Tariq - Nowhere I had two different opinions.
Ash: What I dont understand is that at one point you say HR is mere only an implementor and refuse to take blame for any policy or work done by HR then at very second instance you jump to supporting HR.
If you take time to read what you have typed above my dear, both the sentences mean the same. You are plain - driven by emotions.
I only need you to understand that I dont necessarily support the HR people- but I respect the HR function and try to abide with what is expected. I apologize if whatever I have typed has not given you the time to understand and comprehend it in the right way (which a person sans emotions will be able to do)
To me - whatever you have mentioned, is just an employee who is not able to see the other side of what is happening. Or simply - you dont value other's contribution. If you feel that people who you are working with are not being responsible, please request them to be so. Dont generalize the situation. Learn to respect another profession, only then people will respect you.
If you expect delays to be proactively communicated - then you should probably request for that, not on citehr, but to your HR.
Even before you ask someone to understand you, please take time to read what message they are trying to get across your head. Stay and dont lose focus. Unfortunately I cant deal with your emotions.
I cant change your attitude and neither will I nod my head to all the cry talk. Take a look at the big picture. People who complain can only keep complaining. I know you will surely revert. That will justify the above statement too.
And when you requested the person who started the thread to work as a Non-HR, I would like you to think over this - Did anyone tell you that your work was bad? I guess you have been stressed over a few things and you are just not able to think in the right direction. No matter what people are trying to communicate with you, you turn as an argumentative person.
Good Luck!
From India, Madras
54Ash: What I dont understand is that at one point you say HR is mere only an implementor and refuse to take blame for any policy or work done by HR then at very second instance you jump to supporting HR.
If you take time to read what you have typed above my dear, both the sentences mean the same. You are plain - driven by emotions.
I only need you to understand that I dont necessarily support the HR people- but I respect the HR function and try to abide with what is expected. I apologize if whatever I have typed has not given you the time to understand and comprehend it in the right way (which a person sans emotions will be able to do)
To me - whatever you have mentioned, is just an employee who is not able to see the other side of what is happening. Or simply - you dont value other's contribution. If you feel that people who you are working with are not being responsible, please request them to be so. Dont generalize the situation. Learn to respect another profession, only then people will respect you.
If you expect delays to be proactively communicated - then you should probably request for that, not on citehr, but to your HR.
Even before you ask someone to understand you, please take time to read what message they are trying to get across your head. Stay and dont lose focus. Unfortunately I cant deal with your emotions.
I cant change your attitude and neither will I nod my head to all the cry talk. Take a look at the big picture. People who complain can only keep complaining. I know you will surely revert. That will justify the above statement too.
And when you requested the person who started the thread to work as a Non-HR, I would like you to think over this - Did anyone tell you that your work was bad? I guess you have been stressed over a few things and you are just not able to think in the right direction. No matter what people are trying to communicate with you, you turn as an argumentative person.
Good Luck!
From India, Madras
Dear Meenakshi,
First of all KUDOS to you for starting this thread. Quite bold and debatable I must say!
Let's go back to our childhood!! Remember, whenever we use to get scolded from our either of the parents, we use to look up to either of them in a hope that mother or father will save us.
Believe you me, in corporate world, exactly the same happens. Emplyoees are like children who look upto HR with great hopes in hard times. that's where this profession becomes challenging where you have to live up to the expectations of employee while being loyal to management.
But ironically in recent times, this challenging and noble profession is becoming tainted as some fishes are spoiling the pond.
one of my very good friend who's heading HR dept. in one of the leading group companies of India, described complete HR in 5 words and those five words are:-
H --> Hear
U --> Understamd
M --> Motivate
A --> Acknowledge
N --> Negotiate
as luck would have it , not every HR professional follows it now a days & I do not blame them completely, beacuse most of the times they are engrossed in adding the quantity, so the major branch of HR i.e. Employee relations is left out or ignored completely.
Yes, ensuring adherence of Company Policies & procedures is HR's Job, but also at the same time, ensuring those Policies & Procedures are employee friendly, is also a vital responsibilities of HR. I'm not targeting the HR fraternity over here, but as I mentioned above, "some fishes are spoiling the pond".
Now let me share you the policy of a very famous company in India (can't name it for obvious reasons !):-
the Probation period is for 18 months (whereas normally it is 6 months)
No leaves are allowed during probation period (only 4 sick leaves!!! else get salary deducted)
3 Months of Notice Period !!!
Now cross your heart and tell me how employee friendly these policies are????
Can the Management or HR of this company can ever achieve Employee Satisfaction???
These are the burning questions which are still left unanswered.
Honeslty speaking, Most of us have stopped "Serving" as we are only "Working", because anything we consider as service will not only keep us focused and concerned towards our employees, but also service will not make us bored (as we keep on cribbing that our job has become monotonous!!)
R's
Danny
From India, Delhi
First of all KUDOS to you for starting this thread. Quite bold and debatable I must say!
Let's go back to our childhood!! Remember, whenever we use to get scolded from our either of the parents, we use to look up to either of them in a hope that mother or father will save us.
