Hi Everyone,
Okay....now this may sound amateurish.....but here it goes....
There are times when employees in the organization have to stay up late because of work dependencies or project deadlines, as is common in many cos. Now the problem is, many a times when employees are late in coming to office and when I ask them the reason for it, they tend to say that we don't question them at the time when they work late so why do we question on their late arrivals. I am sure many of you would have encountered this clichéd question being asked by your employees, but yet I am not sure what can be a valid response to this.
Also, We do not have any option for flexi-work hours in our co.
Kindly pour in your suggestion for this.
Regards,
Pooja
From India, Ahmadabad
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Okay....now this may sound amateurish.....but here it goes....
There are times when employees in the organization have to stay up late because of work dependencies or project deadlines, as is common in many cos. Now the problem is, many a times when employees are late in coming to office and when I ask them the reason for it, they tend to say that we don't question them at the time when they work late so why do we question on their late arrivals. I am sure many of you would have encountered this clichéd question being asked by your employees, but yet I am not sure what can be a valid response to this.
Also, We do not have any option for flexi-work hours in our co.
Kindly pour in your suggestion for this.
Regards,
Pooja
From India, Ahmadabad
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Hi Pooja,
This situation is encountered in many organizations. If and only if some employees are forced to work on a project delivery late at night or, sometimes with proper approvals, until the next day morning, we consider their late arrival the next day.
Regards,
Vidhya
From India, Bangalore
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This situation is encountered in many organizations. If and only if some employees are forced to work on a project delivery late at night or, sometimes with proper approvals, until the next day morning, we consider their late arrival the next day.
Regards,
Vidhya
From India, Bangalore
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Hi Vidhya,
Thank you for your response. I forgot to mention this, but if an employee has worked long hours on a particular day, we allow for late arrival the next day (with approval from the immediate supervisor). However, some employees still complain about this policy, especially when they arrive late on other occasions. When addressing their concerns, I explain that it is important for them to uphold office decorum.
Regards,
Pooja
From India, Ahmadabad
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Thank you for your response. I forgot to mention this, but if an employee has worked long hours on a particular day, we allow for late arrival the next day (with approval from the immediate supervisor). However, some employees still complain about this policy, especially when they arrive late on other occasions. When addressing their concerns, I explain that it is important for them to uphold office decorum.
Regards,
Pooja
From India, Ahmadabad
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Dear,
Being in HR, I also face this problem. But we reply to them that I never asked you to stay late, and you stayed late because you have not completed your work within working hours.
Regards,
J.S. Malik
From India, Delhi
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174Being in HR, I also face this problem. But we reply to them that I never asked you to stay late, and you stayed late because you have not completed your work within working hours.
Regards,
J.S. Malik
From India, Delhi
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Hi,
Do a little bit of math and find out how many employees are coming late and how many hours of productivity are affected daily, weekly, monthly, and yearly, thus impacting turnover, business, and their increments. Convey the same to the employees who cite lateness as a reason.
Additionally, since they are reporting late for work, tasks are getting delayed further, leading to missed deadlines.
It may also be that delays in meeting deadlines are related to employees' competency and abilities. If the issue lies with the company, such as overloading employees, address this with management. Consider changing the reporting timings rather than having a flexible schedule, as some employees may take advantage of it.
From India, Madras
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Do a little bit of math and find out how many employees are coming late and how many hours of productivity are affected daily, weekly, monthly, and yearly, thus impacting turnover, business, and their increments. Convey the same to the employees who cite lateness as a reason.
Additionally, since they are reporting late for work, tasks are getting delayed further, leading to missed deadlines.
It may also be that delays in meeting deadlines are related to employees' competency and abilities. If the issue lies with the company, such as overloading employees, address this with management. Consider changing the reporting timings rather than having a flexible schedule, as some employees may take advantage of it.
From India, Madras
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I beg to differ with the proposal of Mr. Malik. Many times, it's the organization's needs, poor planning or work distribution by seniors, emergency bulk orders, increased workload, recruiting incapable employees at low costs, and inadequate training that result in long working hours. While saying this, I certainly do not exclude those who lack efficiency and procrastinate despite all positives, deserving a solution.
In a nutshell, if Mr. Malik's solution is applied without considering the ground reality, as an HR professional, one may win the argument but never the hearts of employees. Mr. Malik, please excuse me for saying that as a senior HR, dissociating from late work orders of the operational boss and stating "I never asked you" does not inspire a rational response.
From India, Delhi
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In a nutshell, if Mr. Malik's solution is applied without considering the ground reality, as an HR professional, one may win the argument but never the hearts of employees. Mr. Malik, please excuse me for saying that as a senior HR, dissociating from late work orders of the operational boss and stating "I never asked you" does not inspire a rational response.
From India, Delhi
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Hai Pooja, Even i too face the same issue in my Co. But the Answer given by Mr. Malik is quite reasonable. We can give the same ans to them.
From India, Delhi
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From India, Delhi
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Hi,
I too face this problem in my organization. Normally, it is used to say that going late is not the reason for coming late. But in my opinion, due to improper work schedule, unexpected meetings, and lengthy telephonic conversations of the higher officials put junior-level employees into trouble of late sitting. If the work is allocated well within the time and not completed in the stipulated time, then it reveals inefficiency of the staff. Otherwise, if the staff is forced to do work at the end of closing office hours, then the employee should be specially permitted to come late in the morning.
With regards
From India, Madras
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I too face this problem in my organization. Normally, it is used to say that going late is not the reason for coming late. But in my opinion, due to improper work schedule, unexpected meetings, and lengthy telephonic conversations of the higher officials put junior-level employees into trouble of late sitting. If the work is allocated well within the time and not completed in the stipulated time, then it reveals inefficiency of the staff. Otherwise, if the staff is forced to do work at the end of closing office hours, then the employee should be specially permitted to come late in the morning.
With regards
From India, Madras
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Dear Mr. Sharma,
You are absolutely right. The reply which I have given is totally wrong if you will take an HR point of view into consideration. Ethically, my reply was also incorrect. However, when it comes to discipline, one should come on time. Let it be any hurdles, flexible office hours should not be made applicable to all industries. In my personal view, coming late is a habit.
Regards,
J.S. Malik
From India, Delhi
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You are absolutely right. The reply which I have given is totally wrong if you will take an HR point of view into consideration. Ethically, my reply was also incorrect. However, when it comes to discipline, one should come on time. Let it be any hurdles, flexible office hours should not be made applicable to all industries. In my personal view, coming late is a habit.
Regards,
J.S. Malik
From India, Delhi
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Dear Mr. Malik,
Only the concerned staff's HOD knows how much work their employees have completed during their working hours. Sitting late and doing additional work must be properly analyzed. For instance, determining whether the employee is working to complete pending tasks or striving to finish work before the due date, as instructed by their manager or management. As HR professionals, we cannot assess his productivity without consulting his HOD.
From India, Madras
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Only the concerned staff's HOD knows how much work their employees have completed during their working hours. Sitting late and doing additional work must be properly analyzed. For instance, determining whether the employee is working to complete pending tasks or striving to finish work before the due date, as instructed by their manager or management. As HR professionals, we cannot assess his productivity without consulting his HOD.
From India, Madras
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(Fact Checked)-The response provided correctly emphasizes the importance of consulting with the employee's HOD to understand the context of their late hours and productivity. It highlights the need for proper analysis before questioning productivity. (1 Acknowledge point)
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Hi, I am facing the same problem.
We mark late if you are 5 minutes late and cut one day's salary for 5 late arrivals. Our office timings are 9 am to 6 pm, but employees generally stay until 8 pm. Employees argue that since they stay late, they should be granted a concession in arrival time. Our policy is to provide incentives for staying late but not to grant concessions in arrival time. However, our management has not yet decided on the incentives for staying late, and in the work environment, it is mandatory to stay after working hours.
The situation is that employees are discussing not staying late for work and are very dissatisfied with the current conditions. Our management is known for making decisions late, and dissatisfaction is increasing due to the salary deductions for arriving late.
Regards,
Pratap M Kamble
From India, Pune
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We mark late if you are 5 minutes late and cut one day's salary for 5 late arrivals. Our office timings are 9 am to 6 pm, but employees generally stay until 8 pm. Employees argue that since they stay late, they should be granted a concession in arrival time. Our policy is to provide incentives for staying late but not to grant concessions in arrival time. However, our management has not yet decided on the incentives for staying late, and in the work environment, it is mandatory to stay after working hours.
The situation is that employees are discussing not staying late for work and are very dissatisfied with the current conditions. Our management is known for making decisions late, and dissatisfaction is increasing due to the salary deductions for arriving late.
Regards,
Pratap M Kamble
From India, Pune
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I also answered my employees the same as Mr. Malik. Also, ask the employees to schedule their work and finish it within the timeline. Pooja, if you find someone working very hard, you can allow them in some exceptional cases with the concerned person's approval. But it should not be for daily routine.
From India, Ahmadabad
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From India, Ahmadabad
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Well, I guess you could put it across this way when they keep asking you like that.
First, the company has certain set policies which they prefer everyone to follow, so no one feels that there is partiality among anyone.
Second, it is not just being a part of the company that matters, but owning the job. If the job needs additional work hours on a particular day, it's something that they own and are fully responsible for how it's delivered. The company would prefer people to complete the task within a given time, and it's left to the employee to decide whether he should complete it and stay within what he had promised before joining. They are paid for what they have been asked to do - nothing more than that.
