants.
If you still do not understand my response, then God bless.
From United+States, San+Francisco
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This site has given a choice to remain anonymous, and that is one of the prime reasons for senior professionals to be part of the site. If this choice was not given, we would not be members here.
If I were a consultant and seeking to take advantage of the new wave social networking platform to market myself, I would surely post my details. However, I am not a consultant, and I don't want to be hounded by consultants.
If you still do not understand my response, then God bless.
From United+States, San+Francisco
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"I am sure you all are senior enough to understand the self-respect, and anyone trying to hurt that will definitely not be taken lightly."
Most of the posters are senior enough to understand the real meaning of self-respect. That is the reason for the sane and well-thought-out advice of giving a strong reply to the accounts manager and copying other addresses who were in the loop of the email on the subject. That should be enough to clear the matter. But seeing the trend of replies, I will not add anything further on this topic.
From India, Pune
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Most of the posters are senior enough to understand the real meaning of self-respect. That is the reason for the sane and well-thought-out advice of giving a strong reply to the accounts manager and copying other addresses who were in the loop of the email on the subject. That should be enough to clear the matter. But seeing the trend of replies, I will not add anything further on this topic.
From India, Pune
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Dear friends,
It is revealing to see how infectious negative emotions are!
If allowed to stoke these flames, they will continue to increase in enormity and devastation.
In a nutshell;
A person posts seeking a solution to his dilemma.
Is he seeking only THOSE OPINIONS AND ADVICE which he has already made up his mind about?
Or, is he willing to at least CONSIDER opinions that may be CONTRADICTORY to his own?
If he only believes in what he is doing is CORRECT, then I think this is not a forum meant to give a pat on the shoulder and UP-VOTE ONLY HIS OWN DECISION!
If he is looking for Only LIKES, then there are other Social Media forums where anything one posts, one is REWARDED ONLY WITH LIKES!
Members here, and especially several senior members, give their TIME and EFFORTS voluntarily because they have the experience and passion to CONTRIBUTE.
One may LIKE or DISLIKE, agree or disagree with another's opinion, but PERSONAL ATTACKS are a STRICT NO-NO.
They also VIOLATE the Community Norms and Terms of Use.
One may sort out personal differences through Personal Messages. There is a PROVISION for it too, just like the site gives an option to remain "anonymous."
Bonhomie and personal courtesy are hallmarks of Professionals.
P.S.: I shall be CONSTRAINED to Close this thread in case the discussion DEGENERATES to continued personal attacks instead of a discussion on the Issue at hand.
Warm regards.
From India, Delhi
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It is revealing to see how infectious negative emotions are!
If allowed to stoke these flames, they will continue to increase in enormity and devastation.
In a nutshell;
A person posts seeking a solution to his dilemma.
Is he seeking only THOSE OPINIONS AND ADVICE which he has already made up his mind about?
Or, is he willing to at least CONSIDER opinions that may be CONTRADICTORY to his own?
If he only believes in what he is doing is CORRECT, then I think this is not a forum meant to give a pat on the shoulder and UP-VOTE ONLY HIS OWN DECISION!
If he is looking for Only LIKES, then there are other Social Media forums where anything one posts, one is REWARDED ONLY WITH LIKES!
Members here, and especially several senior members, give their TIME and EFFORTS voluntarily because they have the experience and passion to CONTRIBUTE.
One may LIKE or DISLIKE, agree or disagree with another's opinion, but PERSONAL ATTACKS are a STRICT NO-NO.
They also VIOLATE the Community Norms and Terms of Use.
One may sort out personal differences through Personal Messages. There is a PROVISION for it too, just like the site gives an option to remain "anonymous."
Bonhomie and personal courtesy are hallmarks of Professionals.
P.S.: I shall be CONSTRAINED to Close this thread in case the discussion DEGENERATES to continued personal attacks instead of a discussion on the Issue at hand.
Warm regards.
