Dear Consultants,
I do agree with your point.yes most of the corporate HRs feel like they are supremos.
but i have seen most of the HRs I had worked for the past 15 years , who can not distiguish difference between different tools, softwares and technologies.
Let me take a real example , when I am working with IGATE Bangalore as a Manager 5 years back, there is a HR (Agarwal) and she always shortlist the candidates with knowledge and not experienced where as the requirement is for experienced in automation tools in software testing(she does not know even the difference between functional and performance testing),But I am totally flattered with her people management and negotiation skill set(nobody beats her in HR world).
One of the comments by HR(Shaunak) above says How do you consider a smart HR(by considering a person who joined corporate company) what are the parameters you considered, what are the qualifications you require.
what sort of HR practices you have in mind to consider.Don't underestimate the MBa graduates and remember if they are not sourcing the profiles in time with their hard work and determination, corporates can not move ahead with their projects(for feed back you refer the infosys Hyderabad,HR department, how the consultancies are playing a key role in their department).
before criticizing the consultants, keep in mind that they are your supporters and you can not reach your targets in time with out them (this is 100% sure)(can you show me one MNC without using consultancies who had reached their 100% target in sourcing the manpower in time.)
I request all HRs once again DO NOT DO NOT Criticize consultants and don't underestimate their talents,Moreover if you want to criticize review yours.
Thanks and Regards
Vijay Raghavan
Delivery Head
IVS Practice
Infosys
Chennai
From India, Pune
I do agree with your point.yes most of the corporate HRs feel like they are supremos.
but i have seen most of the HRs I had worked for the past 15 years , who can not distiguish difference between different tools, softwares and technologies.
Let me take a real example , when I am working with IGATE Bangalore as a Manager 5 years back, there is a HR (Agarwal) and she always shortlist the candidates with knowledge and not experienced where as the requirement is for experienced in automation tools in software testing(she does not know even the difference between functional and performance testing),But I am totally flattered with her people management and negotiation skill set(nobody beats her in HR world).
One of the comments by HR(Shaunak) above says How do you consider a smart HR(by considering a person who joined corporate company) what are the parameters you considered, what are the qualifications you require.
what sort of HR practices you have in mind to consider.Don't underestimate the MBa graduates and remember if they are not sourcing the profiles in time with their hard work and determination, corporates can not move ahead with their projects(for feed back you refer the infosys Hyderabad,HR department, how the consultancies are playing a key role in their department).
before criticizing the consultants, keep in mind that they are your supporters and you can not reach your targets in time with out them (this is 100% sure)(can you show me one MNC without using consultancies who had reached their 100% target in sourcing the manpower in time.)
I request all HRs once again DO NOT DO NOT Criticize consultants and don't underestimate their talents,Moreover if you want to criticize review yours.
Thanks and Regards
Vijay Raghavan
Delivery Head
IVS Practice
Infosys
Chennai
From India, Pune
Dear Divya
Thanks for your post.
I wish we could have more HR professionals like you who are sensitive & mature to see other's point of views. Whose sense of professionalism extends beyond a narrow view of HR as a chore. I am sure you keep in mind the "Human" in the HR.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
4Thanks for your post.
I wish we could have more HR professionals like you who are sensitive & mature to see other's point of views. Whose sense of professionalism extends beyond a narrow view of HR as a chore. I am sure you keep in mind the "Human" in the HR.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Dear Rashmi
Thanks for your post.
The corporate HR needs to think about the consultants more as partners & associates who share their burdens of delivering the right corporate image amongst prospective employees.
All said and done they of all the people should not forget the "Human" in the HR
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Thanks for your post.
The corporate HR needs to think about the consultants more as partners & associates who share their burdens of delivering the right corporate image amongst prospective employees.
All said and done they of all the people should not forget the "Human" in the HR
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Dear Shaunak
Thanks for your post and your valuable views.
Your First Two points 1 & 2.