Staying late is not a responsibility, but is required if the work demands it. The company does not enjoy having people stay late and leave (come on - ELECTRICITY?) ;-) - that was on a lighter note.
From India, Madras
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First, the company has certain set policies which they prefer everyone to follow, so no one feels that there is partiality among anyone.
Second, it is not just being a part of the company that matters, but owning the job. If the job needs additional work hours on a particular day, it's something that they own and are fully responsible for how it's delivered. The company would prefer people to complete the task within a given time, and it's left to the employee to decide whether he should complete it and stay within what he had promised before joining. They are paid for what they have been asked to do - nothing more than that.
Staying late is not a responsibility, but is required if the work demands it. The company does not enjoy having people stay late and leave (come on - ELECTRICITY?) ;-) - that was on a lighter note.
From India, Madras
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I agree with Mr. Malik that coming late is a habit and going late is also a habit. I read recently on this matter and I am sharing this with you all.
Email from the boss
Mail sent by Narayan Murthy to all Infosys staff:
It's half past 8 in the office but the lights are still on...
PCs still running, coffee machines still buzzing...
And who's at work? Most of them ??? Take a closer look...
All or most specimens are ??
Something male species of the human race...
Look closer... again all or most of them are bachelors...
And why are they sitting late? Working hard? No way!!!
Any guesses???
Let's ask one of them...
Here's what he says... 'What's there to do after going home... Here we get to surf, AC, phone, food, coffee that is why I am working late... Importantly no bossssssss!!!!'
This is the scene in most research centers and software companies and other off-shore offices.
Bachelors 'Passing-Time' during late hours in the office just because they say they've nothing else to do...
Now what are the consequences...
'Working' (for the record only) late hours soon becomes part of the institute or company culture.
With bosses more than eager to provide support to those 'working' late in the form of taxi vouchers, food vouchers, and of course good feedback, (oh, he's a hard worker... goes home only to change..!!).
They aren't helping things too...
To hell with bosses who don't understand the difference between 'sitting' late and 'working' late!!!
Very soon, the boss starts expecting all employees to put in extra working hours.
So, My dear Bachelors let me tell you, life changes when you get married and start having a family... office is no longer a priority, family is... and
That's when the problem starts... because you start having commitments at home too.
For your boss, the earlier 'hardworking' guy suddenly seems to become an 'early leaver' even if you leave an hour after regular time... after doing the same amount of work.
People leaving on time after doing their tasks for the day are labeled as work-shirkers...
Girls who thankfully always (it's changing nowadays... though) leave on time are labeled as 'not up to it'. All the while, the bachelors pat their own backs and carry on 'working' not realizing that they are spoiling the work culture at their own place and never realize that they would have to regret at one point of time.
So what's the moral of the story??
* Very clear, LEAVE ON TIME!!!
* Never put in extra time 'unless really needed'
* Don't stay back unnecessarily and spoil your company work culture which will in turn cause inconvenience to you and your colleagues.
There are a hundred other things to do in the evening..
Learn music...
Learn a foreign language...
Try a sport... TT, cricket.........
Importantly, get a girlfriend or boyfriend, take him/her around town...
* And for heaven's sake, net cafe rates have dropped to an all-time low (plus, no firewalls) and try cooking for a change.
Take a tip from the Smirnoff ad: *'Life's calling, where are you??'*
Please pass on this message to all those colleagues and please do it before leaving time, don't stay back till midnight to forward this!!!
IT'S A TYPICAL INDIAN MENTALITY THAT WORKING FOR LONG HOURS MEANS VERY HARD WORKING & 100% COMMITMENT ETC.
PEOPLE WHO REGULARLY SIT LATE IN THE OFFICE DON'T KNOW HOW TO MANAGE THEIR TIME. SIMPLE!
Regards,
Narayan Murthy.
From India, Ahmadabad
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Email from the boss
Mail sent by Narayan Murthy to all Infosys staff:
It's half past 8 in the office but the lights are still on...
PCs still running, coffee machines still buzzing...
And who's at work? Most of them ??? Take a closer look...
All or most specimens are ??
Something male species of the human race...
Look closer... again all or most of them are bachelors...
And why are they sitting late? Working hard? No way!!!
Any guesses???
Let's ask one of them...
Here's what he says... 'What's there to do after going home... Here we get to surf, AC, phone, food, coffee that is why I am working late... Importantly no bossssssss!!!!'
This is the scene in most research centers and software companies and other off-shore offices.
Bachelors 'Passing-Time' during late hours in the office just because they say they've nothing else to do...
Now what are the consequences...
'Working' (for the record only) late hours soon becomes part of the institute or company culture.
With bosses more than eager to provide support to those 'working' late in the form of taxi vouchers, food vouchers, and of course good feedback, (oh, he's a hard worker... goes home only to change..!!).
They aren't helping things too...
To hell with bosses who don't understand the difference between 'sitting' late and 'working' late!!!
Very soon, the boss starts expecting all employees to put in extra working hours.
So, My dear Bachelors let me tell you, life changes when you get married and start having a family... office is no longer a priority, family is... and
That's when the problem starts... because you start having commitments at home too.
For your boss, the earlier 'hardworking' guy suddenly seems to become an 'early leaver' even if you leave an hour after regular time... after doing the same amount of work.
People leaving on time after doing their tasks for the day are labeled as work-shirkers...
Girls who thankfully always (it's changing nowadays... though) leave on time are labeled as 'not up to it'. All the while, the bachelors pat their own backs and carry on 'working' not realizing that they are spoiling the work culture at their own place and never realize that they would have to regret at one point of time.
So what's the moral of the story??
* Very clear, LEAVE ON TIME!!!
* Never put in extra time 'unless really needed'
* Don't stay back unnecessarily and spoil your company work culture which will in turn cause inconvenience to you and your colleagues.
There are a hundred other things to do in the evening..
Learn music...
Learn a foreign language...
Try a sport... TT, cricket.........
Importantly, get a girlfriend or boyfriend, take him/her around town...
* And for heaven's sake, net cafe rates have dropped to an all-time low (plus, no firewalls) and try cooking for a change.
Take a tip from the Smirnoff ad: *'Life's calling, where are you??'*
Please pass on this message to all those colleagues and please do it before leaving time, don't stay back till midnight to forward this!!!
IT'S A TYPICAL INDIAN MENTALITY THAT WORKING FOR LONG HOURS MEANS VERY HARD WORKING & 100% COMMITMENT ETC.
PEOPLE WHO REGULARLY SIT LATE IN THE OFFICE DON'T KNOW HOW TO MANAGE THEIR TIME. SIMPLE!
Regards,
Narayan Murthy.
From India, Ahmadabad
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Hi Everybody,
I also need some help as employees are coming late to the office. When asked for a reason, they often cite traffic issues. What should we do in this case? Please provide suggestions on how we can avoid latecomers.
Regards,
Swapna
From India, Bangalore
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I also need some help as employees are coming late to the office. When asked for a reason, they often cite traffic issues. What should we do in this case? Please provide suggestions on how we can avoid latecomers.
Regards,
Swapna
From India, Bangalore
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Dear Swapna,
We also face the same problems, but we have been taking this very seriously. We gave a lot of verbal and written messages to all employees, but no one was that serious about it. This led us to take a step of salary cuts. Those employees who are late by even a minute, after giving them three late coming lifelines, we cut their salaries. You must be so surprised that even though the employees were late and did not bother about it, we also kept the same procedure for three months, and it's still ongoing. Now we have employees coming on time.
Instead of asking them rudely and directly in front of others, it's good to call them and make them understand why spoil your image? Why receive less salary for being late by a minute? Why let others see your tardiness and not your hard work? Put some questions in front of them and just leave it. Excuses of the bus, rickshaw, or scooter should not be considered when your appraisals are held.
After all, we are dealing with the human brain; let's approach it in a different manner by expressing everything in a nicer way.
From India, Ahmadabad
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We also face the same problems, but we have been taking this very seriously. We gave a lot of verbal and written messages to all employees, but no one was that serious about it. This led us to take a step of salary cuts. Those employees who are late by even a minute, after giving them three late coming lifelines, we cut their salaries. You must be so surprised that even though the employees were late and did not bother about it, we also kept the same procedure for three months, and it's still ongoing. Now we have employees coming on time.
Instead of asking them rudely and directly in front of others, it's good to call them and make them understand why spoil your image? Why receive less salary for being late by a minute? Why let others see your tardiness and not your hard work? Put some questions in front of them and just leave it. Excuses of the bus, rickshaw, or scooter should not be considered when your appraisals are held.
After all, we are dealing with the human brain; let's approach it in a different manner by expressing everything in a nicer way.
From India, Ahmadabad
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Dear Sir,
As per my concern, if any employee stays back after working hours, ask them to get prior approval from the concerned authority. If he really has work, it will get approved. If anyone is working after company hours with prior approval, give them a C/off on a pro-rata basis.
Regards,
Arunachalam.R
From India, Mumbai
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As per my concern, if any employee stays back after working hours, ask them to get prior approval from the concerned authority. If he really has work, it will get approved. If anyone is working after company hours with prior approval, give them a C/off on a pro-rata basis.
Regards,
Arunachalam.R
From India, Mumbai
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Sorry, I also do not agree with Mr. Mallick because some jobs are continuous in nature which cannot be completed on time, such as the jobs of a technician, nurse, or doctor. They cannot leave a patient if their duty time is over. Please advise on what action we should take if they are late.