From India, Delhi
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Dear Sandeep,
As Mr. Nathrao has suggested, if you decide to go to court, be prepared for at least an 8-10-year long legal battle and a long and hefty bill from the lawyer! Tell me honestly... is it really worth it? Secondly, there is no guarantee that you will get justice because, remember, solicitors/lawyers can stab you in the back by colluding with the opposing party. I'm telling you this from my personal experience.
Next, do you think this Accounts Manager is an exception? Whichever organization you work for, you will find some such people. Where will you escape to? Once, my unit manager insulted me in front of clients to such an extent that the client intervened and told him that I should be considered a valuable asset by the organization. The client, being a top-ranking bureaucrat, silenced the manager of my CPSU. So, forget, forgive, and concentrate on your goals. I wish you all the best in your career!
From India, New Delhi
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As Mr. Nathrao has suggested, if you decide to go to court, be prepared for at least an 8-10-year long legal battle and a long and hefty bill from the lawyer! Tell me honestly... is it really worth it? Secondly, there is no guarantee that you will get justice because, remember, solicitors/lawyers can stab you in the back by colluding with the opposing party. I'm telling you this from my personal experience.
Next, do you think this Accounts Manager is an exception? Whichever organization you work for, you will find some such people. Where will you escape to? Once, my unit manager insulted me in front of clients to such an extent that the client intervened and told him that I should be considered a valuable asset by the organization. The client, being a top-ranking bureaucrat, silenced the manager of my CPSU. So, forget, forgive, and concentrate on your goals. I wish you all the best in your career!
From India, New Delhi
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All right, everyone. Thank you for all your valuable advice. I have forwarded the case to the HR team and senior management, and the result is that a warning has been issued to the account manager, who has sent me an apology email. This satisfies my ego now. The lesson I have learned is to fight for your rights, and you will achieve what you deserve. There may be many who will say no, but at least one will guide you in the right direction. I am thankful for the first response to the post, where the process was clarified instead of people choosing to become personal and using capitalized words to show their emotions.
Thanks, everyone.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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Thanks, everyone.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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Hello Sandeep Tiwari,
There's one line that's often spoken in Human Relations/Psychology: "What the other guy says or does is NOT in your hands; but what's in YOUR hands is how you respond/react to it".
How often have you not been in a situation where the house may be full of noise, but you focus on your studies as if you are alone [as a student]? The same applies to everyone at various phases of life, albeit with a change of situation and purpose.
All I can see in the situation you described is a case of ego hang-up and low self-esteem of your Account manager and NOTHING to do with your caliber.
And I think there's a bit of communication gap too between your Cluster manager and account manager--he SURELY should have been informed 'in-writing' about your travel, etc. Since that aspect in the whole discussion seems to have got missed out, this guy took offense. You were just the cog in the wheel, getting ground/affected.
While I MAY be wrong, are you sure there's nothing between both of them... is there any possibility of the Cluster manager using this to get even with the Account Manager for something else?
Like Raj Kumar succinctly put it, when your account Manager is already losing sleep, why do you want to lose yours too?
Now that your HR is in the loop, just get on with your work and answer whatever and whenever you are asked.
All the Best.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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There's one line that's often spoken in Human Relations/Psychology: "What the other guy says or does is NOT in your hands; but what's in YOUR hands is how you respond/react to it".
How often have you not been in a situation where the house may be full of noise, but you focus on your studies as if you are alone [as a student]? The same applies to everyone at various phases of life, albeit with a change of situation and purpose.
All I can see in the situation you described is a case of ego hang-up and low self-esteem of your Account manager and NOTHING to do with your caliber.
And I think there's a bit of communication gap too between your Cluster manager and account manager--he SURELY should have been informed 'in-writing' about your travel, etc. Since that aspect in the whole discussion seems to have got missed out, this guy took offense. You were just the cog in the wheel, getting ground/affected.
While I MAY be wrong, are you sure there's nothing between both of them... is there any possibility of the Cluster manager using this to get even with the Account Manager for something else?
Like Raj Kumar succinctly put it, when your account Manager is already losing sleep, why do you want to lose yours too?
