Dear Sir,
Thanks and happy to see more participants to join in this discussion on Safety & health.
One important aspect of safety is to prevent accidents. For this if we take the Nature's advise, we can surely prevent accidents.
Accidents never comes all of sudden.
As per the Heinrich theory it precede incidents and near Misses.
But there is no mechanism in organization to collect the details of Near Miss and Incidents.
If this is possible and if we investigate the root cause analysis as we do in accident investigation, and take remedial measures then the accident will not occur.
I have myself analyzed the incidents from the occupational heath center registers, proved the theory of Heinrich which says that for every 29 incidents one accident happens.
The analysis proved that for every 27 to 29 incidents reported , there is one accident.
So let us give more important to incidents and near miss so that hte cost of accidents can be reduced.
Regards,
T.S.SRINIVASAN
From India, Pondicherry
3Thanks and happy to see more participants to join in this discussion on Safety & health.
One important aspect of safety is to prevent accidents. For this if we take the Nature's advise, we can surely prevent accidents.
Accidents never comes all of sudden.
As per the Heinrich theory it precede incidents and near Misses.
But there is no mechanism in organization to collect the details of Near Miss and Incidents.
If this is possible and if we investigate the root cause analysis as we do in accident investigation, and take remedial measures then the accident will not occur.
I have myself analyzed the incidents from the occupational heath center registers, proved the theory of Heinrich which says that for every 29 incidents one accident happens.
The analysis proved that for every 27 to 29 incidents reported , there is one accident.
So let us give more important to incidents and near miss so that hte cost of accidents can be reduced.
Regards,
T.S.SRINIVASAN
From India, Pondicherry
Dear TSS,
You have nicely said on the importance of taking all incidents and near misses seriously. You also brought to light the importance of root cause analysis. Heinrich is also brought into this and is appreciable.
Now can you just mention one case study from your experience giving how the investigation, and root cause analysis were carried out, your recommendations and how you could get the recommendations carried out and the like for others to gain some insight.
Can you also clarify on Heirich’s ratio of accidents. Is it --
1 accident to 29 incident or is it
1 fatal accident to every 29 major injury to 300 first aid cases or is it
1 major injury to 29 minor injuries to 300 near misses. .
Again have you ever wondered about the ratio 1 accident to 29 incidents remaining same without any change since Heinrich.
Hope you can put some more light on this issue !
Regards.
Kesava Pillai
From India, Kollam
You have nicely said on the importance of taking all incidents and near misses seriously. You also brought to light the importance of root cause analysis. Heinrich is also brought into this and is appreciable.
Now can you just mention one case study from your experience giving how the investigation, and root cause analysis were carried out, your recommendations and how you could get the recommendations carried out and the like for others to gain some insight.
Can you also clarify on Heirich’s ratio of accidents. Is it --
1 accident to 29 incident or is it
1 fatal accident to every 29 major injury to 300 first aid cases or is it
1 major injury to 29 minor injuries to 300 near misses. .
Again have you ever wondered about the ratio 1 accident to 29 incidents remaining same without any change since Heinrich.
Hope you can put some more light on this issue !
Regards.
Kesava Pillai
From India, Kollam
Dear Sir
In the Incidents Pyramid which I refer its stating as follows: Fatal being the top of pyramid.
1 = Fatal
30 = Lost Time Incident
300 = First Aid Cases
3000 = Near Miss
30000 = Unsafe Act and Condition
Is that the same Henrich point out years back. If so why these figures remaining unchanged?
Please give your valuable comments on the same.
From India
In the Incidents Pyramid which I refer its stating as follows: Fatal being the top of pyramid.
1 = Fatal
30 = Lost Time Incident
300 = First Aid Cases
3000 = Near Miss
30000 = Unsafe Act and Condition
Is that the same Henrich point out years back. If so why these figures remaining unchanged?
Please give your valuable comments on the same.
From India
Dear Boarders
I have come across many such postings pertaining to Preventing accidents and studying the causes of accidents.
Its great to read and participate in such discussions.
One contributor has mentioned about henrich's formula and stating that despite it why accidents are keep increasing.
here are the few vital facts and they are more so very much applicable to Indian scenario.
One of the key reason for the rising number of accidents is lackadaisical attitude towards adopting the safety measures and guidelines.
organizations just pretend to be more safety conscious but when the audits done and researches being conducted it is found that majority of Indian companies uses substandard equipments for safety and a real hullabaloo is created when accident does take place.
Safety norms are there but when we talk about Indian mindset then it is more of a Chalta hai kinda approach, kuchh nahi hoga, and it inspires the employees to follow short cuts for safety measures.
