Dear Viraj,
You are right,they said its against poilcy so only they are terminating them.Hr didnt asked anything only they asked apology letter and getting that they got thier id card and asked them leave.the next day they told that had internal discussion based on that they have terminated.in just 2 days just like that they terminated them and asked them to put the resignation paper.they refused apply for resignation then HR threatened them that they wont get experience certificate unless they themself resign.So on fear they applied for resignation.
Please tel the procedure clearly to send letter to the labour comissioneer. please PM your mail id
From India, Madras
1You are right,they said its against poilcy so only they are terminating them.Hr didnt asked anything only they asked apology letter and getting that they got thier id card and asked them leave.the next day they told that had internal discussion based on that they have terminated.in just 2 days just like that they terminated them and asked them to put the resignation paper.they refused apply for resignation then HR threatened them that they wont get experience certificate unless they themself resign.So on fear they applied for resignation.
Please tel the procedure clearly to send letter to the labour comissioneer. please PM your mail id
From India, Madras
Dear Viraj
I can understand why abksatara suggested it. In a software firm the environment remains sensitive. Even very little behaviour comes under the scanner. The HR’s have to be doubly sure of employee behaviour in office premises. It sets the code of conduct for them.
I have handled a situation where it was a husband and a wife, who couldn’t stop fighting even during work hours. We had transferred them to different locations and warned on maintaining a personal decorum.
Please don’t find this chaperoning. This is a must to set the environment right. One outburst would lead to another and no sooner it would run out of everyone's hand. Worst is when someone else complain about such behaviour at office. It leaves no room for HR, other than setting the code right.
I would agree with abksatara , and request the professionals to learn a lesson from this. We all go through our emotional problems, but then we remain objective and follow the decorum in office.
The legal proceeding that you are suggesting may initiate the dialogue with HR, but not necessarily solve the problem and get their jobs back. They will still need this HR to give a positive feedback about them when they apply in some other organization. Please look beyond the instant situation and suggest a long term solution to them. If they have been terminated on disciplinary grounds, its difficult for them to be rehired.
Mani, I would suggest your friends to remains apologetic for what they have done. After 10 months of working in an environment, they should not have allowed this slip up. Every action we do in our workplaces reflects our effectiveness and creates credibility. It builds on our reputation which remains sensitive to such reactions.
Please do remember, just as we are rewarded with more responsibility when some of our initiatives work. Similarly, we are axed due to our attitudes we unmindfully end up showing.
This is still a small price to pay for what they are learning for life. Please do value the learning and focus on the future. I wish them all the best and believe they would now make a meaningful and a successful carrier.
Regards,
(Cite Contribution)
From India, Mumbai
I can understand why abksatara suggested it. In a software firm the environment remains sensitive. Even very little behaviour comes under the scanner. The HR’s have to be doubly sure of employee behaviour in office premises. It sets the code of conduct for them.
I have handled a situation where it was a husband and a wife, who couldn’t stop fighting even during work hours. We had transferred them to different locations and warned on maintaining a personal decorum.
Please don’t find this chaperoning. This is a must to set the environment right. One outburst would lead to another and no sooner it would run out of everyone's hand. Worst is when someone else complain about such behaviour at office. It leaves no room for HR, other than setting the code right.
I would agree with abksatara , and request the professionals to learn a lesson from this. We all go through our emotional problems, but then we remain objective and follow the decorum in office.
The legal proceeding that you are suggesting may initiate the dialogue with HR, but not necessarily solve the problem and get their jobs back. They will still need this HR to give a positive feedback about them when they apply in some other organization. Please look beyond the instant situation and suggest a long term solution to them. If they have been terminated on disciplinary grounds, its difficult for them to be rehired.
Mani, I would suggest your friends to remains apologetic for what they have done. After 10 months of working in an environment, they should not have allowed this slip up. Every action we do in our workplaces reflects our effectiveness and creates credibility. It builds on our reputation which remains sensitive to such reactions.
Please do remember, just as we are rewarded with more responsibility when some of our initiatives work. Similarly, we are axed due to our attitudes we unmindfully end up showing.
This is still a small price to pay for what they are learning for life. Please do value the learning and focus on the future. I wish them all the best and believe they would now make a meaningful and a successful carrier.
Regards,
(Cite Contribution)
From India, Mumbai
Dear ,
I'm not telling they dont deserve punishment.they deserve a punishment but my question is that do they have to be punished this severe?being in IT field you very well know how hard its to find job with less than 1 year experience.you have said that you handled similar situation,but why you didnt terminate the husband and wife instead of re locating them? they could have suspened them,but termination is harsh.
From India, Madras
I'm not telling they dont deserve punishment.they deserve a punishment but my question is that do they have to be punished this severe?being in IT field you very well know how hard its to find job with less than 1 year experience.you have said that you handled similar situation,but why you didnt terminate the husband and wife instead of re locating them? they could have suspened them,but termination is harsh.