Now that your HR is in the loop, just get on with your work and answer whatever and whenever you are asked.
All the Best.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Sandeep,
Thank you for keeping all concerned members informed about the recent developments and the Company's efforts to resolve the issue to your satisfaction. I am pleased to hear that a significant amount of resources, including time, money (lawyer's fees, etc.), and mental strain, have been saved.
I also appreciate your update stating, "This satisfies my ego now..."!!! The additional exclamation marks are for emphasis, and I hope they do not offend you, similar to the capital letters you mentioned.
Allow me to summarize and conclude our discussion. As many have rightly pointed out, this issue primarily pertains to your "ego" rather than "self-respect," as you have acknowledged. One member correctly highlighted the distinction between the two concepts.
Self-respect is not easily diminished by external factors such as insults or abuses. It is a personal attribute that can only be lost through one's own actions and choices. For instance, failing to uphold one's commitments or behaving in a manner inconsistent with personal values can lead to a loss of self-respect.
Insults directed at others reflect more on the person delivering them rather than the recipient. In the case of the Account Manager, his behavior revealed more about himself than about you.
It is commendable that you have recognized the value of the initial feedback. Other suggestions provided by different individuals essentially conveyed similar messages in varying ways.
I wholeheartedly agree with your sentiment that one should fight for their rights, but it is crucial to do so in a respectful and constructive manner. As the saying goes, "If a dog bites you, do not bite back with your teeth; instead, use a stick to defend yourself."
Please note that the above reflections are not intended to prejudge the other party's perspective, as we lack information about their side of the story or the content of the disputed email. It is conceivable that the Accounts Manager may have felt slighted for not being kept informed about a team member's whereabouts or activities, potentially leading to his actions.
Thank you for your attention to this matter.
Best regards,
[Your Name]
From India, Delhi
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Thank you for keeping all concerned members informed about the recent developments and the Company's efforts to resolve the issue to your satisfaction. I am pleased to hear that a significant amount of resources, including time, money (lawyer's fees, etc.), and mental strain, have been saved.
I also appreciate your update stating, "This satisfies my ego now..."!!! The additional exclamation marks are for emphasis, and I hope they do not offend you, similar to the capital letters you mentioned.
Allow me to summarize and conclude our discussion. As many have rightly pointed out, this issue primarily pertains to your "ego" rather than "self-respect," as you have acknowledged. One member correctly highlighted the distinction between the two concepts.
Self-respect is not easily diminished by external factors such as insults or abuses. It is a personal attribute that can only be lost through one's own actions and choices. For instance, failing to uphold one's commitments or behaving in a manner inconsistent with personal values can lead to a loss of self-respect.
Insults directed at others reflect more on the person delivering them rather than the recipient. In the case of the Account Manager, his behavior revealed more about himself than about you.
It is commendable that you have recognized the value of the initial feedback. Other suggestions provided by different individuals essentially conveyed similar messages in varying ways.
I wholeheartedly agree with your sentiment that one should fight for their rights, but it is crucial to do so in a respectful and constructive manner. As the saying goes, "If a dog bites you, do not bite back with your teeth; instead, use a stick to defend yourself."
Please note that the above reflections are not intended to prejudge the other party's perspective, as we lack information about their side of the story or the content of the disputed email. It is conceivable that the Accounts Manager may have felt slighted for not being kept informed about a team member's whereabouts or activities, potentially leading to his actions.
Thank you for your attention to this matter.
Best regards,
[Your Name]
From India, Delhi
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Hello Sandeep Tiwari,
Really, nothing more to add after Raj Kumar's exhaustive response EXCEPT this. Your line "But the lesson I got is fight for your rights and you'll get the dew" belies an approach of 'aggressiveness'. Even though this MIGHT win you a few battles, in the long run, you will get hit. I suggest modifying your approach to be 'assertive' rather than 'aggressive'. In short, 'assertiveness' focuses on the issue while 'aggressiveness' focuses on the individual. Hope you get the point.