Periodical safety training programs should be conducted and after these programs there should be rigorous mock drills to be conducted so that it can be adopted by all about what to be done to prevent accidents and how to do the things so that fatalities should not occur.
The reality is most of companies ask for safety training for sake of their audit purposes, they want cheap quotations and training should be done no matter whether the trainings are of some quality or not.
Nothing happens in this country since we know that now we are more then 1.2 billion people and laws are very flexible.
most of the safety officers are found absent when safety trainings are conducted thinking that they know everything and its not applicable to them.
Every now and then safety guidelines are changing and they should be also known to Safety officers then only they can implement them.
American Heart association is keep changing such guidelines pertaining to First Aid and CPR and very few organisations must be aware of them.
why these guidelines are changing ...because researches are conducted and the right things are adopted on the basis of findings of such research.
In some cases organisations do have sophisticated equipments but irony is majority of employees do not know how to operate those equipments at the time of crisis or accidents.
One simple example which i am quoting here is and it is bases on my own research and findings is that when ever you ask any employee about what he will do if he find a person not breathing and there is no pulse- the simple answer is i will call the doctor or run for doctor....just imagine how much time it takes for a person to die in the absence of oxygen......Ok it is nearly 5 minutes and if no oxygen provided then person will die due to severe irreversible damage to the brain tissue.
In Indian Scenario it is difficult to communicate a doctor or evacuate a person with Cardiac arrest within 5 minutes...so important is to increase the awareness of people about First Aid and regular exercises should be conducted to make them confident.
After all Murphy's law is very correct and accidents if at all occurs it should be our approach about how to reduce the severity of those accidents.
Employees are the priciest asset of any organization and if their fatalities are minimized then we are done with our aim of safety.
From India, Bangalore
I have come across many such postings pertaining to Preventing accidents and studying the causes of accidents.
Its great to read and participate in such discussions.
One contributor has mentioned about henrich's formula and stating that despite it why accidents are keep increasing.
here are the few vital facts and they are more so very much applicable to Indian scenario.
One of the key reason for the rising number of accidents is lackadaisical attitude towards adopting the safety measures and guidelines.
organizations just pretend to be more safety conscious but when the audits done and researches being conducted it is found that majority of Indian companies uses substandard equipments for safety and a real hullabaloo is created when accident does take place.
Safety norms are there but when we talk about Indian mindset then it is more of a Chalta hai kinda approach, kuchh nahi hoga, and it inspires the employees to follow short cuts for safety measures.
Periodical safety training programs should be conducted and after these programs there should be rigorous mock drills to be conducted so that it can be adopted by all about what to be done to prevent accidents and how to do the things so that fatalities should not occur.
The reality is most of companies ask for safety training for sake of their audit purposes, they want cheap quotations and training should be done no matter whether the trainings are of some quality or not.
Nothing happens in this country since we know that now we are more then 1.2 billion people and laws are very flexible.
most of the safety officers are found absent when safety trainings are conducted thinking that they know everything and its not applicable to them.
Every now and then safety guidelines are changing and they should be also known to Safety officers then only they can implement them.
American Heart association is keep changing such guidelines pertaining to First Aid and CPR and very few organisations must be aware of them.
why these guidelines are changing ...because researches are conducted and the right things are adopted on the basis of findings of such research.
In some cases organisations do have sophisticated equipments but irony is majority of employees do not know how to operate those equipments at the time of crisis or accidents.
One simple example which i am quoting here is and it is bases on my own research and findings is that when ever you ask any employee about what he will do if he find a person not breathing and there is no pulse- the simple answer is i will call the doctor or run for doctor....just imagine how much time it takes for a person to die in the absence of oxygen......Ok it is nearly 5 minutes and if no oxygen provided then person will die due to severe irreversible damage to the brain tissue.
In Indian Scenario it is difficult to communicate a doctor or evacuate a person with Cardiac arrest within 5 minutes...so important is to increase the awareness of people about First Aid and regular exercises should be conducted to make them confident.
After all Murphy's law is very correct and accidents if at all occurs it should be our approach about how to reduce the severity of those accidents.
Employees are the priciest asset of any organization and if their fatalities are minimized then we are done with our aim of safety.
