Yes, I think I have to try a few other organizations before going into academics. I was referring to the discrimination faced by non-westerners. I came to know from multiple people that Indians (irrespective of their religion), Pakistanis, Filipinos, Malays, Indonesians face discrimination in terms of pay and benefits compared to a westerner in the same post with the same academic qualifications and work experience. Although it is absolutely contradictory to Islamic tenets, unfortunately, it's a harsh reality faced by many. I also agree that one should never argue with a Saudi; otherwise, he should prepare for real trouble. There are many such cases; I have to open a new thread to discuss all of them.
From India, Mumbai
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7From India, Mumbai
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Dear Peace Promoter,
Whatever you have received as information from your friends and relatives is the fact and it's common in the Middle East. Perhaps you haven't received information about those expatriates living in Western countries or any other foreign countries. I would say that it's a psychological war between the natives and foreigners. For example, just imagine, will Westerners allow non-Westerners to take the lead in their own country? Never.
"A lion cannot rule in another lion's den."
Perhaps, it will take time for you to understand the nature of humans living in different parts of this world, brother. Please do not allow information that sounds negative to be stored in your brain, nor give it high importance. It's the responsibility of every human to demonstrate humanity. But, it's not happening to the level as it is expected.
Till doomsday, there will be good and bad. We have to learn to survive in this world as long as we are alive.
Please do not think too much, else you will not be able to live with peace of mind. Just do your job and leave everything to Almighty Allah. It's my sincere advice to you.
With profound regards,
"Yes, I think I have to try a few other organizations before going into academics.
I was referring to the discrimination faced by non-Westerners. I came to know from multiple people that Indians (irrespective of their religion), Pakistanis, Filipinos, Malays, Indonesians face discrimination in terms of pay and benefits as compared to a Westerner in the same post and with the same academic qualification and work experience. Although it is absolutely contradictory to Islamic tenets, unfortunately, it's a harsh reality faced by many. I also agree that one should never argue with a Saudi; otherwise, he should prepare for real trouble. There are many such cases; I have to open a new thread to discuss all of them."
From India, Chennai
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Whatever you have received as information from your friends and relatives is the fact and it's common in the Middle East. Perhaps you haven't received information about those expatriates living in Western countries or any other foreign countries. I would say that it's a psychological war between the natives and foreigners. For example, just imagine, will Westerners allow non-Westerners to take the lead in their own country? Never.
"A lion cannot rule in another lion's den."
Perhaps, it will take time for you to understand the nature of humans living in different parts of this world, brother. Please do not allow information that sounds negative to be stored in your brain, nor give it high importance. It's the responsibility of every human to demonstrate humanity. But, it's not happening to the level as it is expected.
Till doomsday, there will be good and bad. We have to learn to survive in this world as long as we are alive.
Please do not think too much, else you will not be able to live with peace of mind. Just do your job and leave everything to Almighty Allah. It's my sincere advice to you.
With profound regards,
"Yes, I think I have to try a few other organizations before going into academics.
I was referring to the discrimination faced by non-Westerners. I came to know from multiple people that Indians (irrespective of their religion), Pakistanis, Filipinos, Malays, Indonesians face discrimination in terms of pay and benefits as compared to a Westerner in the same post and with the same academic qualification and work experience. Although it is absolutely contradictory to Islamic tenets, unfortunately, it's a harsh reality faced by many. I also agree that one should never argue with a Saudi; otherwise, he should prepare for real trouble. There are many such cases; I have to open a new thread to discuss all of them."
From India, Chennai
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Dear Shaik Abdul,
Things have changed in the West. There are Asians holding CEO positions in large organizations; some examples can be found at In Pictures: Eight Indian CEOs At Big U.S. Companies - Vikram Pandit - Forbes.com. A number of my friends have held managerial positions in America, hold high positions in American Universities, and are professors in the UK. I have no idea about the situation in other countries.
However, it used to be different 20-30 years ago. It was even difficult to find accommodation in certain areas, and the same is true even now in conservative areas. People learned to survive and progress by educating ourselves to be better qualified than the locals.
