It is really good, specially the part which you have mentioned that at middle age people want to do the profession which they like..... Thanks. Rahul Jha
From India, Mumbai
From India, Mumbai
Sanjna- I read the book “Power of subconscious mind long time ago”. I don’t discuss things like subconscious mind, dreams, latent oneness deeply because it becomes a hypothetical discussion as one cannot attribute how much of the output is because of that.
Even soul should be just viewed as “deep contentment” here. The whole point of the discussion is that if there is such a thing which frustrates people later in life(I have read about so many Americans who are miserable despite money-look at the kind of books people have written on the opening page of my blog- http://mypyp.wordpress.com/ ), it is better to know early and take corrective steps.
Thanks amirarm and gogetter
Latikapg- It is a great tragedy that “People who are in power have no time to read but people who do not read have no business to be in power” according to a philosophy. The biggest advantage of reading is that you don’t go by only one experience.
What Osho had said is more for people with an artistic bent of mind. Even the chairman of ICICI, Mr Kamath had said once that if you want artistic contentment in the business world, you must innovate continuously. You seem to be a very versatile person but everyone is not like that. To many people, deep involvement comes only from genuine innate passion and there are many consultants talking like that though there maybe many like you who can force passion from commitment or maybe you have not come across something that does not interest you at all. Doing that for a lifetime can be tough. Mr Bachchan had mentioned in one interview that he found the corporate world very "muindane"..
Even in the stockmarket , every good trader does not become a good investor and vice-versa and the profiles of day, swing and position traders are completely different and people burn their fingers when they try something different. There are other examples to show what even the sub vocation has to be right- every good test cricketer does not become a good one day player and vice versa.. Versatile people are different.
Osho was considered more of a spiritual person but if so many management consultants have started expressing satisfaction in terms of “soul” , there is probably something to it. Should that be probed? What is the Indian scene on that?
Thanks jagdishashah, rahuljha402, madhurashinde
From India, New Delhi
8Even soul should be just viewed as “deep contentment” here. The whole point of the discussion is that if there is such a thing which frustrates people later in life(I have read about so many Americans who are miserable despite money-look at the kind of books people have written on the opening page of my blog- http://mypyp.wordpress.com/ ), it is better to know early and take corrective steps.
Thanks amirarm and gogetter
Latikapg- It is a great tragedy that “People who are in power have no time to read but people who do not read have no business to be in power” according to a philosophy. The biggest advantage of reading is that you don’t go by only one experience.
What Osho had said is more for people with an artistic bent of mind. Even the chairman of ICICI, Mr Kamath had said once that if you want artistic contentment in the business world, you must innovate continuously. You seem to be a very versatile person but everyone is not like that. To many people, deep involvement comes only from genuine innate passion and there are many consultants talking like that though there maybe many like you who can force passion from commitment or maybe you have not come across something that does not interest you at all. Doing that for a lifetime can be tough. Mr Bachchan had mentioned in one interview that he found the corporate world very "muindane"..
Even in the stockmarket , every good trader does not become a good investor and vice-versa and the profiles of day, swing and position traders are completely different and people burn their fingers when they try something different. There are other examples to show what even the sub vocation has to be right- every good test cricketer does not become a good one day player and vice versa.. Versatile people are different.
Osho was considered more of a spiritual person but if so many management consultants have started expressing satisfaction in terms of “soul” , there is probably something to it. Should that be probed? What is the Indian scene on that?
Thanks jagdishashah, rahuljha402, madhurashinde
From India, New Delhi
Hi All
Very true, many a lady to become a homemaker sacrifices her career. She would compromise & take refuge in the satisfaction of being a mother. One may not always find the job which gives immense satisfaction, but one has to compromise & find happiness & satisfaction in the job. Once the basic needs are met(like in MASLOW's Theory) can one think of satisfying ones dreams, listening to the soul.... needs maynot be just the "roti, kapda aur makaan", it could ailing parents who have to be taken care of, a successful & ambitious spouse, children's education.... could be even the suitability of the climate of a particular place...
Each one's priorities may not help him/her to fulfill ones inner passions entirely. But man usually would seek happiness & find ways to satisfy oneself, atleast partially.
A "job fit" to a large extent may not be possible, atleast not 100%. A person may not be passionate about the job, but may have the aptitude & attitude to perform and he would be successful. Perhaps he maynot have other choices, except to choose the job offered. Its his needs, personality and the environment which will ensure that he fits into the job.
Rgds
TT
Very true, many a lady to become a homemaker sacrifices her career. She would compromise & take refuge in the satisfaction of being a mother. One may not always find the job which gives immense satisfaction, but one has to compromise & find happiness & satisfaction in the job. Once the basic needs are met(like in MASLOW's Theory) can one think of satisfying ones dreams, listening to the soul.... needs maynot be just the "roti, kapda aur makaan", it could ailing parents who have to be taken care of, a successful & ambitious spouse, children's education.... could be even the suitability of the climate of a particular place...