From India, Bangalore
Dear seniors,safety professional,friends,
Kindly send me the safe work practice in manufacturing industy who work with automation machine,CNC,Hydraulic and pneumatic press tools,etc.,
and also safety ppt.
and particularly send me the accident or incident register draft in EXCEL format.
its urgent.
plsease send me it to my personal:
becoz many of the data is not possible for me to download
expecting your reply
please do the needful
Thanks
Regards
A.Shanmuganthan
0091 - 9941211503
From India, Pondicherry
Kindly send me the safe work practice in manufacturing industy who work with automation machine,CNC,Hydraulic and pneumatic press tools,etc.,
and also safety ppt.
and particularly send me the accident or incident register draft in EXCEL format.
its urgent.
plsease send me it to my personal:
becoz many of the data is not possible for me to download
expecting your reply
please do the needful
Thanks
Regards
A.Shanmuganthan
0091 - 9941211503
From India, Pondicherry
Dear Sir,
The Near Miss is one where no injury has happened. That is 300. This may by one individual or the type is being done by all others.
The incidents is what we call minor accidents, getting first aid or getting treatment in occupational health center and immediately return to duty.
I have verified this aspect taking about 20 years of data which we collected to discussion our safety committee.
The results showed after every 27 to 29 minor accidents one major reportable accident has happened.
We had also improved our safety performance by investigating the minor accidents and implement necessary corrective measures.
Normally organizations do investigations only for reportable accidents which is mandatory.
If minor accidents or incidents are investigated, one can improve safety performance.
The Heinrich is really verified theory.
Nature is giving us enough warning.
300 near miss happened,if no action is taken then incidents will happen. If after 29 incidents if you do not take any action it will lead to one major accidents. This theory is still valid which i have verified.
regards,
T.S.SRINIVASAN
From India, Pondicherry
The Near Miss is one where no injury has happened. That is 300. This may by one individual or the type is being done by all others.
The incidents is what we call minor accidents, getting first aid or getting treatment in occupational health center and immediately return to duty.
I have verified this aspect taking about 20 years of data which we collected to discussion our safety committee.
The results showed after every 27 to 29 minor accidents one major reportable accident has happened.
We had also improved our safety performance by investigating the minor accidents and implement necessary corrective measures.
Normally organizations do investigations only for reportable accidents which is mandatory.
If minor accidents or incidents are investigated, one can improve safety performance.
The Heinrich is really verified theory.
Nature is giving us enough warning.
300 near miss happened,if no action is taken then incidents will happen. If after 29 incidents if you do not take any action it will lead to one major accidents. This theory is still valid which i have verified.
regards,
T.S.SRINIVASAN
From India, Pondicherry
@ravelove
Nice to go through your write up...
As you asid Indian Industries do have Chalta hai attitude when safety comes... But the scenario is changing... The only thing is that it's changing dead slowly...
Nowadays corporate companies realise the value of safety and giving utmost care... It's not only for conducting a successful Safety Audit, but for implementing in a sustainabe basis...
Moreover nowadays the concept of Safety is wide spreading in such a way that even a market investor before going to buy a share, just coparing all the aspects of the company, which includes safety also... So things will definilty improve...
Just hope for the best and prepeare for the worst... Only thing, do our part sincerly for the sake of this divine career...
Hope to get your continous participation into the forum discussions...
@ T.S Srinivasan
Thanks for your explanations regarding the incident pyramid and the henrich theory...
Lets keep up the pace and do participate into the discussions and share your expertise with us...
From India
Nice to go through your write up...
As you asid Indian Industries do have Chalta hai attitude when safety comes... But the scenario is changing... The only thing is that it's changing dead slowly...
Nowadays corporate companies realise the value of safety and giving utmost care... It's not only for conducting a successful Safety Audit, but for implementing in a sustainabe basis...
Moreover nowadays the concept of Safety is wide spreading in such a way that even a market investor before going to buy a share, just coparing all the aspects of the company, which includes safety also... So things will definilty improve...
Just hope for the best and prepeare for the worst... Only thing, do our part sincerly for the sake of this divine career...
Hope to get your continous participation into the forum discussions...
@ T.S Srinivasan
Thanks for your explanations regarding the incident pyramid and the henrich theory...
Lets keep up the pace and do participate into the discussions and share your expertise with us...
From India
Dear Boarders
Its pertaining to my write up on this discussion and subsequent replies by fellows.
Its right and i am too experiencing the same that awareness towards safety is increasing among masses. The need of the hour is to analyse why there are large number of accidents occurring every year in the industrial scenario and despite so many efforts we are still not able to check the fatalities. here comes what i mentioned in my earlier note is that we have to do the introspection and surely we will find that its not the equipments, its not the infrastructure but it is the mindset and our poor approach that causes majority of accidents and add to it poor planning leads to fatalities.