All the Best. Regards, TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Really, nothing more to add after Raj Kumar's exhaustive response EXCEPT this. Your line "But the lesson I got is fight for your rights and you'll get the dew" belies an approach of 'aggressiveness'. Even though this MIGHT win you a few battles, in the long run, you will get hit. I suggest modifying your approach to be 'assertive' rather than 'aggressive'. In short, 'assertiveness' focuses on the issue while 'aggressiveness' focuses on the individual. Hope you get the point.
All the Best. Regards, TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Excellent, Tajsateesh! Your concluding remark is absolutely correct, and it is like icing on the cake of this discussion. "Fight for your right and you will get the due" is not always the case. I guess an angry young man may think so, but experience teaches us that it is not the case. Even Mahatma Gandhi fought his whole life for the right to independence and achieved it, but he could not prevent the division of India.
From India, New Delhi
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From India, New Delhi
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Sandeep is not wrong in anything. Such type of manager should be punished
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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Dear Sandeep,
Thanks for your response to my post. However, regarding your post, "I will not force you to put yourself in my place but just request that our thoughts are not matching and I can't take your suggestions positively as they are making zero impact on me," I would like to inform you that at this very late stage, no one can force me to put myself in your place. That stage passed long ago, about 15 years after my retirement from active service. I want to clarify that during my service period, I championed self-respect, not ego. I took appropriate precautions to protect my self-respect and was fully equipped to handle any challenges on my own, without relying on the top brass, third parties, or the law courts.
My advice was impartial, not taking sides with any of your company's adversaries. Opinions, suggestions, or advice are always subject to acceptance or rejection by the recipient. Some people appreciate advice, while others do not. You were free to accept or ignore the advice given by members, and it does not hurt my feelings if our thoughts do not align.
I was pleased to see that, as a manager, you chose to make your own decision based on your resolve. Decisions, whether right or wrong, must be made by managers and leaders, even if they do not like the advice or suggestions of others. However, it appears that at the last moment, you backed down from your original proposal to take legal action against the erring manager and the company. You mentioned, "I have forwarded the case to the HR team and senior heads, and the result is that a warning has been issued to the account manager, and he has sent me an apology email. This satisfies my ego now. But the lesson I learned is to fight for your rights, and you will succeed."
Regardless of whether our thoughts align, in my opinion, you did not fight for your rights but rather to satisfy your ego. Your initial proposal to file a lawsuit against the company revealed indecision, especially when seeking advice from members of this site. Despite receiving several pieces of adverse advice, you eventually decided to stick to your original proposal. However, upon receiving an apology from the Account Manager, you abandoned your plan to take legal action, stating that it satisfied your ego. This raises questions about the justification of your premature query to the HR team and whether you were willing to follow their decision, especially when you were not inclined to act on any suggestions from the members.
This situation reflects a wavering mindset, which is not conducive to a manager working in a company in an advanced country like the UK. It appears to be more about ego and revenge rather than self-respect and prestige, which is not a healthy trend in any organization. Mutual respect among colleagues is always beneficial, unlike the confrontation of individual egos and values that can lead to undesirable outcomes.
While this advice may not resonate with you now, you may realize its value at some point in your career.
Best of luck!
From India, Delhi
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Thanks for your response to my post. However, regarding your post, "I will not force you to put yourself in my place but just request that our thoughts are not matching and I can't take your suggestions positively as they are making zero impact on me," I would like to inform you that at this very late stage, no one can force me to put myself in your place. That stage passed long ago, about 15 years after my retirement from active service. I want to clarify that during my service period, I championed self-respect, not ego. I took appropriate precautions to protect my self-respect and was fully equipped to handle any challenges on my own, without relying on the top brass, third parties, or the law courts.
My advice was impartial, not taking sides with any of your company's adversaries. Opinions, suggestions, or advice are always subject to acceptance or rejection by the recipient. Some people appreciate advice, while others do not. You were free to accept or ignore the advice given by members, and it does not hurt my feelings if our thoughts do not align.