Rajashree
From India, Bhubaneswar
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Rajashree
From India, Bhubaneswar
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People who work late hours, arent they paid for this extra hours put in ... if s...then how do they argue on this.... they need their OT paid and also justify coming late
From India, Bangalore
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From India, Bangalore
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Its a question that the answer would not justify the question but the employer side its sure that they dont want to coming late to employees ,whatever they performed duty late times. baba
From India, New Delhi
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From India, New Delhi
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Dear All,
This problem is faced by many HR teams. We can solve this problem by the following ways:
1. Give overtime (OT).
2. Talk to their department head and discuss the problem, whether it is lack of efficiency or understaffing.
3. If they work more than 2 hours extra, then allow them to be 30 minutes late.
4. If they are working extra hours for a specific job or project, promise them a reward upon completion of the work.
Above all, HR response will depend on the employee who has the concern. We should observe his facial expressions, read his body language, and respond accordingly.
Thank you.
From Qatar
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This problem is faced by many HR teams. We can solve this problem by the following ways:
1. Give overtime (OT).
2. Talk to their department head and discuss the problem, whether it is lack of efficiency or understaffing.
3. If they work more than 2 hours extra, then allow them to be 30 minutes late.
4. If they are working extra hours for a specific job or project, promise them a reward upon completion of the work.
Above all, HR response will depend on the employee who has the concern. We should observe his facial expressions, read his body language, and respond accordingly.
Thank you.
From Qatar
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Hi Pooja,
It can be an exception the next day if an employee came in late supposedly because he or she worked until late the previous day, provided it does not become a norm. Secondly, such must have been sanctioned by his or her superiors who supervise him or her. If not sanctioned by superiors, then the employee must be in the office at the usual reporting company time. Note that accepting such excuses when they were not sanctioned does breed a practice of creating reasons for not executing duties. Hence, it must be discouraged.
Insightful issues. Thanks.
Johnson
From Uganda
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It can be an exception the next day if an employee came in late supposedly because he or she worked until late the previous day, provided it does not become a norm. Secondly, such must have been sanctioned by his or her superiors who supervise him or her. If not sanctioned by superiors, then the employee must be in the office at the usual reporting company time. Note that accepting such excuses when they were not sanctioned does breed a practice of creating reasons for not executing duties. Hence, it must be discouraged.
Insightful issues. Thanks.
Johnson
From Uganda
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Dear all,
In my organization, there are people working since the establishment's beginning, so they are creating rules for themselves. I introduced flexible timing for them, allowing them to arrive at 8, 8:30, or 9, but they must work for 8 hours and 45 minutes. Kindly adopt this time flexibility; sometimes it will work out.
Thank you.
From India, Mumbai
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In my organization, there are people working since the establishment's beginning, so they are creating rules for themselves. I introduced flexible timing for them, allowing them to arrive at 8, 8:30, or 9, but they must work for 8 hours and 45 minutes. Kindly adopt this time flexibility; sometimes it will work out.
Thank you.
From India, Mumbai
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working late and coming late shows lack of planning and this is the responsibility of HR to notice and direct their seniors for corrective action
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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I have worked with different organizations of same industry and experenced that those working with time limits are getting better business.
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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In my experience as a Senior Manager, discipline starts from the top. If the boss comes on time, half of the problem is solved. The majority of employees fall in line when they observe their seniors arriving on time. When these seniors simply raise their eyebrows, the subordinates respond positively.
These seniors, when they ask anyone to stay late once in a while, nobody takes it badly the next day. However, if your work environment frequently demands the same, then it's a system fault, not that of the employees. Providing relaxation in arrival time the next day will not only earn the regards of employees but also ensure that work is completed by meeting deadlines.
Only a fraction of employees are the bad elements who deliberately do not want to comply. They need to be tackled with an iron hand.
The irony is when management and managers are hesitant to deal strictly with such defaulters to buy temporary peace, it affects the morale of other disciplined employees as well, leading to a situation of total chaos.
In my view, a good HR/Operations manager has no option but to be rational when deciding on a correction plan for latecomers, ensuring that productive individuals are not unfairly punished and wrongdoers are not spared.
We must not forget that in today's times, many firms are making their staff stay late as part of their exploitative programs for employees. However, I can confidently say that staying late does not increase productivity in any way.
From India, Delhi
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These seniors, when they ask anyone to stay late once in a while, nobody takes it badly the next day. However, if your work environment frequently demands the same, then it's a system fault, not that of the employees. Providing relaxation in arrival time the next day will not only earn the regards of employees but also ensure that work is completed by meeting deadlines.
Only a fraction of employees are the bad elements who deliberately do not want to comply. They need to be tackled with an iron hand.
The irony is when management and managers are hesitant to deal strictly with such defaulters to buy temporary peace, it affects the morale of other disciplined employees as well, leading to a situation of total chaos.
In my view, a good HR/Operations manager has no option but to be rational when deciding on a correction plan for latecomers, ensuring that productive individuals are not unfairly punished and wrongdoers are not spared.
We must not forget that in today's times, many firms are making their staff stay late as part of their exploitative programs for employees. However, I can confidently say that staying late does not increase productivity in any way.
From India, Delhi
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July 11, 2009
This is a blunt reply to any employee by Mr. Malik. Methodical reply and table paperwork are not the present focus. What are HR managers thinking of themselves?
Understand this now:
As an employee of a company, people have to listen to many officers or bosses' bosses' bosses' bosses. Employees/workers are taken for granted. When an employee is doing work and is then given more tasks that cannot be completed before the end of the workday, how can this be justified? Yes, if an employee is lazy or negligent in their work, disciplinary action, notice, and dismissal procedures are already in place. Therefore, the issue of tardiness should not be up for discussion.
HR managers often earn hefty salaries and primarily focus on creating rules. However, it is crucial to first establish work guidelines. Whom do they work for? I have witnessed many instances in various companies where secretaries are employed to assist top executives, and they end up doing menial tasks. For instance, when a boss asks for a file, the secretary might respond casually, leading to the boss rewarding them with gifts, favors, and high pay.
HR should oversee everyone's work and not waste time. Even the boss is subject to the company's regulations. Personal benefits should not be extended to the boss at the expense of the employee and the company.
If a boss's secretary has idle time, HR should inform the boss that the company cannot afford such inefficiency and suggest assigning more tasks to the secretary or consider replacing them with another employee. Every employee is expected to work for a set number of hours as per the Minimum Wages Act or the government's regulations applicable to the company's location.
Regarding punctuality:
When hiring, consider:
1. The employee's commute from their residence to the workplace, especially if they are staying in temporary accommodation and their ability to manage shifts.
2. Whether the company will compensate the employee for travel expenses if they are otherwise a valuable candidate due to their experience.
3. Consider the example of employees in cities like Mumbai who may need to take multiple modes of transportation to reach their workplace, with little regard for their commute back home. HR should empathize with employees and understand their challenges.
Cities like Mumbai have residents facing extreme commuting challenges, leading to a lack of social and extracurricular activities. HR professionals should prioritize understanding employees' needs and difficulties before focusing on the company's interests.
HR professionals need to ensure employees are content. Engage with each employee to address their concerns and attempt to find solutions. It is crucial to balance employee satisfaction with company policies and offerings.
Companies in the IT sector may offer high salaries and perks, but employees also seek compassion and flexibility for personal matters. Granting employees the ability to address personal issues alongside work responsibilities can boost dedication and loyalty.
In conclusion, fostering a supportive and understanding work environment can transform employees into valuable assets for the company. Balancing work requirements with employees' personal needs can lead to higher morale and productivity.
From Saudi Arabia
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This is a blunt reply to any employee by Mr. Malik. Methodical reply and table paperwork are not the present focus. What are HR managers thinking of themselves?
Understand this now:
As an employee of a company, people have to listen to many officers or bosses' bosses' bosses' bosses. Employees/workers are taken for granted. When an employee is doing work and is then given more tasks that cannot be completed before the end of the workday, how can this be justified? Yes, if an employee is lazy or negligent in their work, disciplinary action, notice, and dismissal procedures are already in place. Therefore, the issue of tardiness should not be up for discussion.
HR managers often earn hefty salaries and primarily focus on creating rules. However, it is crucial to first establish work guidelines. Whom do they work for? I have witnessed many instances in various companies where secretaries are employed to assist top executives, and they end up doing menial tasks. For instance, when a boss asks for a file, the secretary might respond casually, leading to the boss rewarding them with gifts, favors, and high pay.
HR should oversee everyone's work and not waste time. Even the boss is subject to the company's regulations. Personal benefits should not be extended to the boss at the expense of the employee and the company.
If a boss's secretary has idle time, HR should inform the boss that the company cannot afford such inefficiency and suggest assigning more tasks to the secretary or consider replacing them with another employee. Every employee is expected to work for a set number of hours as per the Minimum Wages Act or the government's regulations applicable to the company's location.
Regarding punctuality:
When hiring, consider:
1. The employee's commute from their residence to the workplace, especially if they are staying in temporary accommodation and their ability to manage shifts.
2. Whether the company will compensate the employee for travel expenses if they are otherwise a valuable candidate due to their experience.
3. Consider the example of employees in cities like Mumbai who may need to take multiple modes of transportation to reach their workplace, with little regard for their commute back home. HR should empathize with employees and understand their challenges.
Cities like Mumbai have residents facing extreme commuting challenges, leading to a lack of social and extracurricular activities. HR professionals should prioritize understanding employees' needs and difficulties before focusing on the company's interests.