Whatever i am quoting here is based on my research and i have myself witnessed it almost every time i go to industries and take sessions there that there are Safety plans, Evacuation plan, Emergency preparedness drills, there are safety equipments in place but irony is when i ask the employees i most of the time gets blank from them. At the time of accidents what actions are to be taken by employees, even people do not know where the emergency exit routes exists. As i have mentioned that people just say i will try to call a doctor in case of accident but he himself doesn't know that his own efforts are more vital for saving the life of injured.
Its all about learning and bringing this learning into behavior. perception and attitude of employees can be moulded according to the organizational requirements since every individual has to adopt the organizational culture.
Learning can take place in many ways and when we want to achieve that the behavioral change should take place then it can best be done by repetition and reinforcement. Trial and error is also a way for learning but industries can not afford it and some times the nature of work in the industries can cause catastrophe if we apply trial and error way.
So moral is we must plan the training and ensure the training program in such a way that positive presence of key employees is there and soon after the training there should be repetitive sessions and case discussions with mock drills to be conducted and we can reduce accidents. Mock drills are very essential and they should be treated as real case scenario with active participation of employees just like defence forces carry out drills
Thanx& Regards
RP Singh
Basic and Advance Cardiac Life Support Trainer( American Heart Association), First Aid trainer
Safepro.co.in
76209582102
From India, Bangalore
Its pertaining to my write up on this discussion and subsequent replies by fellows.
Its right and i am too experiencing the same that awareness towards safety is increasing among masses. The need of the hour is to analyse why there are large number of accidents occurring every year in the industrial scenario and despite so many efforts we are still not able to check the fatalities. here comes what i mentioned in my earlier note is that we have to do the introspection and surely we will find that its not the equipments, its not the infrastructure but it is the mindset and our poor approach that causes majority of accidents and add to it poor planning leads to fatalities.
Whatever i am quoting here is based on my research and i have myself witnessed it almost every time i go to industries and take sessions there that there are Safety plans, Evacuation plan, Emergency preparedness drills, there are safety equipments in place but irony is when i ask the employees i most of the time gets blank from them. At the time of accidents what actions are to be taken by employees, even people do not know where the emergency exit routes exists. As i have mentioned that people just say i will try to call a doctor in case of accident but he himself doesn't know that his own efforts are more vital for saving the life of injured.
Its all about learning and bringing this learning into behavior. perception and attitude of employees can be moulded according to the organizational requirements since every individual has to adopt the organizational culture.
Learning can take place in many ways and when we want to achieve that the behavioral change should take place then it can best be done by repetition and reinforcement. Trial and error is also a way for learning but industries can not afford it and some times the nature of work in the industries can cause catastrophe if we apply trial and error way.
So moral is we must plan the training and ensure the training program in such a way that positive presence of key employees is there and soon after the training there should be repetitive sessions and case discussions with mock drills to be conducted and we can reduce accidents. Mock drills are very essential and they should be treated as real case scenario with active participation of employees just like defence forces carry out drills
Thanx& Regards
RP Singh
Basic and Advance Cardiac Life Support Trainer( American Heart Association), First Aid trainer
Safepro.co.in
76209582102
From India, Bangalore
@RP Singh
I am agreeing to your point emphosising the need of imparting quality training... This is one of the key area which will help in reduction of accident...
When comes to Mock Drills what comes in my mind is "NATO"...No Actions, Talk Only... Everything is 100% on paper... This situation really needs improvement... Eventhough the Mock Drills conducting, the periodicity is very less...
Lets do our part sincerly...
Keep on sharing your expertise with us...
From India
I am agreeing to your point emphosising the need of imparting quality training... This is one of the key area which will help in reduction of accident...
When comes to Mock Drills what comes in my mind is "NATO"...No Actions, Talk Only... Everything is 100% on paper... This situation really needs improvement... Eventhough the Mock Drills conducting, the periodicity is very less...
Lets do our part sincerly...
Keep on sharing your expertise with us...
From India
Dear all,
Sorry for the late reply/response.
Really its hot discussion special thanks to Mr.srinivasan came with marvelous topic.
Dear revelove/RP Singh,
Nice / Excellent explanation
keep sharing. . .
Thanks & Besafe
Raghu
"I am not totally waste/useless I am used as a bad example"
From United States, Fpo
Sorry for the late reply/response.
Really its hot discussion special thanks to Mr.srinivasan came with marvelous topic.
Dear revelove/RP Singh,
Nice / Excellent explanation
keep sharing. . .
Thanks & Besafe
Raghu
"I am not totally waste/useless I am used as a bad example"
From United States, Fpo
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