From India, Madras
Greetings,
The action taken is entirely the HR's prerogative. In our case, it was a huge organisation, we had an option to relocate the husband. What if that option wasn’t there for us? It was purely incidental that we acted differently. The intention was same.
I am not denying that it’s difficult to get a job with lower experience, but it’s not impossible. Infact they stand a better chance now. Please suggest them to target the smaller firms. Though they would be treated as fresher’s, but hired easily as they have experience and a brand to cash on. They may not be offered as high salary as they were earning, but let them join.
In the long term with more certifications and experience they can make an entry to the Tier -1 levels. Infact, this would act in their favour as they would be able to join in higher levels than working through the roles in the same organization. In smaller organization, people take more responsibility and manage more specialised jobs. They need to focus on stability in a small firm and that would make it work for them in the long term.
I have a separate concern about them and that is background verification. They should be able to clear it, only if they can maintain the HR's sympathy.
You are their friend so please help them out with it. Let them use the contacts of other leaders such as their faculties and friends like you, who can vouch for their credibility.
Regards,
(Cite Contribution)
From India, Mumbai
The action taken is entirely the HR's prerogative. In our case, it was a huge organisation, we had an option to relocate the husband. What if that option wasn’t there for us? It was purely incidental that we acted differently. The intention was same.
I am not denying that it’s difficult to get a job with lower experience, but it’s not impossible. Infact they stand a better chance now. Please suggest them to target the smaller firms. Though they would be treated as fresher’s, but hired easily as they have experience and a brand to cash on. They may not be offered as high salary as they were earning, but let them join.
In the long term with more certifications and experience they can make an entry to the Tier -1 levels. Infact, this would act in their favour as they would be able to join in higher levels than working through the roles in the same organization. In smaller organization, people take more responsibility and manage more specialised jobs. They need to focus on stability in a small firm and that would make it work for them in the long term.
I have a separate concern about them and that is background verification. They should be able to clear it, only if they can maintain the HR's sympathy.
You are their friend so please help them out with it. Let them use the contacts of other leaders such as their faculties and friends like you, who can vouch for their credibility.
Regards,
(Cite Contribution)
From India, Mumbai
Ridiculous. If the HR thought abt both of their future, he/she should not have given such a cruel punishment. A HR should be concerned abt the employees also...............
From India, Coimbatore
From India, Coimbatore
Dear All
Punishment for Assaulting co-worker at the workplace while on duty
The employer-employee relationship is and should be governed by the legal/statutory provisions specifically laid down by either the Industrial Employment (Standing Orders) Act or by the respective Shops & Establishment Act and not by the whims and fancies of Any Manager in the Establishment.
The Acts indicate the Acts of misconducts for which the employee is liable to disciplinary action. The Honorable Supreme Court of India has long ago unambiguously defined what all could constitute Act of misconduct.
The incident reported to management in this case amount to Act of grave misconduct irrespective of the fact that no complaint whatsoever - written or verbal - was lodged / made by the victim -the female employee in the case.
The management should have conducted proper preliminary inquiry to ascertain whether there was prima facie reason to proceed further and should have issued proper charge-sheet to the employee for assaulting his colleague.
On receipt of his explanation, the management should have ordered an inquiry as per procedure laid down by the Honorable Supreme Court & the High Courts from time to time.
No punishment can be awarded without conducting proper domestic inquiry.
In this case the legal and procedural aspects have been breached by the management & would not stand legal scrutiny. The Presiding Officers have taken dim view of such lapses on the part of management & ordered reinstatement with wages and passed strictures.
It becomes important for top managements to organize training for their HR & ER Managers so that they could aid and advice functional heads to initiate disciplinary action for Acts of misconducts in their establishments.
The action taken by the management in this case is "arbitrary" and is not "fair", "just" & " resonable".
The tendency to act arbitrarily is mostly on account of ignorance or arrogance which only result in unwelcome & unpleasant publicity & public attention for the organization & global clients /customers
Professionals are welcome to dd on this.
Harsh Kumar Sharan (XLRI Alumnus)
Head - Executive Coaching & Training, IR Expert
Kritarth Consulting (P) Ltd.
New Delhi
+91 - 9560453756
From India, Delhi
Punishment for Assaulting co-worker at the workplace while on duty
The employer-employee relationship is and should be governed by the legal/statutory provisions specifically laid down by either the Industrial Employment (Standing Orders) Act or by the respective Shops & Establishment Act and not by the whims and fancies of Any Manager in the Establishment.
The Acts indicate the Acts of misconducts for which the employee is liable to disciplinary action. The Honorable Supreme Court of India has long ago unambiguously defined what all could constitute Act of misconduct.
The incident reported to management in this case amount to Act of grave misconduct irrespective of the fact that no complaint whatsoever - written or verbal - was lodged / made by the victim -the female employee in the case.
The management should have conducted proper preliminary inquiry to ascertain whether there was prima facie reason to proceed further and should have issued proper charge-sheet to the employee for assaulting his colleague.