HR professionals need to ensure employees are content. Engage with each employee to address their concerns and attempt to find solutions. It is crucial to balance employee satisfaction with company policies and offerings.
Companies in the IT sector may offer high salaries and perks, but employees also seek compassion and flexibility for personal matters. Granting employees the ability to address personal issues alongside work responsibilities can boost dedication and loyalty.
In conclusion, fostering a supportive and understanding work environment can transform employees into valuable assets for the company. Balancing work requirements with employees' personal needs can lead to higher morale and productivity.
From Saudi Arabia
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Hi, this problem needs to be tackled in an amicable way with mutual understanding and cooperation from both sides. We can tolerate late-comings provided the person has helped you stay late in completing the assignments previously. So it is better that an employer keeps track of such events. There is nothing wrong in a give-and-take policy. You can tolerate a situation like so many days of staying late can be adjusted with so many days of coming late. :) However, chronic late comings should not be entertained.
From India, Madras
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From India, Madras
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Actually, I drafted my opinion without considering any other person's opinion except Mr. Malik's. Later, when I read every other member's reply, I was amazed to find a well-written letter from a corporate leader, a hardworking industrialist who has dedicated his life to what Infosys is today. Therefore, Mr. Murthy's letter to employees is certainly an eye-opener, and I suggest distributing a copy of this mail to every employee for study and reflection. You could even frame the letter and display it in prominent places for people to read, including on the notice board.
Yes, a broader outlook on the problem often has a simple solution:
Mail sent by Narayan Murthy to all Infosys staff:
It's half past 8 in the office, but the lights are still on... PCs are still running, coffee machines still buzzing... And who's at work? Most of them? Take a closer look... All or most of the individuals are male... Look closer... again, all or most of them are bachelors... And why are they sitting late? Working hard? No way!!! Any guesses??? Let's ask one of them... Here's what he says: 'What's there to do after going home... Here we get to surf, AC, phone, food, coffee, that is why I am working late... Importantly, no boss!' This scenario is common in most research centers, software companies, and other offshore offices. Bachelors 'passing time' during late hours in the office just because they claim they have nothing else to do...
Now, what are the consequences? 'Working' (for the record only) late hours soon becomes part of the institute or company culture. With bosses more than eager to provide support to those 'working' late in the form of taxi vouchers, food vouchers, and of course, positive feedback ('oh, he's a hard worker... goes home only to change..!!'). They aren't helping matters either... To hell with bosses who don't understand the difference between 'sitting' late and 'working' late!!! Very soon, the boss starts expecting all employees to put in extra working hours.
So, my dear bachelors, let me tell you, life changes when you get married and start a family... the office is no longer a priority; family is... and that's when the problem starts... because you start having commitments at home too. For your boss, the earlier 'hardworking' guy suddenly seems to become an 'early leaver' even if you leave an hour after the regular time, after doing the same amount of work. People leaving on time after completing their tasks for the day are labeled as work-shirkers... Girls who, thankfully (it's changing nowadays... though), leave on time are labeled as 'not up to it'. Meanwhile, the bachelors pat their own backs and continue 'working', not realizing that they are spoiling the work culture at their own place and never realizing that they would have to regret it at some point.
So, what's the moral of the story? Very clear, LEAVE ON TIME!!! Never put in extra time 'unless really needed'. Don't stay back unnecessarily and spoil your company's work culture, which will, in turn, cause inconvenience to you and your colleagues. There are a hundred other things to do in the evening... Learn music... Learn a foreign language... Try a sport... table tennis, cricket... Importantly, get a girlfriend or boyfriend, take them around town... And for heaven's sake, net cafe rates have dropped to an all-time low (plus, no firewalls), so try cooking for a change. Take a tip from the Smirnoff ad: 'Life's calling, where are you?' Please pass on this message to all your colleagues, and do it before leaving time; don't stay back until midnight to forward this!!!
IT'S A TYPICAL INDIAN MENTALITY THAT WORKING FOR LONG HOURS MEANS HARD WORKING & 100% COMMITMENT, ETC.
PEOPLE WHO REGULARLY SIT LATE IN THE OFFICE DON'T KNOW HOW TO MANAGE THEIR TIME. SIMPLE!
Regards,
NARAYAN MURTHY.
From Saudi Arabia
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Yes, a broader outlook on the problem often has a simple solution:
Mail sent by Narayan Murthy to all Infosys staff:
It's half past 8 in the office, but the lights are still on... PCs are still running, coffee machines still buzzing... And who's at work? Most of them? Take a closer look... All or most of the individuals are male... Look closer... again, all or most of them are bachelors... And why are they sitting late? Working hard? No way!!! Any guesses??? Let's ask one of them... Here's what he says: 'What's there to do after going home... Here we get to surf, AC, phone, food, coffee, that is why I am working late... Importantly, no boss!' This scenario is common in most research centers, software companies, and other offshore offices. Bachelors 'passing time' during late hours in the office just because they claim they have nothing else to do...
Now, what are the consequences? 'Working' (for the record only) late hours soon becomes part of the institute or company culture. With bosses more than eager to provide support to those 'working' late in the form of taxi vouchers, food vouchers, and of course, positive feedback ('oh, he's a hard worker... goes home only to change..!!'). They aren't helping matters either... To hell with bosses who don't understand the difference between 'sitting' late and 'working' late!!! Very soon, the boss starts expecting all employees to put in extra working hours.
So, my dear bachelors, let me tell you, life changes when you get married and start a family... the office is no longer a priority; family is... and that's when the problem starts... because you start having commitments at home too. For your boss, the earlier 'hardworking' guy suddenly seems to become an 'early leaver' even if you leave an hour after the regular time, after doing the same amount of work. People leaving on time after completing their tasks for the day are labeled as work-shirkers... Girls who, thankfully (it's changing nowadays... though), leave on time are labeled as 'not up to it'. Meanwhile, the bachelors pat their own backs and continue 'working', not realizing that they are spoiling the work culture at their own place and never realizing that they would have to regret it at some point.
So, what's the moral of the story? Very clear, LEAVE ON TIME!!! Never put in extra time 'unless really needed'. Don't stay back unnecessarily and spoil your company's work culture, which will, in turn, cause inconvenience to you and your colleagues. There are a hundred other things to do in the evening... Learn music... Learn a foreign language... Try a sport... table tennis, cricket... Importantly, get a girlfriend or boyfriend, take them around town... And for heaven's sake, net cafe rates have dropped to an all-time low (plus, no firewalls), so try cooking for a change. Take a tip from the Smirnoff ad: 'Life's calling, where are you?' Please pass on this message to all your colleagues, and do it before leaving time; don't stay back until midnight to forward this!!!
IT'S A TYPICAL INDIAN MENTALITY THAT WORKING FOR LONG HOURS MEANS HARD WORKING & 100% COMMITMENT, ETC.
PEOPLE WHO REGULARLY SIT LATE IN THE OFFICE DON'T KNOW HOW TO MANAGE THEIR TIME. SIMPLE!
Regards,
NARAYAN MURTHY.
From Saudi Arabia
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All employees must come in on time as a rule. It can only be relaxed once in a while for personal reasons, preferably with permission. However, staying late for work is in no way an excuse for coming late to work. If this is happening regularly, the workload, the work, and the employee need to be re-looked at.
If the employee has people reporting to him, what will be their direction if the boss comes late? They will be demotivated, demoralized, and will have a casual attitude towards their work. The best thing to do is give a clear direction and focus for the day to the team first thing in the morning. This does wonders for their performance.
From India, Pune
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If the employee has people reporting to him, what will be their direction if the boss comes late? They will be demotivated, demoralized, and will have a casual attitude towards their work. The best thing to do is give a clear direction and focus for the day to the team first thing in the morning. This does wonders for their performance.
From India, Pune
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(Fact Checked)-The user reply is accurate and provides good insights into the importance of punctuality and setting clear directions for the team. Well done! (1 Acknowledge point)
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Dear Mr. Sharma,
I agree with Mr. Sharma, this happened with my organization too. Finally, we decided to switch off our lights/PC, etc., at 6.00 pm. In case there is any urgent work, then we had to take approval from the MD. After one month, we saw some delays, but finally, we achieved the target, and we used to complete all the work before the office time ends.
Best Regards,
Sajid Ansari
From India, Delhi
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I agree with Mr. Sharma, this happened with my organization too. Finally, we decided to switch off our lights/PC, etc., at 6.00 pm. In case there is any urgent work, then we had to take approval from the MD. After one month, we saw some delays, but finally, we achieved the target, and we used to complete all the work before the office time ends.
Best Regards,
Sajid Ansari
From India, Delhi
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Thank you. The most recent issue in my office is that one person has been coming late. When I asked him, he explained that his wife is expecting, so he will be late for the next 3 months. However, I believe he should specify his latest arrival time. He has not done so. I am concerned that others may take advantage of this situation in the future. Please provide me with your suggestions.
From Bangladesh, Dhaka
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From Bangladesh, Dhaka
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Dear,
To analyze the data regarding employees' lateness, try to identify the reasons for their tardiness. Then, engage in positive communication with their immediate supervisors or Heads of Departments. Additionally, convey the staff members' sentiments to their managers. As a team, you may be able to discover a mutually beneficial solution.
Consider implementing a policy that permits employees to arrive late and leave early (half-day) twice a month, upon obtaining permission from their supervisor.