Believe you me, in corporate world, exactly the same happens. Emplyoees are like children who look upto HR with great hopes in hard times. that's where this profession becomes challenging where you have to live up to the expectations of employee while being loyal to management.
But ironically in recent times, this challenging and noble profession is becoming tainted as some fishes are spoiling the pond.
one of my very good friend who's heading HR dept. in one of the leading group companies of India, described complete HR in 5 words and those five words are:-
H --> Hear
U --> Understamd
M --> Motivate
A --> Acknowledge
N --> Negotiate
as luck would have it , not every HR professional follows it now a days & I do not blame them completely, beacuse most of the times they are engrossed in adding the quantity, so the major branch of HR i.e. Employee relations is left out or ignored completely.
Yes, ensuring adherence of Company Policies & procedures is HR's Job, but also at the same time, ensuring those Policies & Procedures are employee friendly, is also a vital responsibilities of HR. I'm not targeting the HR fraternity over here, but as I mentioned above, "some fishes are spoiling the pond".
Now let me share you the policy of a very famous company in India (can't name it for obvious reasons !):-
the Probation period is for 18 months (whereas normally it is 6 months)
No leaves are allowed during probation period (only 4 sick leaves!!! else get salary deducted)
3 Months of Notice Period !!!
Now cross your heart and tell me how employee friendly these policies are????
Can the Management or HR of this company can ever achieve Employee Satisfaction???
These are the burning questions which are still left unanswered.
Honeslty speaking, Most of us have stopped "Serving" as we are only "Working", because anything we consider as service will not only keep us focused and concerned towards our employees, but also service will not make us bored (as we keep on cribbing that our job has become monotonous!!)
R's
Danny
From India, Delhi
Ash:
Also, tell me that If you hate Congress that doesnt makes you a traitor, correct? or if you hate US of A then that doesnt makes you a terrorist, right? So, please get over this "If you love HR, you love the world and if you hate HR you hate the world" attitude. Just because I dont like HR and its policies, it doesnt makes me an anti people, anti humanity and a person filled with negativity and a cry baby.
Also, tell me that If you hate Congress that doesnt makes you a traitor, correct? or if you hate US of A then that doesnt makes you a terrorist, right? So, please get over this "If you love HR, you love the world and if you hate HR you hate the world" attitude. Just because I dont like HR and its policies, it doesnt makes me an anti people, anti humanity and a person filled with negativity and a cry baby.
Well ask the Animals in a Circus whether they like their Ring-Master and you would know why employees are so much averse against HR personnell
From India, Mumbai
From India, Mumbai
Can understand the frustration of people. See how 300+ people responded to an article "Human Resource or Harassing Resource"
I think the recent mass layoffs, recession impact in pay cheques, policies etc would have definitely influenced the attitude of people towards this wonderful profession.
HR job is one of the most critical job in any organization, irrespective of its size. Quality of HR department depends on the person who sits in HR Office and more importantly delegation of power and management style by CEO and investors. Another critical aspect for success of HR department would be level of understanding with line management folks.
These are some hardcore realities...
From India, Bangalore
I think the recent mass layoffs, recession impact in pay cheques, policies etc would have definitely influenced the attitude of people towards this wonderful profession.
HR job is one of the most critical job in any organization, irrespective of its size. Quality of HR department depends on the person who sits in HR Office and more importantly delegation of power and management style by CEO and investors. Another critical aspect for success of HR department would be level of understanding with line management folks.
These are some hardcore realities...
- HR Manager can't do social service inside the organization because HR needs to promote CEO or Company (paid for that job, right?)
- Please don't expect HR to come up with 'employee friendly' policies but should be 'investor friendly'
- Across the globe, role of HR is changing. Getting flavor of a strategist, profit center etc.
- HR should come out of "oh poor me" image, it won't work further ( employees are aware of the fact that HR is only communicating what Top Management decides)
- HR folks can easily become 'scapegoats' for the non-professional practices of certain investors. So stay away from such traps and keep certain values and please just don't get fascinated with fat pay cheques alone
- Companies should enable more transparency in terms of processes and here HR needs to convince management ( needs to show the money)
- Investors should not only consider HR as their messenger but give due importance for HR's opinion for decision making as far as people practices are concerned
- HR should share the "Discipline Manager" role with Line Management
- Like any other profession, there can be lazy, indifferent and egocentric people who stays in job just by doing unnecessary power politics, in this profession also. Either they need to learn professional practices or otherwise investor will suffer
From India, Bangalore
No......... No all employees so much averse against hr. There is only some of people who dislikes hr. I think the hr is the best person in company who is visually trying to do the best.