Each one's priorities may not help him/her to fulfill ones inner passions entirely. But man usually would seek happiness & find ways to satisfy oneself, atleast partially.
A "job fit" to a large extent may not be possible, atleast not 100%. A person may not be passionate about the job, but may have the aptitude & attitude to perform and he would be successful. Perhaps he maynot have other choices, except to choose the job offered. Its his needs, personality and the environment which will ensure that he fits into the job.
Rgds
TT
bobby_tersy has given very practical and interesting insights.
100% jot fit is not possible indeed and one has to strive for excellence not perfection like in other management disciplines. Artists are the worst sufferers in my view and environment and personality cannot always compensate. From the point of view of "Success is getting what you have got but happiness is wanting what you have got" also , you have written well but does one have the stamina to do that(unfulfilling work)for a lifetime?( American gentleman in one of my posts above suffered a bankruptcy and divorce to change his profession. He was so fed up)
Maslow's hierarchy is more of a perception- food, clothing, shelter, social affiliation, self-actualization which is true in a certain context. I had written my first article "Don't settle for less than a calling"(a title choen by the editor) in November'2001. In 2002, I bumped into a book called "Karma, Destiny and Career" by Nanette Hucknall some of the contents of which are:-
," To know the self is to know your own spirit. The work one selects is most important as it always helps the soul to go to another level of maturity. It is necessary to look into your inner self to discover your true life work. Emotional blocks may exist with roots in this life or past life or both. These blocks can prevent people from discovering their true your vocation. For the growth of each soul, it is important to experience all the areas of knowledge with a sense of achievement. Our souls must feel that we have done the best work possible whether as mail clerks or Senators.
"No matter how important or well paying your job is, if it is not your life's work, you will always find something wrong with it. The experience of wholeness or inner peace comes only when one is fulfilling one's full potential"
Though she has devoted chapters in the end about how the family and friends have to suffer when the concerned person has to go "back to school", I thought that all this was too far-fetched.After that, I have come across so many consultants and so many Amrericans writing books on the subject that one wonders whether or not this too is a basic need?People are miserable despite monetary and achievements and doing crazy sswitch overs.
#130355
People keep looking for "meaningful work" despite being well established. Perhaps this too is a basic need and Maslow needs a review or maybe Indians will start behaving like Americans after we are developed enough and can think beyond "Roti, Kapda aur Makaan". Somebody told me that just as one climbs the different floors of a buliding and a different view of the ground is seen from each floor,human needs and wants change as we go through life snd situations. Since HRD is about people that is what it should stand for -HAPPINESS REPEATEDLY DEFINED. As a majority of waking hours are spent at work, this is critical anyway.
From India, New Delhi
100% jot fit is not possible indeed and one has to strive for excellence not perfection like in other management disciplines. Artists are the worst sufferers in my view and environment and personality cannot always compensate. From the point of view of "Success is getting what you have got but happiness is wanting what you have got" also , you have written well but does one have the stamina to do that(unfulfilling work)for a lifetime?( American gentleman in one of my posts above suffered a bankruptcy and divorce to change his profession. He was so fed up)
Maslow's hierarchy is more of a perception- food, clothing, shelter, social affiliation, self-actualization which is true in a certain context. I had written my first article "Don't settle for less than a calling"(a title choen by the editor) in November'2001. In 2002, I bumped into a book called "Karma, Destiny and Career" by Nanette Hucknall some of the contents of which are:-
," To know the self is to know your own spirit. The work one selects is most important as it always helps the soul to go to another level of maturity. It is necessary to look into your inner self to discover your true life work. Emotional blocks may exist with roots in this life or past life or both. These blocks can prevent people from discovering their true your vocation. For the growth of each soul, it is important to experience all the areas of knowledge with a sense of achievement. Our souls must feel that we have done the best work possible whether as mail clerks or Senators.
"No matter how important or well paying your job is, if it is not your life's work, you will always find something wrong with it. The experience of wholeness or inner peace comes only when one is fulfilling one's full potential"
Though she has devoted chapters in the end about how the family and friends have to suffer when the concerned person has to go "back to school", I thought that all this was too far-fetched.After that, I have come across so many consultants and so many Amrericans writing books on the subject that one wonders whether or not this too is a basic need?People are miserable despite monetary and achievements and doing crazy sswitch overs.
#130355
People keep looking for "meaningful work" despite being well established. Perhaps this too is a basic need and Maslow needs a review or maybe Indians will start behaving like Americans after we are developed enough and can think beyond "Roti, Kapda aur Makaan". Somebody told me that just as one climbs the different floors of a buliding and a different view of the ground is seen from each floor,human needs and wants change as we go through life snd situations. Since HRD is about people that is what it should stand for -HAPPINESS REPEATEDLY DEFINED. As a majority of waking hours are spent at work, this is critical anyway.