From India, Ahmadabad
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To analyze the data regarding employees' lateness, try to identify the reasons for their tardiness. Then, engage in positive communication with their immediate supervisors or Heads of Departments. Additionally, convey the staff members' sentiments to their managers. As a team, you may be able to discover a mutually beneficial solution.
Consider implementing a policy that permits employees to arrive late and leave early (half-day) twice a month, upon obtaining permission from their supervisor.
From India, Ahmadabad
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Are they coming in late after working late or just coming in late? Have you talked to them about the impact of coming in later? Customer calls don't get answered, they let their team down, others don't get the information they need to move forward, etc. Having the feedback conversation of "your behavior causes this to happen" can help to resolve problems.
I remember even working 24-hour shifts at the end of quarters, mostly because I believed in the project, was committed to the company, and wanted to be a part of the results. In the US, current studies indicate that only 29% of employees are engaged. It is an everyday effort to lift the spirit of engagement. Good for you for reaching out to resources for improvement; all questions are taken seriously. Hope that offers some help.
Warmly, Debora
From United States, Nashua
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I remember even working 24-hour shifts at the end of quarters, mostly because I believed in the project, was committed to the company, and wanted to be a part of the results. In the US, current studies indicate that only 29% of employees are engaged. It is an everyday effort to lift the spirit of engagement. Good for you for reaching out to resources for improvement; all questions are taken seriously. Hope that offers some help.
Warmly, Debora
From United States, Nashua
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(Fact Checked)-The user's reply is correct in emphasizing the importance of discussing the impact of late arrivals on work outcomes and team dynamics to address the issue effectively. (1 Acknowledge point)
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I do agree with mksharma63 – “management and managers are afraid of dealing with such defaulters strictly to buy temporary peace (?), than it affects the morale of other disciplined employees.” Just as in many cases in organizations, senior management also looks at who they are dealing with, if he/she has a strong influential background.
In my organization, latecomers are the norm – somehow middle management and below are the ones; some come in early to punch their cards and then leave for somewhere. Senior management does know the case but nothing has been commented – everyone wants to be Mr/Mrs/Ms NICE.
In my organization, some are late due to working at night (it’s necessary sometimes as in the case of Telco Service Providers) to attend to or troubleshoot unforeseen technical problems. I do agree to give those on duty at night an exceptional reason for being late the next morning. I myself have tried it before to accompany them to work at night (odd working hours) and I found that my normal sleeping time was altered and disturbed – sometimes really hard and difficult to get into a peaceful sleep after the night duty. There was even a circumstance where we worked for more than 24 hours just to get the job done. Some may ask why not seek a replacement after 8 hours, well, on the technical side (probably just Telco only), it takes time and is difficult to explain or brief the other group (replacement) about:
1. What is the probable cause of the alarm,
2. What has been done to overcome thus far,
3. What they need to continue from where we left off.
Anyway, I think all matters have to depend on the situation and the type of industry you are in. Most importantly, top management has to be rigid and firm at all times, or else employees will take their chances to abuse.
From Brunei Darussalam, Bandar Seri Begawan
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In my organization, latecomers are the norm – somehow middle management and below are the ones; some come in early to punch their cards and then leave for somewhere. Senior management does know the case but nothing has been commented – everyone wants to be Mr/Mrs/Ms NICE.
In my organization, some are late due to working at night (it’s necessary sometimes as in the case of Telco Service Providers) to attend to or troubleshoot unforeseen technical problems. I do agree to give those on duty at night an exceptional reason for being late the next morning. I myself have tried it before to accompany them to work at night (odd working hours) and I found that my normal sleeping time was altered and disturbed – sometimes really hard and difficult to get into a peaceful sleep after the night duty. There was even a circumstance where we worked for more than 24 hours just to get the job done. Some may ask why not seek a replacement after 8 hours, well, on the technical side (probably just Telco only), it takes time and is difficult to explain or brief the other group (replacement) about:
1. What is the probable cause of the alarm,
2. What has been done to overcome thus far,
3. What they need to continue from where we left off.
Anyway, I think all matters have to depend on the situation and the type of industry you are in. Most importantly, top management has to be rigid and firm at all times, or else employees will take their chances to abuse.
From Brunei Darussalam, Bandar Seri Begawan
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Pooja,
See, most industries have to face this problem. First of all, you have to prepare the job descriptions of all your employees with the consultation of your department heads. After assigning proper work distribution, it will take less time to complete. Thus, they will not have to stay for long hours and will arrive on time.
QUESTION: Is your company paying overtime or not? If yes, then you can say that the company is compensating for your extra working hours.
Regards,
Parvez Pasta
From India, Ahmadabad
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See, most industries have to face this problem. First of all, you have to prepare the job descriptions of all your employees with the consultation of your department heads. After assigning proper work distribution, it will take less time to complete. Thus, they will not have to stay for long hours and will arrive on time.
QUESTION: Is your company paying overtime or not? If yes, then you can say that the company is compensating for your extra working hours.
Regards,
Parvez Pasta
From India, Ahmadabad
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We also have the same problem here, but then we really empathize with the suffered employee and ask the department head to justify with a written reason. In case the reason is genuine, we make the employee understand the necessity of the situation and end up saying, "This place is like your home, and you have to think about it." I think it is all about EQ.
Be well,
sandipika
From India, Gurgaon
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Be well,
sandipika
From India, Gurgaon
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Dear Pooja,
Daily morning, coming to the office on time is discipline. If employees are unable to complete the tasks allotted to them, it shows their inefficiency. Even if efficient employees need to stay late at night due to unavoidable reasons such as auditing or inspections, they can be given compensatory time off or instructed to report to work at 14:00 hours the next day, if permissible. Additionally, employees' dedication towards their work and the company is demonstrated when they work late at night, and this will be acknowledged by the company during the appraisal period.
Working late at night is not an excuse for employees to arrive late for their duty. This is my opinion. If you disagree, please let me know.
With warm regards,
S. Bhaskar
9908732667
From India, Kumbakonam
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Daily morning, coming to the office on time is discipline. If employees are unable to complete the tasks allotted to them, it shows their inefficiency. Even if efficient employees need to stay late at night due to unavoidable reasons such as auditing or inspections, they can be given compensatory time off or instructed to report to work at 14:00 hours the next day, if permissible. Additionally, employees' dedication towards their work and the company is demonstrated when they work late at night, and this will be acknowledged by the company during the appraisal period.
Working late at night is not an excuse for employees to arrive late for their duty. This is my opinion. If you disagree, please let me know.
With warm regards,
S. Bhaskar
9908732667
From India, Kumbakonam
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Hi Pooja,
I just went through all those arguments and counterarguments, all blame games, etc., without going into the type of industry or organization. Let me share my thoughts and experiences.
First of all, it would be very wrong to say as an HR professional, "that I've never asked you to sit late." Please!! It is everybody's company; that's why we call it an organization. The system does not run on individual commands, desires, wishes, and likings. You cannot disown your employee, nor can you dissociate yourself from him. You are, on the contrary, at the center of the mayhem. Think rationally; you may or may not agree with me. But that's the fact.
Now, coming to the point of late coming, first, the employee has to understand that due to exigencies and unavoidable reasons, he/she may have to sit late. If you are compensating him for that, it is not an issue; that's what we practice in our organization. So the employee has nothing to complain about. Everything gets resolved due to the monetary benefits associated with it. If the employee is sitting late just because he was not able to put up the show due to his laziness or whatever may be the reason, it's his responsibility to finish the game and report back to the office on time the next day.
I would suggest you talk with the employee and explain to them their ownership of the organization and the responsibility each one bears on his/her shoulders. It is this sense of ownership of work/responsibility that makes the employee self-answerable. No one is a kid out there; it is a meticulously carved-out system that inculcates the habit of owning the responsibility of anything. You, at the mayhem, have to win their confidence. At first, do not be arrogant; be a friend, hear them, lend your shoulder to them to cry on, and then you imbibe in them the culture that you want them to cultivate. Arrogance and rigidity only make things bitter for both parties; you are there to facilitate and not dictate.
Having said so, it is equally important to note that despite all the good practices, there may be some who will always falter or try to take advantage of your politeness/friendship; they need to be told in a clear and loud voice about your strictness and discipline. You need to have a carrot and a stick.
So, if the next time the employee sits late due to official reasons, ask him to be on time at the first instant (if you are following monetary benefits, notwithstanding late coming). If you are allowing the person to come late, only give half an hour for doing so. If the person is sitting late due to his faults, there should be no ground for compassionate feelings.
With regards,
M. Biswas
Samsung Heavy Industries
From Korea
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I just went through all those arguments and counterarguments, all blame games, etc., without going into the type of industry or organization. Let me share my thoughts and experiences.
First of all, it would be very wrong to say as an HR professional, "that I've never asked you to sit late." Please!! It is everybody's company; that's why we call it an organization. The system does not run on individual commands, desires, wishes, and likings. You cannot disown your employee, nor can you dissociate yourself from him. You are, on the contrary, at the center of the mayhem. Think rationally; you may or may not agree with me. But that's the fact.
Now, coming to the point of late coming, first, the employee has to understand that due to exigencies and unavoidable reasons, he/she may have to sit late. If you are compensating him for that, it is not an issue; that's what we practice in our organization. So the employee has nothing to complain about. Everything gets resolved due to the monetary benefits associated with it. If the employee is sitting late just because he was not able to put up the show due to his laziness or whatever may be the reason, it's his responsibility to finish the game and report back to the office on time the next day.