From India, Pune
From India, Pune
My Dear Ash
At first you ask me about what my experiences are about HR and then you tell me that I should not generalize the situation and should direct it to the concerned people and not to cite HR? I was telling you about the xp and the reason of my opining about HR. Either you should not ask questions and when they are answered you should listen and understand. The way you are behaving is actually a typical HR behavior. Dont listen, dopnt understand just keep on saying what you want to say. Also for meenakshi, I said that because she was the one who said try being an HR, from my side instead try being a non HR because then she will feel how other employees feel. Cant you see your self, in this entire thread only HRs are the one who claims that they are right and rest all other are saying opposite.. cant you see this obvious thing? Anyways, I rest my argument here because you cant argue with HR, the only thing HR is good at is arguing and simple and plain arguing.
At first you ask me about what my experiences are about HR and then you tell me that I should not generalize the situation and should direct it to the concerned people and not to cite HR? I was telling you about the xp and the reason of my opining about HR. Either you should not ask questions and when they are answered you should listen and understand. The way you are behaving is actually a typical HR behavior. Dont listen, dopnt understand just keep on saying what you want to say. Also for meenakshi, I said that because she was the one who said try being an HR, from my side instead try being a non HR because then she will feel how other employees feel. Cant you see your self, in this entire thread only HRs are the one who claims that they are right and rest all other are saying opposite.. cant you see this obvious thing? Anyways, I rest my argument here because you cant argue with HR, the only thing HR is good at is arguing and simple and plain arguing.
Also, I rest my argument here with ASH as you cannot argue with HR so its better not to get in mud slinging. Spl the one who cannot stick the thier own word
Yes you are right. We have HR that we have food. We have HR that we have rain. We have HR that we dont have to fight. It is HR that we have thunder and lightning. It is HR that god created earth. It is HR that we have peace now. Too bad for where there is drought, too bad there where people are fighting .. why.. because they dont have HR.. correct? If any thing right happens in any orgganization always praise HR because it is ultimately HR policy that gave the correct result. If any thing goes wrong, it is the manger and the policy decider or senior managment and HR is the megre implementor. Please grow up with this HR centered attitude.
Companies have grown and companies will grow with or without HR. Each and every organization has got different departments from marketing to admit to production to finance, they all support a company to grow. Saying that HR is the nanny of the company is the over statement of the millenium. Honeslty do you thin that Because HR is there you the company or do you think you have company then you have HR. Compannies where you dont have HR, they also grow and earn profit. And honestly tell me one thing.. How many CEOs MDs you see from HR backkground?
I have seen top bosses from all backgrounds but Not from HR. Tell me why please.
Also dont say that HR gives me my salary to anyone. HR does not. Every one earns his salary. Whatever HR does they are hired to do that and even then they cannot do half of what they claim. HR fecilitates salary transfer thats all and at times they cant even do that properly.
Getover with HR is World/God attitude.
Dear Tariq
I appreciate your postings and share your hurt and feeling of humiliation. Thanks for all the trouble you are taking in holding up the mirror.
What emerges is not a friendly, warm, supportive image; but an obstinate, stubborn bully who refuses to listen, who is insensitive to see the other's viewpoint, who thinks s/he is always right.
A small criticism, and the HR fraternity; instead of "listening" with sensitivity to the woes and pains of others; is on the defensive; rather on the offensive - this fellow must be taught 'the lesson' !!
Why can't we accept that most often the HR are callous and insensitive. They lack the technical competency to understand their own functional areas (not to speak of the business operations).
Compare it with the technical competency of Finance people. Even though they are also not technical persons, they understand operations to an extent that they can allocate costs and revenue at each step; point out wasteful expenditures, audit the system etc.
It is very rarely that I come across an HR who is soft-spoken, humble, warm, enthusiastic, friendly and sharp. Rather, such qualities are looked down upon, and an HR who acts like a 'policeman' or a bully, is preferred !!!
It is the king-size ego that an HR acquires (due to his situational proximity with the management or the "Big Boss"), which spoils him/her beyond redemption.
Warm regards.
From India, Delhi
I appreciate your postings and share your hurt and feeling of humiliation. Thanks for all the trouble you are taking in holding up the mirror.
What emerges is not a friendly, warm, supportive image; but an obstinate, stubborn bully who refuses to listen, who is insensitive to see the other's viewpoint, who thinks s/he is always right.
A small criticism, and the HR fraternity; instead of "listening" with sensitivity to the woes and pains of others; is on the defensive; rather on the offensive - this fellow must be taught 'the lesson' !!
Why can't we accept that most often the HR are callous and insensitive. They lack the technical competency to understand their own functional areas (not to speak of the business operations).
Compare it with the technical competency of Finance people. Even though they are also not technical persons, they understand operations to an extent that they can allocate costs and revenue at each step; point out wasteful expenditures, audit the system etc.
It is very rarely that I come across an HR who is soft-spoken, humble, warm, enthusiastic, friendly and sharp. Rather, such qualities are looked down upon, and an HR who acts like a 'policeman' or a bully, is preferred !!!
It is the king-size ego that an HR acquires (due to his situational proximity with the management or the "Big Boss"), which spoils him/her beyond redemption.
Warm regards.
From India, Delhi
Community Support and Knowledge-base on business, career and organisational prospects and issues - Register and Log In to CiteHR and post your query, download formats and be part of a fostered community of professionals.