From India, New Delhi
Hi Hiren,
i used to browse this site regularly but since sometime back was not doing that.. so this time when i opened this site and went thru ur viewpoints on the topic... which is better- experience or qualification?
then i couldn't stop myself from going thru other posts of urs.. really good posts. Thanks for the knowledge u r sharing in this forum.
Regards
smita
From India, Hyderabad
i used to browse this site regularly but since sometime back was not doing that.. so this time when i opened this site and went thru ur viewpoints on the topic... which is better- experience or qualification?
then i couldn't stop myself from going thru other posts of urs.. really good posts. Thanks for the knowledge u r sharing in this forum.
Regards
smita
From India, Hyderabad
Thanks, Smita. I am not an HR person but since everybody has to manage people, all this is from observation and personal experience.
Since this example is likely to be published in an HR magazine(June Issue) and matches the profile of this post, we will take the real life examples of one of the finest actors of Hindi Cinema, Mr Balraj Sahni. To those who may not know, he is remembered for his memorable all time great portrayal of the Rikshawallah in Bimal Roy’s classic “Do Bhiga Zameen”
Though a writer and a poet by natural disposition, Balraj Sahni who was a businessman’s son was a career dabbler all his life - his father’s business, a printing press, Sevagram with Gandhiji , Shantiniketan with Rabindranath Tagore, London as a Radio Broadcaster, Actor in the Indian film Industry and when still unfulfilled, he went to his native Punjab to write in Punjabi.
This is one of the best descriptions of a man in the wrong occupation:-
In his book “My Brother, Balraj”, Bhisham Sahni while stating that his brother, the great actor,. Balraj Sahni had a literary bent of mind , describes his dissatisfaction in their father’s commission agent business vividly:-
“He was not content with the mode of life he had adopted and his impatience with it was increasing, with each passing day. That also explains the varied shifts that took place in his interests during the next few months. Dissatisfied with the vocation he had adopted, he was now groping for a better outlet for his talents and energies”.
Balraj Sahni used to participate in English plays and writing activities. This paragraph describes his plight even more vividly:-
“All these varied activities, more or less at the same time, only reflected Balraj’s inner restlessness and his increasing dissatisfaction. Such cultural ventures were perhaps a desperate attempt on the part of Balraj to convince himself that even while he was pursuing a business career, that he could somehow reconcile business with his inner urges. He had stuck on to business for nearly three years, out of deference for Father’s wishes, but his heart was not in it, and his dissatisfaction had begun to increase”
“Business had become indolent to him. He felt that he had drifted too long in a way of life which was indolent and wasteful and that he must plunge into some sort of activity and make way for himself”
On his stint in Journalism:-
“The paper had involved a great deal of strain, both physical and financial.. Moreover, Balraj had soon learnt that this was not the kind of activity for which he was meant. . The experience had left him sad but a great deal wiser”
After Sevagram with Gandhiji
“I am not cut out for political work. I shall do only cultural work. I want to be a writer”
Some of his life reminds you of what Dale Carnegie said more than 50 years ago “Do not feel compelled to join a trade or business because your family wants you to do it”
The writer of films like “Khosla ka Ghosla” and “Company”, Jaideep Sahni described wrong occupation as “Lifetime imprisonment” in an India Today issue. Somebody told me that the writer of “Rang De Basanti” , Prasun Joshi was an MBA who had shifted to films.
President Abdul kalam has experience of heading Space, Atomic Energy and Defence organizations. The people’s President must have worked with thousands of people and knows what he is talking about when he says in his autobiography “Wings of Fire”:-
“If you are a writer who would secretly prefer to be a lawyer or a doctor, your written words will feed but half the hunger of your readers; if you are a teacher who would rather be a businessman, your instructions will meet but half the need for knowledge of your students; if you are a scientist who hates science, your performance will satisfy but half the needs of your mission.” The personal happiness and failure to achieve results that come from being a square peg in a round hole is not by any means new. In another part of the book, he states, “I myself would tell naiveteé engineering students that when they choose their specialization, the essential point to consider is whether the choice articulates their innermost feelings and aspirations.”
Harvard University faculty have defined such aspirations as deeply embedded life interests. I have seen some very good power point presentations of competency mapping. Anybody on soul mapping?