I was pleased to see that, as a manager, you chose to make your own decision based on your resolve. Decisions, whether right or wrong, must be made by managers and leaders, even if they do not like the advice or suggestions of others. However, it appears that at the last moment, you backed down from your original proposal to take legal action against the erring manager and the company. You mentioned, "I have forwarded the case to the HR team and senior heads, and the result is that a warning has been issued to the account manager, and he has sent me an apology email. This satisfies my ego now. But the lesson I learned is to fight for your rights, and you will succeed."
Regardless of whether our thoughts align, in my opinion, you did not fight for your rights but rather to satisfy your ego. Your initial proposal to file a lawsuit against the company revealed indecision, especially when seeking advice from members of this site. Despite receiving several pieces of adverse advice, you eventually decided to stick to your original proposal. However, upon receiving an apology from the Account Manager, you abandoned your plan to take legal action, stating that it satisfied your ego. This raises questions about the justification of your premature query to the HR team and whether you were willing to follow their decision, especially when you were not inclined to act on any suggestions from the members.
This situation reflects a wavering mindset, which is not conducive to a manager working in a company in an advanced country like the UK. It appears to be more about ego and revenge rather than self-respect and prestige, which is not a healthy trend in any organization. Mutual respect among colleagues is always beneficial, unlike the confrontation of individual egos and values that can lead to undesirable outcomes.
While this advice may not resonate with you now, you may realize its value at some point in your career.
Best of luck!
From India, Delhi
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Dear Sandeep,
We feel that sometimes in companies and organizations, the reporting authority is not aware of the movements of their team due to emergent situations or other reasons. This lack of awareness can lead to misunderstandings. Due to such misunderstandings, they may take certain actions that seem silly. However, it is important not to adopt practices that could be detrimental to your future.
We believe that Mr. Rajkumar has provided you with a perfect solution to your grievances.
Regards,
Optimus Consultants
09672616784
From India
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We feel that sometimes in companies and organizations, the reporting authority is not aware of the movements of their team due to emergent situations or other reasons. This lack of awareness can lead to misunderstandings. Due to such misunderstandings, they may take certain actions that seem silly. However, it is important not to adopt practices that could be detrimental to your future.
We believe that Mr. Rajkumar has provided you with a perfect solution to your grievances.
Regards,
Optimus Consultants
09672616784
From India
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Dear All,
I absolutely have no issue in saying sorry if I am at fault, but if I am not at fault and anyone tries to act smart, it's tough for me to resist. That is probably the personality trait I have, which if needs change, I'll change it for good.
@PSDHINGRA, sir, no intention to offend you in any form. It's just that I listen to everyone but do things my way, with all respect to your time and effort to suggest me.
Regards,
Sandeep Tiwari
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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I absolutely have no issue in saying sorry if I am at fault, but if I am not at fault and anyone tries to act smart, it's tough for me to resist. That is probably the personality trait I have, which if needs change, I'll change it for good.
@PSDHINGRA, sir, no intention to offend you in any form. It's just that I listen to everyone but do things my way, with all respect to your time and effort to suggest me.
Regards,
Sandeep Tiwari
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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Mr.Rajkumar & Mr.Dhingra, Very good analysis of the situation and a sound advice on this tread. As Mr.Sadiq mentions, its a good learning for most of us. Thanks Vineeta
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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This thread has been one of the most satisfying threads. Thanks.
Mr. Sandeep somewhere states about 'having learned...' (about getting results after fighting for ego/self-respect). Assuming he has many more years to put in, I must warn him, now that he has hurt someone else's ego/self-respect, he has to be ultra-careful, more so in his dealings where the same man is concerned. After all, like his manager has erred today, Sandeep may also err tomorrow. After all, every one of us will err at some point in time.
The good thing will be not to pamper your ego. Easier said than done, of course.
From India, Pune
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Mr. Sandeep somewhere states about 'having learned...' (about getting results after fighting for ego/self-respect). Assuming he has many more years to put in, I must warn him, now that he has hurt someone else's ego/self-respect, he has to be ultra-careful, more so in his dealings where the same man is concerned. After all, like his manager has erred today, Sandeep may also err tomorrow. After all, every one of us will err at some point in time.