Most of the professions have a career path which goes from the first rung to the Top rung. The same can be said about the level & size of the companies an average profesional proceeds to join in his career path (Let's leave the Top lot from IIT's / IIM's and other Top of the line Insitutes)
1. The "Jump" you are talking about was possible only because the Fresher earned his HR stripes at a consultancy. He became worthy enough to be recruited by a corporate with the experience he gained at the consultancy. I have been appraoched by B.E.'s / B.Tech's and MBA's for a job in our consultancy who wanted to enter HR field. So I can safely assume that entry in Consultancies is easier and gives a good work exposure to the Fresher which is worthy of a notice from the corporates.
2. The "Smart MBA" you are talking about is academically bright passing out from a good B School. What about the thousands of others who may not be as bright but have a right to a dignified job too.
I agree the Job market is favourable to Bright people but others too have the right to work with dignity.
There may be grace in admitting that others are more talented & hardworking and because of that they reached where they are. But I find no grace in bearing arrogant & unreasonable behaviour of anyone who just happens to be / is lucky to be in a place of authority. This I'll call exploitation.
My backdrop / Background is nothing apart from the sad situation all the Good & competent consultants are in beacause of Bad corporate HR & Bad Recruitment consutlants. We are suffering fools & I don't want to do that gladly.
Your suggestion of going to the Top brass of HR is good, but then you risk antagonizing the rank & file and loose the Job Orders.
Remember , even the Top brass is depending on these people to deliver for them and make them look good. They are the one's who may have seleced them in the first place! So I see little hope.
In our case we try ironing out the situation with a professional approach and then dump the client if they don't act professionally.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Thanks for your post and your valuable views.
Your First Two points 1 & 2.
Most of the professions have a career path which goes from the first rung to the Top rung. The same can be said about the level & size of the companies an average profesional proceeds to join in his career path (Let's leave the Top lot from IIT's / IIM's and other Top of the line Insitutes)
1. The "Jump" you are talking about was possible only because the Fresher earned his HR stripes at a consultancy. He became worthy enough to be recruited by a corporate with the experience he gained at the consultancy. I have been appraoched by B.E.'s / B.Tech's and MBA's for a job in our consultancy who wanted to enter HR field. So I can safely assume that entry in Consultancies is easier and gives a good work exposure to the Fresher which is worthy of a notice from the corporates.
2. The "Smart MBA" you are talking about is academically bright passing out from a good B School. What about the thousands of others who may not be as bright but have a right to a dignified job too.
I agree the Job market is favourable to Bright people but others too have the right to work with dignity.
There may be grace in admitting that others are more talented & hardworking and because of that they reached where they are. But I find no grace in bearing arrogant & unreasonable behaviour of anyone who just happens to be / is lucky to be in a place of authority. This I'll call exploitation.
- There is no dearth of people who favour the Big & Powerful. It is easy to do!
- There is no dearth of people who accept & tolerate their arrogance becuase they have an "upper hand".
- There is no dearth of people who take their humiliation with a "Pinch of Salt".
My backdrop / Background is nothing apart from the sad situation all the Good & competent consultants are in beacause of Bad corporate HR & Bad Recruitment consutlants. We are suffering fools & I don't want to do that gladly.
Your suggestion of going to the Top brass of HR is good, but then you risk antagonizing the rank & file and loose the Job Orders.
Remember , even the Top brass is depending on these people to deliver for them and make them look good. They are the one's who may have seleced them in the first place! So I see little hope.
In our case we try ironing out the situation with a professional approach and then dump the client if they don't act professionally.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Dear Shaunak
Thanks for your post and your valuable views.
Your First Two points 1 & 2.
Most of the professions have a career path which goes from the first rung to the Top rung. The same can be said about the level & size of the companies an average profesional proceeds to join in his career path (Let's leave the Top lot from IIT's / IIM's and other Top of the line Insitutes)
1. The "Jump" you are talking about was possible only because the Fresher earned his HR stripes at a consultancy. He became worthy enough to be recruited by a corporate with the experience he gained at the consultancy. I have been appraoched by B.E.'s / B.Tech's and MBA's for a job in our consultancy who wanted to enter HR field. So I can safely assume that entry in Consultancies is easier and gives a good work exposure to the Fresher which is worthy of a notice from the corporates.