From India, New Delhi
Since this example is likely to be published in an HR magazine(June Issue) and matches the profile of this post, we will take the real life examples of one of the finest actors of Hindi Cinema, Mr Balraj Sahni. To those who may not know, he is remembered for his memorable all time great portrayal of the Rikshawallah in Bimal Roy’s classic “Do Bhiga Zameen”
Though a writer and a poet by natural disposition, Balraj Sahni who was a businessman’s son was a career dabbler all his life - his father’s business, a printing press, Sevagram with Gandhiji , Shantiniketan with Rabindranath Tagore, London as a Radio Broadcaster, Actor in the Indian film Industry and when still unfulfilled, he went to his native Punjab to write in Punjabi.
This is one of the best descriptions of a man in the wrong occupation:-
In his book “My Brother, Balraj”, Bhisham Sahni while stating that his brother, the great actor,. Balraj Sahni had a literary bent of mind , describes his dissatisfaction in their father’s commission agent business vividly:-
“He was not content with the mode of life he had adopted and his impatience with it was increasing, with each passing day. That also explains the varied shifts that took place in his interests during the next few months. Dissatisfied with the vocation he had adopted, he was now groping for a better outlet for his talents and energies”.
Balraj Sahni used to participate in English plays and writing activities. This paragraph describes his plight even more vividly:-
“All these varied activities, more or less at the same time, only reflected Balraj’s inner restlessness and his increasing dissatisfaction. Such cultural ventures were perhaps a desperate attempt on the part of Balraj to convince himself that even while he was pursuing a business career, that he could somehow reconcile business with his inner urges. He had stuck on to business for nearly three years, out of deference for Father’s wishes, but his heart was not in it, and his dissatisfaction had begun to increase”
“Business had become indolent to him. He felt that he had drifted too long in a way of life which was indolent and wasteful and that he must plunge into some sort of activity and make way for himself”
On his stint in Journalism:-
“The paper had involved a great deal of strain, both physical and financial.. Moreover, Balraj had soon learnt that this was not the kind of activity for which he was meant. . The experience had left him sad but a great deal wiser”
After Sevagram with Gandhiji
“I am not cut out for political work. I shall do only cultural work. I want to be a writer”
Some of his life reminds you of what Dale Carnegie said more than 50 years ago “Do not feel compelled to join a trade or business because your family wants you to do it”
The writer of films like “Khosla ka Ghosla” and “Company”, Jaideep Sahni described wrong occupation as “Lifetime imprisonment” in an India Today issue. Somebody told me that the writer of “Rang De Basanti” , Prasun Joshi was an MBA who had shifted to films.
President Abdul kalam has experience of heading Space, Atomic Energy and Defence organizations. The people’s President must have worked with thousands of people and knows what he is talking about when he says in his autobiography “Wings of Fire”:-
“If you are a writer who would secretly prefer to be a lawyer or a doctor, your written words will feed but half the hunger of your readers; if you are a teacher who would rather be a businessman, your instructions will meet but half the need for knowledge of your students; if you are a scientist who hates science, your performance will satisfy but half the needs of your mission.” The personal happiness and failure to achieve results that come from being a square peg in a round hole is not by any means new. In another part of the book, he states, “I myself would tell naiveteé engineering students that when they choose their specialization, the essential point to consider is whether the choice articulates their innermost feelings and aspirations.”
Harvard University faculty have defined such aspirations as deeply embedded life interests. I have seen some very good power point presentations of competency mapping. Anybody on soul mapping?
From India, New Delhi
hi hiren it is very fantastic to see your view and your observation . It is true that satisfaction is must in everybody’s life but still it is a dream. regards kaninwal
Hiren:
I did a little soul-searching after reading your varied views on human attitude and behavior towards the aspirations from life. I think I will feel the same way as others, such as Balraj Sahani once thought even after touching the pinnacles of success in life, that he was not probably meant to be that. But, presently I am not thinking in that direction so long I am contended with my accomplishments (excuse me if it is becoming too much of self-praising, I don't intend to do that, though) :oops: . What I mean to say is that 80% of people don't get what they desire, but they should know that the world doesn't end there. They will be happy if they want to be happy, and they will be sad if they don't know how to remain happy. It's all about contentment. If you are giving your 100%, you will get what you are looking for -sooner or later. And you will get enough even if you did not aspire for it.
-PG
From India
I did a little soul-searching after reading your varied views on human attitude and behavior towards the aspirations from life. I think I will feel the same way as others, such as Balraj Sahani once thought even after touching the pinnacles of success in life, that he was not probably meant to be that. But, presently I am not thinking in that direction so long I am contended with my accomplishments (excuse me if it is becoming too much of self-praising, I don't intend to do that, though) :oops: . What I mean to say is that 80% of people don't get what they desire, but they should know that the world doesn't end there. They will be happy if they want to be happy, and they will be sad if they don't know how to remain happy. It's all about contentment. If you are giving your 100%, you will get what you are looking for -sooner or later. And you will get enough even if you did not aspire for it.
-PG
From India
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