The good thing will be not to pamper your ego. Easier said than done, of course.
From India, Pune
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Corporate life, at times, may seem tougher than it appears to others in other fields. So long as your TL and those around you believe in your job knowledge, skills, and competency, please ignore such negative comments. It is okay that you were dull for a week and felt unhappy. Now push it behind you like somebody's nasty comments on the road by other road-users. Once you reach your destination, such comments will appear too insignificant. Some people resort to such writing to vent their disappointment, lost opportunity, etc. Ignore and move forward in life. You do not know how many more such situations may arise in your case. Develop a strong mind with a focus on your career and family! Best wishes
From India, Bengaluru
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From India, Bengaluru
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Dear Mr. NK Sundram,
One thing I am really not liking here in this forum is that everybody is saying to keep quiet, forget the incident, and focus on your work and career. For me, there is no fun in building a career where you have to compromise and allow others to bully. I am happy the way I am, and I am sure whoever is suggesting all this to me has really climbed to the ranks of CXOs in their respective fields by following these wonderful principles in their careers. Sorry, but I am from a different league altogether.
Happy to be me. Thanks.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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One thing I am really not liking here in this forum is that everybody is saying to keep quiet, forget the incident, and focus on your work and career. For me, there is no fun in building a career where you have to compromise and allow others to bully. I am happy the way I am, and I am sure whoever is suggesting all this to me has really climbed to the ranks of CXOs in their respective fields by following these wonderful principles in their careers. Sorry, but I am from a different league altogether.
Happy to be me. Thanks.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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Dear Nathrao,
When the querist is not ready to hear anything contrary to his wishes and egoistic attitude and has shown no restraint in rebuking any and every member of this forum, what is the fun in responding to his posts? He wants every member here to yield to his likes and dislikes when he asserts, "one thing I am really not liking here in this forum," as if he is the supreme boss over everyone here. He can't see his own deficiencies, especially when he defied the instructions of the Account Manager.
Since he managed to elicit an apology from the Account Manager, he probably thinks he is the wisest manager of this century. Clearly, the Account Manager was compelled by HR to apologize, rather than acknowledging his own defiance of the Account Manager's directives. If I were in the Account Manager's position, I would have made him aware of his true worth and the expected behavior in the organization. Furthermore, despite seeking advice from this forum, he has taken a hostile stance against its members. It seems he has forgotten that he voluntarily sought advice from the forum members.
Regardless, as he only values advice that aligns with his thoughts, whims, and fancies, I challenge him to take legal action against his company, as implied by the query's title, due to his dissatisfaction with an email from the account manager. He should face the consequences, as he seems to find no value in building a career and making compromises, especially since he claims to be from a different league altogether. He may attempt to hold the company accountable for an individual manager's actions, perhaps in a harsh manner, to highlight his defiant attitude.
While he had the right to disregard advice or suggestions, he had no right to disparage all the members of this forum with derogatory remarks, such as, "I am sure whoever is suggesting me all these have really grown to CXO's till now." He seemingly considers himself of high status compared to the rest of us.
He overlooks the fact that just as he values his personal reputation, the forum members also value their own and should not tolerate his derogatory remarks aimed at degrading all of us. If he values his self-respect, he should also respect others and reconsider his arrogant attitude towards everyone.
Sincerely, [Your Name]
From India, Delhi
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When the querist is not ready to hear anything contrary to his wishes and egoistic attitude and has shown no restraint in rebuking any and every member of this forum, what is the fun in responding to his posts? He wants every member here to yield to his likes and dislikes when he asserts, "one thing I am really not liking here in this forum," as if he is the supreme boss over everyone here. He can't see his own deficiencies, especially when he defied the instructions of the Account Manager.