Have a nice day.
Simhan
From United Kingdom
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Things have changed in the West. There are Asians holding CEO positions in large organizations; some examples can be found at In Pictures: Eight Indian CEOs At Big U.S. Companies - Vikram Pandit - Forbes.com. A number of my friends have held managerial positions in America, hold high positions in American Universities, and are professors in the UK. I have no idea about the situation in other countries.
However, it used to be different 20-30 years ago. It was even difficult to find accommodation in certain areas, and the same is true even now in conservative areas. People learned to survive and progress by educating ourselves to be better qualified than the locals.
Have a nice day.
Simhan
From United Kingdom
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Dear Mr. Simhan,
I do agree with you; however, wherever there is a PROPORTIONAL or HIGH DEMAND, in lieu of LOCAL'S, EXPATRIATE'S are hired. Even this is found in the MIDDLE EAST, but honestly speaking, in certain areas, even though EXPATRIATE's hold THE TOP MOST POSITION, they are just similar to other EMPLOYEES, maybe authorized with certain POWERS subject to BOUNDARY OF OPERATIONS (LIMITATIONS). Hope you agree with the facts because there are LIMITATIONS.
With profound regards
From India, Chennai
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I do agree with you; however, wherever there is a PROPORTIONAL or HIGH DEMAND, in lieu of LOCAL'S, EXPATRIATE'S are hired. Even this is found in the MIDDLE EAST, but honestly speaking, in certain areas, even though EXPATRIATE's hold THE TOP MOST POSITION, they are just similar to other EMPLOYEES, maybe authorized with certain POWERS subject to BOUNDARY OF OPERATIONS (LIMITATIONS). Hope you agree with the facts because there are LIMITATIONS.
With profound regards
From India, Chennai
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The CEOs I have quoted are exceptions. Similarly, the list of prominent Indians in the list at List of Indian Americans - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
In general, you are right; minorities face problems wherever they may be.
From United Kingdom
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In general, you are right; minorities face problems wherever they may be.
From United Kingdom
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Dear Peace Promoter,
What I felt was that humans across the globe are victims of a preconceived mindset, which is inherited and difficult to change unless they accept the truth as truth itself. Hence, such bad activities are challenging to control. Nevertheless, hard work is in progress to make humans realize the facts, which are nothing but the truth. Many generations have passed, and there were very few scholars who studied Islam with an objective and its relevance to human mankind, explaining why it was prescribed to be followed strictly. Muslims themselves, belonging to other parts of the world (apart from Arab nations), later understood the facts when great scholars like Dr. Zakir Naik first started describing the authentic facts and bridging the gap (misunderstandings/misconceptions) between Muslims and non-Muslims about the God/Allah that we humans worship. This was followed by Mr. Ahmed Deedat, Mr. Yassir Fazaga, Mr. Yosuf Estes, and many more.
It will take time for humans to understand Islam and its benefits. What needs to be changed is the mindset, which is nothing but a strong belief.
It is we humans who are responsible for everything, as we have created our own cultures based not on facts but on individual comfort styles. We don't accept ourselves as humans first but categorize ourselves in many ways.
Kindly correct me if I am wrong.
With profound regards,
From India, Chennai
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What I felt was that humans across the globe are victims of a preconceived mindset, which is inherited and difficult to change unless they accept the truth as truth itself. Hence, such bad activities are challenging to control. Nevertheless, hard work is in progress to make humans realize the facts, which are nothing but the truth. Many generations have passed, and there were very few scholars who studied Islam with an objective and its relevance to human mankind, explaining why it was prescribed to be followed strictly. Muslims themselves, belonging to other parts of the world (apart from Arab nations), later understood the facts when great scholars like Dr. Zakir Naik first started describing the authentic facts and bridging the gap (misunderstandings/misconceptions) between Muslims and non-Muslims about the God/Allah that we humans worship. This was followed by Mr. Ahmed Deedat, Mr. Yassir Fazaga, Mr. Yosuf Estes, and many more.
It will take time for humans to understand Islam and its benefits. What needs to be changed is the mindset, which is nothing but a strong belief.