On receipt of his explanation, the management should have ordered an inquiry as per procedure laid down by the Honorable Supreme Court & the High Courts from time to time.
No punishment can be awarded without conducting proper domestic inquiry.
In this case the legal and procedural aspects have been breached by the management & would not stand legal scrutiny. The Presiding Officers have taken dim view of such lapses on the part of management & ordered reinstatement with wages and passed strictures.
It becomes important for top managements to organize training for their HR & ER Managers so that they could aid and advice functional heads to initiate disciplinary action for Acts of misconducts in their establishments.
The action taken by the management in this case is "arbitrary" and is not "fair", "just" & " resonable".
The tendency to act arbitrarily is mostly on account of ignorance or arrogance which only result in unwelcome & unpleasant publicity & public attention for the organization & global clients /customers
Professionals are welcome to dd on this.
Harsh Kumar Sharan (XLRI Alumnus)
Head - Executive Coaching & Training, IR Expert
Kritarth Consulting (P) Ltd.
New Delhi
+91 - 9560453756
From India, Delhi
Termination is not a answer for everything .
considering the matter about slapping and terminating an employee is unecthical . you say this happened in a cafetaria , so its not a work place and cant be considered so serious .
Are you sure that the matter was only about slapping and nothing more ?
Both the employess can log a case against labour law and strict action can be taken the company .
No HR has such rights for termination on basis of slapping .if you see normally HR are the one who will be too manerless and careless about the policies.
Suspection for 1 week was more then enough in the above scenario.
I have seen in many Indian companies that too top rated where employess have complained against sexual harasement and no action have been taken.
Please go ahead and consult a Labour Law Lawyer ...
Hope for the best.
From United States, Hopkinton
considering the matter about slapping and terminating an employee is unecthical . you say this happened in a cafetaria , so its not a work place and cant be considered so serious .
Are you sure that the matter was only about slapping and nothing more ?
Both the employess can log a case against labour law and strict action can be taken the company .
No HR has such rights for termination on basis of slapping .if you see normally HR are the one who will be too manerless and careless about the policies.
Suspection for 1 week was more then enough in the above scenario.
I have seen in many Indian companies that too top rated where employess have complained against sexual harasement and no action have been taken.
Please go ahead and consult a Labour Law Lawyer ...
Hope for the best.
From United States, Hopkinton
Greetings,
This is to appeal, to all those who are reading this thread to help us rehabilitate the two professionals. We don't support their actions. Yet, we believe , they have learnt their lessons . Hence, please help us place them. Incase you are aware of any role which is hiring for less than an year IT professionals with those skills sets, please communicate with Mani.
Lets spread the word and help them out. We are not setting any incorrect precedent with this. We are not advocating mercy for professionals who couldn’t follow office decorum. We understand not just those two, but everyone who had read, heard or witnessed this incident, have learnt a lesson.
We understand we can only make an effort to connect, clearing the rounds and bagging the roles would be entirely their responsibility. We are trying to help two 'Human Beings' out of trouble.
Please do consider this appeal.
Regards,
(Cite Contribution)
From India, Mumbai
This is to appeal, to all those who are reading this thread to help us rehabilitate the two professionals. We don't support their actions. Yet, we believe , they have learnt their lessons . Hence, please help us place them. Incase you are aware of any role which is hiring for less than an year IT professionals with those skills sets, please communicate with Mani.
Lets spread the word and help them out. We are not setting any incorrect precedent with this. We are not advocating mercy for professionals who couldn’t follow office decorum. We understand not just those two, but everyone who had read, heard or witnessed this incident, have learnt a lesson.
We understand we can only make an effort to connect, clearing the rounds and bagging the roles would be entirely their responsibility. We are trying to help two 'Human Beings' out of trouble.
Please do consider this appeal.
Regards,
(Cite Contribution)
From India, Mumbai
Dear Harsh,
I agree with your point. But since I know how it works, I can say that, it would be very easy for the HR to prove it as a disciplinary case culminating to physical abuse witnessed and reported by others, which led to termination.
Hence, I request these professional not to fight any case with the HR. They need the HR to give them a clearance during the back ground verification. It would be best for them to resume working. Continuity in their career is all they need and not a war-win.
They were irresponsible and have rightly paid a price with the job loss. Hopefully, they have learnt a lesson. Please do connect Mani with any opportunity you are aware of, we would truly appreciate that help.
Regards,
(Cite Contribution)
From India, Mumbai
I agree with your point. But since I know how it works, I can say that, it would be very easy for the HR to prove it as a disciplinary case culminating to physical abuse witnessed and reported by others, which led to termination.
Hence, I request these professional not to fight any case with the HR. They need the HR to give them a clearance during the back ground verification. It would be best for them to resume working. Continuity in their career is all they need and not a war-win.
They were irresponsible and have rightly paid a price with the job loss. Hopefully, they have learnt a lesson. Please do connect Mani with any opportunity you are aware of, we would truly appreciate that help.
Regards,
(Cite Contribution)
From India, Mumbai
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