Since he managed to elicit an apology from the Account Manager, he probably thinks he is the wisest manager of this century. Clearly, the Account Manager was compelled by HR to apologize, rather than acknowledging his own defiance of the Account Manager's directives. If I were in the Account Manager's position, I would have made him aware of his true worth and the expected behavior in the organization. Furthermore, despite seeking advice from this forum, he has taken a hostile stance against its members. It seems he has forgotten that he voluntarily sought advice from the forum members.
Regardless, as he only values advice that aligns with his thoughts, whims, and fancies, I challenge him to take legal action against his company, as implied by the query's title, due to his dissatisfaction with an email from the account manager. He should face the consequences, as he seems to find no value in building a career and making compromises, especially since he claims to be from a different league altogether. He may attempt to hold the company accountable for an individual manager's actions, perhaps in a harsh manner, to highlight his defiant attitude.
While he had the right to disregard advice or suggestions, he had no right to disparage all the members of this forum with derogatory remarks, such as, "I am sure whoever is suggesting me all these have really grown to CXO's till now." He seemingly considers himself of high status compared to the rest of us.
He overlooks the fact that just as he values his personal reputation, the forum members also value their own and should not tolerate his derogatory remarks aimed at degrading all of us. If he values his self-respect, he should also respect others and reconsider his arrogant attitude towards everyone.
Sincerely, [Your Name]
From India, Delhi
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Mr PSdhingra,
You are getting personal now and doing personal attacked as I chose to Ignore your points and still have got my dues.as told earlier that I am happy with my arrogant behaviour and have no intention to borrow anyone's attitude and sir yours toh definitely no. I liked the level of your frustration going up and these lines really show them up 'had I been in place of the Account Manager, I must have shown him his real worth and the way to behave in the organisation.’. I am still not getting why are you so upset with me. Anyway, if you want to show me my worth hire me if you can and I am ready to face you. In fact I started liking this shit.
It all started with a simple question. I updated that I do not like few ideas specially your sir PSdhingra but you are still feeling pleasure to come again every time and post your frustration. We are unnecessarily dragging this post. I got the honest and step by step suggestion what I was looking for, I got the outcome of it also, I also updated a thanks note to everyone and especially to you sir but still you love to come back and post in this thread. Save some time for yourself rather than responding to this thread please.
And to your last statements, sir please doesn’t respond to this thread and keep your self-respect intact. This is my thread and I have all the rights to reply to the responses I am getting. If I am not following any of the rules of the forum, Admin will for sure lock me out and delete this thread and yes sir I am arrogant and I am happy to be like. Unfortunately I am paid great enough to be humble to every random person.
Once again to everyone with all respect I can show, I got what I wanted from this threat but we are unnecessary getting driven to some other direction. Thanks one and all include PSdhingra sir for all your valuable time and suggestion.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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You are getting personal now and doing personal attacked as I chose to Ignore your points and still have got my dues.as told earlier that I am happy with my arrogant behaviour and have no intention to borrow anyone's attitude and sir yours toh definitely no. I liked the level of your frustration going up and these lines really show them up 'had I been in place of the Account Manager, I must have shown him his real worth and the way to behave in the organisation.’. I am still not getting why are you so upset with me. Anyway, if you want to show me my worth hire me if you can and I am ready to face you. In fact I started liking this shit.
It all started with a simple question. I updated that I do not like few ideas specially your sir PSdhingra but you are still feeling pleasure to come again every time and post your frustration. We are unnecessarily dragging this post. I got the honest and step by step suggestion what I was looking for, I got the outcome of it also, I also updated a thanks note to everyone and especially to you sir but still you love to come back and post in this thread. Save some time for yourself rather than responding to this thread please.
And to your last statements, sir please doesn’t respond to this thread and keep your self-respect intact. This is my thread and I have all the rights to reply to the responses I am getting. If I am not following any of the rules of the forum, Admin will for sure lock me out and delete this thread and yes sir I am arrogant and I am happy to be like. Unfortunately I am paid great enough to be humble to every random person.