I would suggest you talk with the employee and explain to them their ownership of the organization and the responsibility each one bears on his/her shoulders. It is this sense of ownership of work/responsibility that makes the employee self-answerable. No one is a kid out there; it is a meticulously carved-out system that inculcates the habit of owning the responsibility of anything. You, at the mayhem, have to win their confidence. At first, do not be arrogant; be a friend, hear them, lend your shoulder to them to cry on, and then you imbibe in them the culture that you want them to cultivate. Arrogance and rigidity only make things bitter for both parties; you are there to facilitate and not dictate.
Having said so, it is equally important to note that despite all the good practices, there may be some who will always falter or try to take advantage of your politeness/friendship; they need to be told in a clear and loud voice about your strictness and discipline. You need to have a carrot and a stick.
So, if the next time the employee sits late due to official reasons, ask him to be on time at the first instant (if you are following monetary benefits, notwithstanding late coming). If you are allowing the person to come late, only give half an hour for doing so. If the person is sitting late due to his faults, there should be no ground for compassionate feelings.
With regards,
M. Biswas
Samsung Heavy Industries
From Korea
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This is an interesting discussion. Almost everyone agrees that if a person stays back late for his personal reasons or inefficiency then the person shouldn;t use that as an excuse to come late the next day. Otherwise its okay to make some allowances.
But I would like to ask how are you going to decide whether the person stayed back late because of his/her own inefficiency ,or stayed back late because of their seniors inefficiency or was stuck in office for late hour because of some genuine unexpected emergency ? This will only lead to arguments.
If you notice a person coming in late very frequently, try talking to this employee and also the supervisor of this employee. Blunt statements like "I never asked you to stay late” or making judgments on the efficiency of the employee in question is not a right approach. Only the employee's immediate boss will be in a position to do so. If you notice people from a team being late, you can go and talk to the supervisor.
Often some employees don't come on time because they don't get any recognition for maintaining office hours. Others who come late and stay a little late take credit for putting extra effort .So the ones who actually did come on time get put off. To encourage people to come on time - announce a prize or other incentive. Besides unless there's a strict company policy on in-time, try and understand that these days its about flexi timings and as long as an employee manages his/her work fine (which his supervisor will take care of), it’s okay
From India, Mumbai
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But I would like to ask how are you going to decide whether the person stayed back late because of his/her own inefficiency ,or stayed back late because of their seniors inefficiency or was stuck in office for late hour because of some genuine unexpected emergency ? This will only lead to arguments.
If you notice a person coming in late very frequently, try talking to this employee and also the supervisor of this employee. Blunt statements like "I never asked you to stay late” or making judgments on the efficiency of the employee in question is not a right approach. Only the employee's immediate boss will be in a position to do so. If you notice people from a team being late, you can go and talk to the supervisor.
Often some employees don't come on time because they don't get any recognition for maintaining office hours. Others who come late and stay a little late take credit for putting extra effort .So the ones who actually did come on time get put off. To encourage people to come on time - announce a prize or other incentive. Besides unless there's a strict company policy on in-time, try and understand that these days its about flexi timings and as long as an employee manages his/her work fine (which his supervisor will take care of), it’s okay
From India, Mumbai
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(Fact Checked)-The user's reply contains valid points about handling late arrivals and incentivizing punctuality. However, it's important to note that the decision on addressing late arrivals and performance evaluations should primarily rest with the immediate supervisor rather than the HR directly. Encouraging punctuality through incentives is a good practice. Flexibility in work hours is also a relevant consideration in modern workplaces. (1 Acknowledge point)
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Hi,
In my organization, I encountered the same problem. We now follow a late-coming policy wherein for being late by a total of 50 minutes in a month and exceeding 5 instances of tardiness, the employee's salary is deducted by half a day's salary for that particular month, and so on. With this approach, we have been able to curb many late-coming issues. A certain limit to wait has also been established; if this limit is exceeded, we do not deduct the salary. This information is not communicated to employees, and deductions are made at the management's discretion.
Thank you.
From India, Mumbai
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In my organization, I encountered the same problem. We now follow a late-coming policy wherein for being late by a total of 50 minutes in a month and exceeding 5 instances of tardiness, the employee's salary is deducted by half a day's salary for that particular month, and so on. With this approach, we have been able to curb many late-coming issues. A certain limit to wait has also been established; if this limit is exceeded, we do not deduct the salary. This information is not communicated to employees, and deductions are made at the management's discretion.
Thank you.
From India, Mumbai
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The solution that Mr. Malik has given is too general in nature and does not apply to many industries in real life. For example, in stockbroking, it is common for an employee to stay late during results time since one has to churn a report out within 24 hours and make calls as well. Hence, it is foolhardy to expect an employee to come on time the next day.
In my opinion, as long as an employee is meeting his/her goals and targets, it is of no importance. I have seen many fools wasting time in the office, many sycophants chasing their boss's timings, and many industrious and smart people achieving things. Hence, it is totally your call depending on a case-to-case basis. Please understand the reasons behind an employee coming late rather than jumping to fabulous conclusions and trying to fit one shoe for all.
From Oman, Muscat
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In my opinion, as long as an employee is meeting his/her goals and targets, it is of no importance. I have seen many fools wasting time in the office, many sycophants chasing their boss's timings, and many industrious and smart people achieving things. Hence, it is totally your call depending on a case-to-case basis. Please understand the reasons behind an employee coming late rather than jumping to fabulous conclusions and trying to fit one shoe for all.
From Oman, Muscat
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Dear all,
In my view, late coming is not a good practice for employees and the company. If any worker works late hours, they are paid for that through overtime (O.T.) or compensatory time off (C-off), as per company policy. So, why allow anyone to come in late? In cases of emergencies or other situations, allowances can be made by formulating policies based on categories, such as allowing two hours late once a month or six times a year, something along those lines. However, ignoring latecomers will create an alarming situation later on.
MANU BAGHEL
From India
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In my view, late coming is not a good practice for employees and the company. If any worker works late hours, they are paid for that through overtime (O.T.) or compensatory time off (C-off), as per company policy. So, why allow anyone to come in late? In cases of emergencies or other situations, allowances can be made by formulating policies based on categories, such as allowing two hours late once a month or six times a year, something along those lines. However, ignoring latecomers will create an alarming situation later on.
MANU BAGHEL
From India
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Hi,
At HCL, we have two shift timings and an automated system for capturing attendance. Our Senior Vice President has communicated that all employees must roster themselves for either of the defined shift timings (11:00 am to 8:00 pm or 12:00 pm to 9:00 pm).
Previously, we used to download reports for short login hours and send them to respective department heads to inquire about their team members' late arrivals or shortened hours. This approach aimed to instill discipline and make process owners aware that HR closely monitors timings and any preferential treatment given.
Now, we have an automated system that triggers an email to the boss, employee, and HR whenever an employee logs short hours. Bosses have the authority to approve or reject these hours. The approval window is limited, and in case of rejection, the employee's attendance for that day will be marked as half-day or full-day absence.
Regards,
From India, Delhi
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At HCL, we have two shift timings and an automated system for capturing attendance. Our Senior Vice President has communicated that all employees must roster themselves for either of the defined shift timings (11:00 am to 8:00 pm or 12:00 pm to 9:00 pm).
Previously, we used to download reports for short login hours and send them to respective department heads to inquire about their team members' late arrivals or shortened hours. This approach aimed to instill discipline and make process owners aware that HR closely monitors timings and any preferential treatment given.
Now, we have an automated system that triggers an email to the boss, employee, and HR whenever an employee logs short hours. Bosses have the authority to approve or reject these hours. The approval window is limited, and in case of rejection, the employee's attendance for that day will be marked as half-day or full-day absence.
Regards,
From India, Delhi
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(Fact Checked)-The user's response contains accurate information regarding the implementation of shift timings, attendance tracking, and approval processes at HCL. The system described helps in monitoring and managing employees' attendance effectively. (1 Acknowledge point)
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Actually, when I joined an organization due to a change, I observed that although I commute a long distance and leave home at 6:30 to be on the job at 9:30, I used to be on time or a bit before time, except during rain or when there was no connecting bus, etc. I too had to report late.
But the prevailing situation is that the main people at the office never turn up until 10:30 or 11:00 am.
I told my subordinates that it is not good for them to come late like this, although they are just staying a short distance away. But the reply is that we had to stay late for the delivery of goods, as the transport of goods only comes out of production after 6:30, and then we have to wait for the transport to load and inform the party about the dispatch, etc.
Later on, the situation improved, and I brought it to the management's attention that we don't want this last-minute hanky-panky of the MD and CEO, and they have to mend their ways of dispatch. Production that comes out after 5 pm will be taken for the next day only, and dispatch will occur the next day. No more excuses from the CEO or production, and no instructions for late sittings. But the CEO is crying foul play, blaming the lack of organization in production, as they are getting overtime for their work.
Finally, we achieved 98%, with exceptions on some days.
But the main complaint is that the CEO's wife, who is responsible for calculating the time, takes her own time to provide the time log for the pay sheet. Due to that, the employees are not paid on time within the rules.
How to Bell this Cat??
There is a saying, "Pay the labor when the sweat is still wet."
But this CEO's wife never bothers about the labor of people.
So, these are the general problems HR cannot address 100% with a good relationship with management on the one hand and employees on the other hand.
From Saudi Arabia
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But the prevailing situation is that the main people at the office never turn up until 10:30 or 11:00 am.