It is we humans who are responsible for everything, as we have created our own cultures based not on facts but on individual comfort styles. We don't accept ourselves as humans first but categorize ourselves in many ways.
Kindly correct me if I am wrong.
With profound regards,
From India, Chennai
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Dear PeacePromoter,
You are right to say that we have digressed. That's what happens when one moves from the topic in a public forum. However, in order to impress upon people that discrimination in whatever form is inherent in humans, we have to give examples from other areas.
As I have been away from India for a long time, I can't express opinions on the current situation in India. However, since there are MNCs in India, discrimination may not be a company policy but could be followed by individual managers. It's not advisable to name organizations in a public forum.
Have a nice day.
Simhan
From United Kingdom
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You are right to say that we have digressed. That's what happens when one moves from the topic in a public forum. However, in order to impress upon people that discrimination in whatever form is inherent in humans, we have to give examples from other areas.
As I have been away from India for a long time, I can't express opinions on the current situation in India. However, since there are MNCs in India, discrimination may not be a company policy but could be followed by individual managers. It's not advisable to name organizations in a public forum.
Have a nice day.
Simhan
From United Kingdom
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Dear Brother,
I am sorry for the misunderstanding. Istakhara website has a team of professionals as well. Thanks to all those who corrected me for my lack of knowledge.
I don't think consulting a priest is a wrong suggestion. Most of the time, I consult my senior priest, so I suggested it.
Dear Khadir,
I have knowledge of Islam; I hope you know that. I may be wrong in a few understandings. By the way, thanks for the clarification.
From India, Bangalore
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I am sorry for the misunderstanding. Istakhara website has a team of professionals as well. Thanks to all those who corrected me for my lack of knowledge.
I don't think consulting a priest is a wrong suggestion. Most of the time, I consult my senior priest, so I suggested it.
Dear Khadir,
I have knowledge of Islam; I hope you know that. I may be wrong in a few understandings. By the way, thanks for the clarification.
From India, Bangalore
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Peace and greetings to everyone,
I request maximum response to my queries as it would directly influence my career choice. To begin with, for those who aren't aware (both Muslims and non-Muslims), there's a difference between a Muslim by name and a Muslim by faith. If not all, but most of the Muslims today are only Muslims because their fathers (parents) were Muslims, and it's only a matter of racial creed rather than having faith in the religion of Islam. Hence, most of the Muslims you see around in corporations are only people of different 'cultural' upbringing rather than people of different faith and ideologies.
In Arabic lexicon, a Muslim can only be a person who practices Islam. It is formulated by the Arabic prefix 'mu' with Islam = Muslim. Same as mu + safar = musafir (traveler). One who is a resident can't be called a traveler, and technically, one who is not practicing Islam can't be called a Muslim. Anyway, this was a very brief introduction of the things I am going to write now. It was necessary to give a small background so that people could understand the context.
Now, I am mentioning the actual requirements for a practicing Muslim man (which are defined by the Quran and the authentic statements of Prophet Mohammad) which might conflict with the corporate culture.
(Not in any chronological order)
1. Offering namaz (prayers) - it requires a clean place and at least 15 minutes, twice/thrice during office hours (depending on the time one stays in the office. If he stays late till 6 or 7, it would be thrice a day). A practicing Muslim can't miss a single time namaz even if he's in a very important meeting with the CEO of the company.
2. Going for prayers to a mosque on Friday (if the mosque is in close vicinity of the office) - it would require not less than 45 minutes to 1 hour, and the time would be Friday afternoon. Again, a practicing Muslim can't miss Friday namaz even if he's in a very important meeting with the CEO of the company.
3. Fasting for 30 days in the month of Ramadan - here the Muslim can't even drink a drop of water, not fruits, not potatoes, not even a morsel of any food from dawn to dusk.
4. Not shaking hands with females - as strange or rude as it may read, but a practicing Muslim is prohibited from shaking hands with unrelated females.
5. A Muslim can never lie or cheat with anyone (i.e., a Muslim can't lie or cheat with other employees on behalf of his boss).