Once again to everyone with all respect I can show, I got what I wanted from this threat but we are unnecessary getting driven to some other direction. Thanks one and all include PSdhingra sir for all your valuable time and suggestion.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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PSDhingra sir I post an apology to you if I have hurt you anywhere. Your experience and work to help people is beyond words. Sorry for everything.
From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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From United Kingdom, Cambridge
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Dear psdhingra,
Sandeep's question is very clear. If you know the steps that need to be taken, please inform him. Please don't tell him to adjust as this is a valid point for some people. He is here because he doesn't know what to do, so please don't degrade him; instead, help him out with the steps or simply provide the necessary guidance. The most important thing to remember is that ego has come in between your interactions.
Best Reply Credit goes to - Dinesh Divekar
Thanks,
Jagadish
From India, Bengaluru
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Sandeep's question is very clear. If you know the steps that need to be taken, please inform him. Please don't tell him to adjust as this is a valid point for some people. He is here because he doesn't know what to do, so please don't degrade him; instead, help him out with the steps or simply provide the necessary guidance. The most important thing to remember is that ego has come in between your interactions.
Best Reply Credit goes to - Dinesh Divekar
Thanks,
Jagadish
From India, Bengaluru
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For me, there is no fun in building a career where you have to compromise and allow others to bully. I am not advising anything to any of our members who have posted their valuable opinions here, but I wonder if it is possible to build a career without making compromises. To me, making compromises is part of life for everyone. Yes, one can definitely stand against bullying, but even in the army, there is something called 'strategic retreat' sometimes, if the ultimate goal is to advance!
From India, New Delhi
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From India, New Delhi
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Mr. Jagdish Krishiv,
Thanks for your advice through your very first post on this forum after your introduction. I feel obliged to you. Based on the facts narrated by him, I had already given my suggestion, whatever I thought was appropriate. Now, if you are aware that Sandeep's question is very clear and you did not like him to adjust, you are welcome to let him know if you know the steps that need to be taken by him.
So far as I know, he has already taken steps as per his own volition and also prefers not to take any advice from me.
From India, Delhi
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Thanks for your advice through your very first post on this forum after your introduction. I feel obliged to you. Based on the facts narrated by him, I had already given my suggestion, whatever I thought was appropriate. Now, if you are aware that Sandeep's question is very clear and you did not like him to adjust, you are welcome to let him know if you know the steps that need to be taken by him.
So far as I know, he has already taken steps as per his own volition and also prefers not to take any advice from me.
From India, Delhi
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Dear Sandeep,
Neither did I intend to seek an apology from you, nor were you obliged to tender one to me. Drawing from my extensive experience in both the Government and Corporate sectors, acquired throughout my service and into retirement, where I have encountered numerous cases involving friends, colleagues, and clients, my advice to you was genuinely selfless. I offered it with your future career prospects in mind.
Even if you were to apologize, it may not necessarily benefit your future career. The future is unpredictable, and events can unfold in ways that can either make or break one's career, influenced by individual attitudes. Despite this uncertainty, there are times when we must take precautions to mitigate potential future challenges through our own foresight, as the future remains beyond human control.
Maintaining a positive attitude can help foster friendships, while a negative outlook may lead to the creation of adversaries. Regardless, I wish you the best of luck.
Best regards,
From India, Delhi
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Neither did I intend to seek an apology from you, nor were you obliged to tender one to me. Drawing from my extensive experience in both the Government and Corporate sectors, acquired throughout my service and into retirement, where I have encountered numerous cases involving friends, colleagues, and clients, my advice to you was genuinely selfless. I offered it with your future career prospects in mind.
Even if you were to apologize, it may not necessarily benefit your future career. The future is unpredictable, and events can unfold in ways that can either make or break one's career, influenced by individual attitudes. Despite this uncertainty, there are times when we must take precautions to mitigate potential future challenges through our own foresight, as the future remains beyond human control.
Maintaining a positive attitude can help foster friendships, while a negative outlook may lead to the creation of adversaries. Regardless, I wish you the best of luck.
Best regards,
From India, Delhi
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Handbook on Sexual Harassment of Women at Workplace.pdf