I told my subordinates that it is not good for them to come late like this, although they are just staying a short distance away. But the reply is that we had to stay late for the delivery of goods, as the transport of goods only comes out of production after 6:30, and then we have to wait for the transport to load and inform the party about the dispatch, etc.
Later on, the situation improved, and I brought it to the management's attention that we don't want this last-minute hanky-panky of the MD and CEO, and they have to mend their ways of dispatch. Production that comes out after 5 pm will be taken for the next day only, and dispatch will occur the next day. No more excuses from the CEO or production, and no instructions for late sittings. But the CEO is crying foul play, blaming the lack of organization in production, as they are getting overtime for their work.
Finally, we achieved 98%, with exceptions on some days.
But the main complaint is that the CEO's wife, who is responsible for calculating the time, takes her own time to provide the time log for the pay sheet. Due to that, the employees are not paid on time within the rules.
How to Bell this Cat??
There is a saying, "Pay the labor when the sweat is still wet."
But this CEO's wife never bothers about the labor of people.
So, these are the general problems HR cannot address 100% with a good relationship with management on the one hand and employees on the other hand.
From Saudi Arabia
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Hi,
We have handled this effectively. Normal work hours are 8:30 hours. If an employee works for 9:29 hours, they have no permission to come in late the next day. If working between 9:30 to 11:00 hours, they can attend late by 0:30 hours. If working from 11:01 to 14:00, they can attend the office late by 1:00 hour. These rules are automatically incorporated into the attendance system. If this is not followed, Leave/Salary will be deducted without manual interference.
Earlier, employees were sitting late by 0:30 hours and coming to the office late by 0:30 hours. However, after implementing these rules, late sitting and late attendance at the office have been reduced by 70%.
Best Regards
From India, Mumbai
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We have handled this effectively. Normal work hours are 8:30 hours. If an employee works for 9:29 hours, they have no permission to come in late the next day. If working between 9:30 to 11:00 hours, they can attend late by 0:30 hours. If working from 11:01 to 14:00, they can attend the office late by 1:00 hour. These rules are automatically incorporated into the attendance system. If this is not followed, Leave/Salary will be deducted without manual interference.
Earlier, employees were sitting late by 0:30 hours and coming to the office late by 0:30 hours. However, after implementing these rules, late sitting and late attendance at the office have been reduced by 70%.
Best Regards
From India, Mumbai
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Friends,
As per me, the only possible solutions are:
1. HOD's should plan their work properly with a time frame.
2. Allocate daily tasks and try to achieve the daily allocated tasks. HOD can conduct daily coffee table meetings and discuss. REMEMBER, COFFEE TABLE always should start within the first 30 minutes of the day and only contain 15 minutes. This means everybody gets only 15 minutes to speak. It means you have somewhat control over the situation.
3. HODs/Managers must come before their subordinates because they are setting an example for others and getting work done.
Please correct me if there are any misjudgments.
Regards
From India, Mumbai
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As per me, the only possible solutions are:
1. HOD's should plan their work properly with a time frame.
2. Allocate daily tasks and try to achieve the daily allocated tasks. HOD can conduct daily coffee table meetings and discuss. REMEMBER, COFFEE TABLE always should start within the first 30 minutes of the day and only contain 15 minutes. This means everybody gets only 15 minutes to speak. It means you have somewhat control over the situation.
3. HODs/Managers must come before their subordinates because they are setting an example for others and getting work done.
Please correct me if there are any misjudgments.
Regards
From India, Mumbai
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Hi,
As the company has terminated you (if you're right), you don't have to pay them. Just ignore this as it cannot go any further. However, if you had significant years of experience in that company, you would have to negotiate and pay a nominal amount to collect your work experience letter, etc. Anyway, you are safe now. What do you mean by "legal notice"? Was it sent by the company on its letterhead or from a lawyer? Either way, you need not worry!
From India, Madras
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As the company has terminated you (if you're right), you don't have to pay them. Just ignore this as it cannot go any further. However, if you had significant years of experience in that company, you would have to negotiate and pay a nominal amount to collect your work experience letter, etc. Anyway, you are safe now. What do you mean by "legal notice"? Was it sent by the company on its letterhead or from a lawyer? Either way, you need not worry!
From India, Madras
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Dear All,
Keeping all the above points in mind, I believe the problem has different reasons with different people, while our organizational policies are customized and applicable to all. So, it becomes difficult to judge individual employees' stance as well as HR's stance in response to individual employees.
One can better solve such a problem by considering many such views and going along with the one that best matches the situation at his/her organization.
But one thing is sure, you need to take some action or the problem may get serious, and you may be held responsible as an HR.
I suggest if you could:
- Give monetary rewards to those reporting regularly on time.
- Give monetary punishment to those being late frequently, say deduct 1 day's salary for every 3 late marks.
- Or publicly address the one who is late for the day. For example, displaying on the notice board - "Latecomers of the day ------ LIST."
Mrs. Rita Vyas
Training & Placement
Raisoni Group
Nagpur
From India, Mumbai
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Keeping all the above points in mind, I believe the problem has different reasons with different people, while our organizational policies are customized and applicable to all. So, it becomes difficult to judge individual employees' stance as well as HR's stance in response to individual employees.
One can better solve such a problem by considering many such views and going along with the one that best matches the situation at his/her organization.
But one thing is sure, you need to take some action or the problem may get serious, and you may be held responsible as an HR.
I suggest if you could:
- Give monetary rewards to those reporting regularly on time.
- Give monetary punishment to those being late frequently, say deduct 1 day's salary for every 3 late marks.
- Or publicly address the one who is late for the day. For example, displaying on the notice board - "Latecomers of the day ------ LIST."
Mrs. Rita Vyas
Training & Placement
Raisoni Group
Nagpur
From India, Mumbai
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Dear Pooja,
Late coming is an issue encountered in many industries, and different companies follow various rules to address tardiness. If a person stays back after office hours, it must be approved by their immediate supervisor. Furthermore, if an employee arrives late the next day due to working late the previous day, approval from their divisional head is required.
However, we do allow employees to be late by up to 2 hours from their shift start time twice a month, but this is solely at the discretion of the management, and employees cannot claim it as a right. If an employee is late beyond three instances, they will be marked as half a day off. This policy applies only to staff employees.
To raise awareness among employees, consider sending a daily pop-up to their PCs so they are reminded of the consequences of tardiness.
Thank you.
From India, Delhi
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Late coming is an issue encountered in many industries, and different companies follow various rules to address tardiness. If a person stays back after office hours, it must be approved by their immediate supervisor. Furthermore, if an employee arrives late the next day due to working late the previous day, approval from their divisional head is required.
However, we do allow employees to be late by up to 2 hours from their shift start time twice a month, but this is solely at the discretion of the management, and employees cannot claim it as a right. If an employee is late beyond three instances, they will be marked as half a day off. This policy applies only to staff employees.
To raise awareness among employees, consider sending a daily pop-up to their PCs so they are reminded of the consequences of tardiness.
Thank you.
From India, Delhi
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Dear, I want to say only that "Come with punctuality, go with responsibility." If any employee is late, then you should send a daily email to the department head, detailing the number of days the person was late in a month. Please also forward this information to the plant head. This approach will instill a sense of accountability among employees.
From India
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From India
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Hi Pooja,
We do have the same problem. What we practice is that all the employees who sit late are given a 45-minute buffer time in the morning. If someone is late again, they need to get approval or it will be counted as a half-day.
Regards,
sanigeo
From India, Kochi
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We do have the same problem. What we practice is that all the employees who sit late are given a 45-minute buffer time in the morning. If someone is late again, they need to get approval or it will be counted as a half-day.
Regards,
sanigeo
From India, Kochi
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Subject: Reminder Regarding Late Reporting
Dear Team,
This is a gentle reminder to all employees regarding the importance of punctuality in reporting to work. It has come to our attention that some individuals have been consistently reporting late.
We kindly request everyone to adhere to the designated reporting times to ensure smooth operations within the organization. Failure to comply with these guidelines may result in further disciplinary actions.
Should there be any concerns or valid reasons for unavoidable delays, please communicate them with your respective supervisors in advance.
Thank you for your attention to this matter.
Best regards,
Satish
From India, Bangalore
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Dear Team,
This is a gentle reminder to all employees regarding the importance of punctuality in reporting to work. It has come to our attention that some individuals have been consistently reporting late.
We kindly request everyone to adhere to the designated reporting times to ensure smooth operations within the organization. Failure to comply with these guidelines may result in further disciplinary actions.
Should there be any concerns or valid reasons for unavoidable delays, please communicate them with your respective supervisors in advance.
Thank you for your attention to this matter.
Best regards,
Satish
From India, Bangalore
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Dear Pooja,
Your question is very nice because all of us who are associated with HR face this problem in our organizations. The response of your employees to being asked about their late coming, "they tend to say that we don't question them at the time when they work late, so why do we question their late arrivals?" is incorrect. This is because they have been assigned work to complete within a specific timeframe, whether it involves late sitting or not. Additionally, these same employees receive incentives, rewards, promotions, etc., from their employers based on meeting this timeframe. Therefore, there should be no confusion between late sitting and late coming.
In my personal opinion, late coming is a habit.