6. A Muslim can't forge HR annual statements or do any manipulation in HR audit on behalf of his boss.
7. A Muslim can't show any favoritism or nepotism on behalf of his boss.
8. A Muslim must ensure equity and justice at all times and with all people.
9. A Muslim can't pay or accept bribes.
10. A Muslim can't be a part of any party involving alcohol, drugs, music, and mixed dancing. A Muslim can't even arrange such parties.
11. A Muslim can't attend or be a part of the following parties/celebrations - birthdays, New Year, religious festivals, etc. A Muslim can't even arrange such parties.
12. A Muslim must get a day off on two Eids, Eid-ul-Fitr and Eid-ul-Adha.
I only want to ask, what would be the tolerance level for such an employee as mentioned above.
I agree with Mr. Nashbramhall and others. You can manage with many of the privileges but not all. This applies to Hindus living in Australia. You may have to sacrifice some to manage a better life with others. Sharing/caring with others is more important for any religion.
Regards,
Leo Lingham
From India, Mumbai
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I request maximum response to my queries as it would directly influence my career choice. To begin with, for those who aren't aware (both Muslims and non-Muslims), there's a difference between a Muslim by name and a Muslim by faith. If not all, but most of the Muslims today are only Muslims because their fathers (parents) were Muslims, and it's only a matter of racial creed rather than having faith in the religion of Islam. Hence, most of the Muslims you see around in corporations are only people of different 'cultural' upbringing rather than people of different faith and ideologies.
In Arabic lexicon, a Muslim can only be a person who practices Islam. It is formulated by the Arabic prefix 'mu' with Islam = Muslim. Same as mu + safar = musafir (traveler). One who is a resident can't be called a traveler, and technically, one who is not practicing Islam can't be called a Muslim. Anyway, this was a very brief introduction of the things I am going to write now. It was necessary to give a small background so that people could understand the context.
Now, I am mentioning the actual requirements for a practicing Muslim man (which are defined by the Quran and the authentic statements of Prophet Mohammad) which might conflict with the corporate culture.
(Not in any chronological order)
1. Offering namaz (prayers) - it requires a clean place and at least 15 minutes, twice/thrice during office hours (depending on the time one stays in the office. If he stays late till 6 or 7, it would be thrice a day). A practicing Muslim can't miss a single time namaz even if he's in a very important meeting with the CEO of the company.
2. Going for prayers to a mosque on Friday (if the mosque is in close vicinity of the office) - it would require not less than 45 minutes to 1 hour, and the time would be Friday afternoon. Again, a practicing Muslim can't miss Friday namaz even if he's in a very important meeting with the CEO of the company.
3. Fasting for 30 days in the month of Ramadan - here the Muslim can't even drink a drop of water, not fruits, not potatoes, not even a morsel of any food from dawn to dusk.
4. Not shaking hands with females - as strange or rude as it may read, but a practicing Muslim is prohibited from shaking hands with unrelated females.
5. A Muslim can never lie or cheat with anyone (i.e., a Muslim can't lie or cheat with other employees on behalf of his boss).
6. A Muslim can't forge HR annual statements or do any manipulation in HR audit on behalf of his boss.
7. A Muslim can't show any favoritism or nepotism on behalf of his boss.
8. A Muslim must ensure equity and justice at all times and with all people.
9. A Muslim can't pay or accept bribes.
10. A Muslim can't be a part of any party involving alcohol, drugs, music, and mixed dancing. A Muslim can't even arrange such parties.
11. A Muslim can't attend or be a part of the following parties/celebrations - birthdays, New Year, religious festivals, etc. A Muslim can't even arrange such parties.
12. A Muslim must get a day off on two Eids, Eid-ul-Fitr and Eid-ul-Adha.
I only want to ask, what would be the tolerance level for such an employee as mentioned above.
I agree with Mr. Nashbramhall and others. You can manage with many of the privileges but not all. This applies to Hindus living in Australia. You may have to sacrifice some to manage a better life with others. Sharing/caring with others is more important for any religion.
Regards,
Leo Lingham
From India, Mumbai
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