2. The "Smart MBA" you are talking about is academically bright passing out from a good B School. What about the thousands of others who may not be as bright but have a right to a dignified job too.
I agree the Job market is favourable to Bright people but others too have the right to work with dignity.
There may be grace in admitting that others are more talented & hardworking and because of that they reached where they are. But I find no grace in bearing arrogant & unreasonable behaviour of anyone who just happens to be / is lucky to be in a place of authority. This I'll call exploitation.
My backdrop / Background is nothing apart from the sad situation all the Good & competent consultants are in beacause of Bad corporate HR & Bad Recruitment consutlants. We are suffering fools & I don't want to do that gladly.
Your suggestion of going to the Top brass of HR is good, but then you risk antagonizing the rank & file and loose the Job Orders.
Remember , even the Top brass is depending on these people to deliver for them and make them look good. They are the one's who may have seleced them in the first place! So I see little hope.
In our case we try ironing out the situation with a professional approach and then dump the client if they don't act professionally.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Thanks for your post and your valuable views.
Your First Two points 1 & 2.
Most of the professions have a career path which goes from the first rung to the Top rung. The same can be said about the level & size of the companies an average profesional proceeds to join in his career path (Let's leave the Top lot from IIT's / IIM's and other Top of the line Insitutes)
1. The "Jump" you are talking about was possible only because the Fresher earned his HR stripes at a consultancy. He became worthy enough to be recruited by a corporate with the experience he gained at the consultancy. I have been appraoched by B.E.'s / B.Tech's and MBA's for a job in our consultancy who wanted to enter HR field. So I can safely assume that entry in Consultancies is easier and gives a good work exposure to the Fresher which is worthy of a notice from the corporates.
2. The "Smart MBA" you are talking about is academically bright passing out from a good B School. What about the thousands of others who may not be as bright but have a right to a dignified job too.
I agree the Job market is favourable to Bright people but others too have the right to work with dignity.
There may be grace in admitting that others are more talented & hardworking and because of that they reached where they are. But I find no grace in bearing arrogant & unreasonable behaviour of anyone who just happens to be / is lucky to be in a place of authority. This I'll call exploitation.
- There is no dearth of people who favour the Big & Powerful. It is easy to do!
- There is no dearth of people who accept & tolerate their arrogance becuase they have an "upper hand".
- There is no dearth of people who take their humiliation with a "Pinch of Salt".
My backdrop / Background is nothing apart from the sad situation all the Good & competent consultants are in beacause of Bad corporate HR & Bad Recruitment consutlants. We are suffering fools & I don't want to do that gladly.
Your suggestion of going to the Top brass of HR is good, but then you risk antagonizing the rank & file and loose the Job Orders.
Remember , even the Top brass is depending on these people to deliver for them and make them look good. They are the one's who may have seleced them in the first place! So I see little hope.
In our case we try ironing out the situation with a professional approach and then dump the client if they don't act professionally.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Dear Asha
Thanks for the post.
Most of your points are an excellent insight into how things are at present.
The problem is that some of extremely competent & professional Consultants are meted out the same treatment despite proving their professionalism in handling recruitments, promoting Employer branding etc. We don't bug the client for feedbacks have extremely competent & mature Consultants. We follow extremely client sensitive processes...
What do we do with these HR managers who do not know their Job. One of the AGM's of a leading Telecom company once gave us just the designation and expected us to find suitbale candidates. On asking about the KRA's , JD, Candidate profile, Reporting structure and other competencies we should keep in mind, he was clue less. He boasts of 7 yrs in the Telecom HR !!
What do we do with him??