Regards,
Shailendra Gupta
Email: shailendra.lumax@gmail.com
Phone: 09810166507
From India, Delhi
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Your question is very nice because all of us who are associated with HR face this problem in our organizations. The response of your employees to being asked about their late coming, "they tend to say that we don't question them at the time when they work late, so why do we question their late arrivals?" is incorrect. This is because they have been assigned work to complete within a specific timeframe, whether it involves late sitting or not. Additionally, these same employees receive incentives, rewards, promotions, etc., from their employers based on meeting this timeframe. Therefore, there should be no confusion between late sitting and late coming.
In my personal opinion, late coming is a habit.
Regards,
Shailendra Gupta
Email: shailendra.lumax@gmail.com
Phone: 09810166507
From India, Delhi
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There should be an approval of the Head of Department (HOD). If the HOD is allowing their team to come in late after working late hours, then I do not think there should be any problem for HR. Because the moment the HOD approves, the costs will be charged to the particular department, making it easier for HR to update their records for audit purposes.
From India
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From India
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Hi all,
In the organizations where Overtime (OT) is paid, or 'Compensatory Off' is given for working beyond 'normal working hours', the issue is dealt with systematically. However, in the organizations where OT or Compensatory Off is not given to the employees, we need to be discreet in checking the personnel for 'late coming'.
This is an HR issue, and if the things could have been that straightforward, as per the books, then there is no need for checking/counseling; the attendance card reader could have done the job - anyone late, deduct the salary as per set norms!
We need to mark who are the 'habitual latecomers', and after consulting their respective group heads, we can determine who is getting late because of working late (due to organizational requirements) and who are the actual defaulters. There can be no 'hard and fast' solutions to such situations, and no 'fixed answers'; such situations are where our managerial skills come to the fore.
So, let's be discreet and understanding. Or, let the 'attendance card reader' do the job.
From India
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In the organizations where Overtime (OT) is paid, or 'Compensatory Off' is given for working beyond 'normal working hours', the issue is dealt with systematically. However, in the organizations where OT or Compensatory Off is not given to the employees, we need to be discreet in checking the personnel for 'late coming'.
This is an HR issue, and if the things could have been that straightforward, as per the books, then there is no need for checking/counseling; the attendance card reader could have done the job - anyone late, deduct the salary as per set norms!
We need to mark who are the 'habitual latecomers', and after consulting their respective group heads, we can determine who is getting late because of working late (due to organizational requirements) and who are the actual defaulters. There can be no 'hard and fast' solutions to such situations, and no 'fixed answers'; such situations are where our managerial skills come to the fore.
So, let's be discreet and understanding. Or, let the 'attendance card reader' do the job.
From India
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I totally disagree with Mr. Malik's statement that HR has not asked for late sitting. However, I agree with him on maintaining discipline and decorum in the office.
Late coming and late sitting have several reasons. HR can request an employee to be punctual in the office. Meanwhile, they should also inquire about the reasons for late sitting every day.
Late sitting by a junior staff member could be due to the boss arriving late in the office, workload, or last-minute emergencies. When addressing an employee's consistent lateness, it is essential to check if the late sitting hours can be compensated through monetary benefits or other means. If so, even if an employee leaves the office late, they should arrive on time. Alternatively, flexible timings should be considered.
In my opinion, only considering the organization's perspective can lead to the gradual collapse of the system and foster resentment among employees, potentially leading to attrition.
Overall, all aspects depend on the organization's policies.
Thanks,
Essprsd
From India, Bhopal
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Late coming and late sitting have several reasons. HR can request an employee to be punctual in the office. Meanwhile, they should also inquire about the reasons for late sitting every day.
Late sitting by a junior staff member could be due to the boss arriving late in the office, workload, or last-minute emergencies. When addressing an employee's consistent lateness, it is essential to check if the late sitting hours can be compensated through monetary benefits or other means. If so, even if an employee leaves the office late, they should arrive on time. Alternatively, flexible timings should be considered.
In my opinion, only considering the organization's perspective can lead to the gradual collapse of the system and foster resentment among employees, potentially leading to attrition.
Overall, all aspects depend on the organization's policies.
Thanks,
Essprsd
From India, Bhopal
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Dear Seniors,
This is truly a real-time problem discussion, and the points raised are quite relevant to the situation. I will not say this is my opinion or what I think, but LATE COMING IS NOTHING BUT A HABIT. This has been proven in my own organization through observations over the past two years. Despite having flexi-hours for attendance, ironically, those who live nearby and opt for the last slot of the day never reach the office on time.
Even with an extra 10-15 minutes of grace, they still request more time and have finally admitted to it being a habit. This observation is not based on a single instance but on a group that was taken as a sample. Please provide more insights.
Thanks.
From United States, Cambridge
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This is truly a real-time problem discussion, and the points raised are quite relevant to the situation. I will not say this is my opinion or what I think, but LATE COMING IS NOTHING BUT A HABIT. This has been proven in my own organization through observations over the past two years. Despite having flexi-hours for attendance, ironically, those who live nearby and opt for the last slot of the day never reach the office on time.
Even with an extra 10-15 minutes of grace, they still request more time and have finally admitted to it being a habit. This observation is not based on a single instance but on a group that was taken as a sample. Please provide more insights.
Thanks.
From United States, Cambridge
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I only say one thing... It's not a new thing to come late in an organization, but the thing is certain: "If anybody is not able to complete his job within his 8-hour workday, then he is lacking in time management skills." It involves a lot of things like commitment to projects and negligence in planning.
From United States, Canton
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From United States, Canton
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Hi all, this would be my response.
Going late does not provide a privilege for employees to arrive late to the office. Working late hours will be credited to employee performance and should be reflected in their performance rating. If lateness is frequent, it should be met with necessary penalties or disciplinary action. Establish a strict code of compliance regarding attendance to reduce lateness and improve productivity.
Also, note that all employees are not the same. As an HR professional, you should know whom to evaluate and on what scale. Always have a logical reason when addressing your employees.
From United Arab Emirates, Dubai
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Going late does not provide a privilege for employees to arrive late to the office. Working late hours will be credited to employee performance and should be reflected in their performance rating. If lateness is frequent, it should be met with necessary penalties or disciplinary action. Establish a strict code of compliance regarding attendance to reduce lateness and improve productivity.
Also, note that all employees are not the same. As an HR professional, you should know whom to evaluate and on what scale. Always have a logical reason when addressing your employees.
From United Arab Emirates, Dubai
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(Fact Checked)-The user reply contains generally accurate information and aligns with best HR practices. However, it would be beneficial to emphasize the importance of open communication to understand the reasons behind lateness before implementing penalties. (1 Acknowledge point)
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Hi,
First of all, any organization should have a policy on timings, including permission to come late for 3-5 days in a month - say up to 15 minutes on each occasion or so. If the employee comes late beyond the permitted time, half a day leave or half a day salary should be deducted from the employee's account. As an HR person, it is your responsibility to implement this and also to explain to the employees that while coming to work on time is discipline, staying back late to complete work is commitment. Explain that both aspects are equally important and staying back late will be rewarded/taken into account during the appraisal by the respective boss and this does not give the employee an automatic right to come late to work which shows a lack of discipline.
All the best,
Krishnan
From India, Madras
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First of all, any organization should have a policy on timings, including permission to come late for 3-5 days in a month - say up to 15 minutes on each occasion or so. If the employee comes late beyond the permitted time, half a day leave or half a day salary should be deducted from the employee's account. As an HR person, it is your responsibility to implement this and also to explain to the employees that while coming to work on time is discipline, staying back late to complete work is commitment. Explain that both aspects are equally important and staying back late will be rewarded/taken into account during the appraisal by the respective boss and this does not give the employee an automatic right to come late to work which shows a lack of discipline.
All the best,
Krishnan
From India, Madras
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Hi All,
Thank you all for your responses. This discussion is turning out to be a really fruitful one. So many opinions have been provided, and it definitely makes me clearer on my stance in a situation like this. Also, I feel that such varied opinions have been shared that I am sure our fellow CiteHRites with varied working styles, cultures, etc., will find a solution to this problem that is specifically relevant to their organization.
Regards,
Pooja
From India, Ahmadabad
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Thank you all for your responses. This discussion is turning out to be a really fruitful one. So many opinions have been provided, and it definitely makes me clearer on my stance in a situation like this. Also, I feel that such varied opinions have been shared that I am sure our fellow CiteHRites with varied working styles, cultures, etc., will find a solution to this problem that is specifically relevant to their organization.
Regards,
Pooja
From India, Ahmadabad
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Hi,
Understanding the scenario, the same was faced in our office where the MD had announced that as per policy, everyone needs to be on time to the office, and leaving depends upon the work priority. However, later there were late penalty charges: three late grace periods and then Rs. 10 for each late arrival.
From India, Mumbai
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Understanding the scenario, the same was faced in our office where the MD had announced that as per policy, everyone needs to be on time to the office, and leaving depends upon the work priority. However, later there were late penalty charges: three late grace periods and then Rs. 10 for each late arrival.
From India, Mumbai
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I also face the same problem of employee and their timing. But I tried one solution: I have asked the managers to give me the flexible timing of their team, and the team should follow the same. Before that, I check with the employees also to see if they are okay with that. Only then I consider it as final, and employees should follow the same. This has solved my problem a lot. But as we all know, "rules are meant to be broken," a few still come late and do not follow the flexible timing.
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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A man came home from work late.doc
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(Fact Checked)-The user's reply is mostly correct in highlighting the complexities and reasons for employees working late. However, it's essential to address both the need for punctuality and the underlying issues causing late arrivals. Flexibility and understanding are crucial. (1 Acknowledge point)