What about bad behaviour & discourtesy meted out to even senior candidates at the corporate offices , leave alone junio candidates..Now I guess onus of spoiling Employer branding is on the corporate HR's & theri policies!!
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Thanks for the post.
Most of your points are an excellent insight into how things are at present.
The problem is that some of extremely competent & professional Consultants are meted out the same treatment despite proving their professionalism in handling recruitments, promoting Employer branding etc. We don't bug the client for feedbacks have extremely competent & mature Consultants. We follow extremely client sensitive processes...
What do we do with these HR managers who do not know their Job. One of the AGM's of a leading Telecom company once gave us just the designation and expected us to find suitbale candidates. On asking about the KRA's , JD, Candidate profile, Reporting structure and other competencies we should keep in mind, he was clue less. He boasts of 7 yrs in the Telecom HR !!
What do we do with him??
What about bad behaviour & discourtesy meted out to even senior candidates at the corporate offices , leave alone junio candidates..Now I guess onus of spoiling Employer branding is on the corporate HR's & theri policies!!
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Dear Tony
Thanks for your post & views.
You are right. It basically boils down to the instinct of feeding the ego. I pity those with a false sense of importance & big Egos as it is a surefire sign of over compensating for a sense of inferiority & worthlessness.
I haven't seen any self assured, person with bloated ego.
Let's pray that god be with them and show them a way to respect themselves despite their shortcomings!
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Thanks for your post & views.
You are right. It basically boils down to the instinct of feeding the ego. I pity those with a false sense of importance & big Egos as it is a surefire sign of over compensating for a sense of inferiority & worthlessness.
I haven't seen any self assured, person with bloated ego.
Let's pray that god be with them and show them a way to respect themselves despite their shortcomings!
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Dear VJ
Thanks for your post and views.
What a marvellous and positve attitude you have towards the situation!! I salute your positve spirit and learn a lesson from it today. It sure was heart warming little post :)
Please keep the same spirit up if & when you join the corporate. Please select your consultants carefully & extend them the professional courtesy they are worthy of.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Thanks for your post and views.
What a marvellous and positve attitude you have towards the situation!! I salute your positve spirit and learn a lesson from it today. It sure was heart warming little post :)
Please keep the same spirit up if & when you join the corporate. Please select your consultants carefully & extend them the professional courtesy they are worthy of.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Dear Ashlesha
Thanks for your post & views.
I realize that there may not be many consultants who are just "Shops". But the onus of selecting the right consultant after a proper meeting & understading of the consultants competencies & professionalism lies with the corporate HR.
Why do the Corporate HR hire such vendors in the first place. Are they not competent in selecting the vendors? I don't think it is such a big & complicated task.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Thanks for your post & views.
I realize that there may not be many consultants who are just "Shops". But the onus of selecting the right consultant after a proper meeting & understading of the consultants competencies & professionalism lies with the corporate HR.
Why do the Corporate HR hire such vendors in the first place. Are they not competent in selecting the vendors? I don't think it is such a big & complicated task.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Dear Niku
Thanks for your post & forthright views.
I agree with most of what you have said. I just want to raise the issue of a Human courtsey which should be extended to the consultants ( If not professional courtsey). Good consultants just need a level playing & ethical treatment.
Considering hypthetically that the Corporate HR is the more evolved of the species, more educated, more civilized etc, a basic courtsey is all the more expected.
This is what the issue is baout. - Extending basic courtsies to maintain a good working relationship with Good consultants. If the consultant is not professional, discontinue his services by all means.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
Thanks for your post & forthright views.
I agree with most of what you have said. I just want to raise the issue of a Human courtsey which should be extended to the consultants ( If not professional courtsey). Good consultants just need a level playing & ethical treatment.
Considering hypthetically that the Corporate HR is the more evolved of the species, more educated, more civilized etc, a basic courtsey is all the more expected.
This is what the issue is baout. - Extending basic courtsies to maintain a good working relationship with Good consultants. If the consultant is not professional, discontinue his services by all means.
Good HR Associates
From India, Chandigarh
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