Dear Manish,
I refer to the discussion above and I must say that I completely agree with Dinesh. The discussion has shifted to the effectiveness of OBT because more than deciding or deliberating on the efficacy of an OBT facilitator, one should first consider the efficacy of the OBT itself.
According to my past experience, typical OBTs get participants to perform dare devil stunts and derive assumptions of their personality based on performance. I have come across sessions where participants are asked to engage in rock climbing or water rafting and when certain people refuse, analysis drawn is that they may not be good team players, unwilling to take risks, etc.
I feel that the intense experience you speak of can definitely be generated in a classroom as well, speaking of the same concepts, with the use of Psychometric instruments. The insight these instruments give you is immense and they can be used to explain concepts like leadership and team building in a classroom setting or an OBT, which would help the facilitator be more accurate with his/her analysis and for the participants it would be a wonderful learning experience of certain facets of their personality that they might not be aware of. Without the use of these assessments, OBTs are usually reduced to fun and frolic and the learning forgotten within a few days.
Regards,
Shahnaz
From India, Mumbai
1I refer to the discussion above and I must say that I completely agree with Dinesh. The discussion has shifted to the effectiveness of OBT because more than deciding or deliberating on the efficacy of an OBT facilitator, one should first consider the efficacy of the OBT itself.
According to my past experience, typical OBTs get participants to perform dare devil stunts and derive assumptions of their personality based on performance. I have come across sessions where participants are asked to engage in rock climbing or water rafting and when certain people refuse, analysis drawn is that they may not be good team players, unwilling to take risks, etc.
I feel that the intense experience you speak of can definitely be generated in a classroom as well, speaking of the same concepts, with the use of Psychometric instruments. The insight these instruments give you is immense and they can be used to explain concepts like leadership and team building in a classroom setting or an OBT, which would help the facilitator be more accurate with his/her analysis and for the participants it would be a wonderful learning experience of certain facets of their personality that they might not be aware of. Without the use of these assessments, OBTs are usually reduced to fun and frolic and the learning forgotten within a few days.
Regards,
Shahnaz
From India, Mumbai
Dear Shahnaz,
I like your idea of using Psychometric instruments while training!(Dinesh, your views please on this.)
Could you please tell me which Psychometric instruments are useful for various training needs?
Thanks
Manish
From India, Nagpur
I like your idea of using Psychometric instruments while training!(Dinesh, your views please on this.)
Could you please tell me which Psychometric instruments are useful for various training needs?
Thanks
Manish
From India, Nagpur
Dear Manish,
There are lots of such instruments in the market. There is the DISC, and then there are a battery of instruments by the assessment world.
You can look these up on the internet. They are based on the work of noted Psychologists like Carl Jung, Dr. William Marston, etc. I have recently undergone a certification program for these assessments. You can visit these website links for further information on these assessments:
The Assessment World <link updated to site home> ( Search On Cite | Search On Google )
About Us <link updated to site home>
Regards,
Shahnaz
From India, Mumbai
There are lots of such instruments in the market. There is the DISC, and then there are a battery of instruments by the assessment world.
You can look these up on the internet. They are based on the work of noted Psychologists like Carl Jung, Dr. William Marston, etc. I have recently undergone a certification program for these assessments. You can visit these website links for further information on these assessments:
The Assessment World <link updated to site home> ( Search On Cite | Search On Google )
About Us <link updated to site home>
Regards,
Shahnaz
From India, Mumbai
Dear Manish,
You have rock solid beliefs on the means and not ends. May I remind you that means are not ends? Outbound training, psychometric tests are all the means and not the ends. A golden or silver ladder does not take you to a greater height. In your case you are dismissing in-house training as iron or wooden ladder and hence doubting on its capability.
Please clarify first what end results you expect and then search for the means. This end result should be measurable.
If you look at Indian economy, India languished till 1991 because of concentration on socialism. Our the then learned rulers never understood that socialism was means and not end. Social upliftment or emancipation of masses are the ends and these are measurable too. Socialism was never measurable.
The erstwhile Soviet block collapsed because their concentration was on practising communism and not competition with EU or American countries.
Ok...
DVD
From India, Bangalore
You have rock solid beliefs on the means and not ends. May I remind you that means are not ends? Outbound training, psychometric tests are all the means and not the ends. A golden or silver ladder does not take you to a greater height. In your case you are dismissing in-house training as iron or wooden ladder and hence doubting on its capability.
Please clarify first what end results you expect and then search for the means. This end result should be measurable.
If you look at Indian economy, India languished till 1991 because of concentration on socialism. Our the then learned rulers never understood that socialism was means and not end. Social upliftment or emancipation of masses are the ends and these are measurable too. Socialism was never measurable.
The erstwhile Soviet block collapsed because their concentration was on practising communism and not competition with EU or American countries.
Ok...
DVD
From India, Bangalore
dEAR mANISH,
AFTER seeing some of the responses to your queries, I wish to caution you regarding too much fun or games in training programs. It is just like watching a serial in TV, where the story will be of 10 minutes duration, but ads will occupy 20 minutes giving a false impression that the serial is of 30 minutes duration! This is where the modern training programs and trainers are moving. They make the training fun filled, , humorous, time-passing, but ultimately the participants ask, "what is that I am taking home or to my organisation at the end of the training?", in most cases the answer will be "very little". No doubt the training programs should be full of fun, filled with meaningful and useful activities, but in majority of the cases the projection of the program will be very attractive, bewitching but content will be almost zero. So one has to carefully evaluate before making a decision in this regard.
M.J. SUBRAMANYAM, BANGALORE
From India, Bangalore
AFTER seeing some of the responses to your queries, I wish to caution you regarding too much fun or games in training programs. It is just like watching a serial in TV, where the story will be of 10 minutes duration, but ads will occupy 20 minutes giving a false impression that the serial is of 30 minutes duration! This is where the modern training programs and trainers are moving. They make the training fun filled, , humorous, time-passing, but ultimately the participants ask, "what is that I am taking home or to my organisation at the end of the training?", in most cases the answer will be "very little". No doubt the training programs should be full of fun, filled with meaningful and useful activities, but in majority of the cases the projection of the program will be very attractive, bewitching but content will be almost zero. So one has to carefully evaluate before making a decision in this regard.
M.J. SUBRAMANYAM, BANGALORE
From India, Bangalore
Dear Mr. Manish Sawankar
I had gone through your query and excellent views/suggestions/comments posted by distinguished members of this community. I second to Mr. Dinesh and other members posting relevant information.
We want to measure everything but it was just limited to PAPER or QUESTIONNAIRE based on models or self designed as per requirements. Its just like a NUMBER GAME. Many ORGANISATIONS are trying their best in CAPTURING LIVE/PHYSICAL CHANGES(FUNCTIONAL/NON-FUNCTIONAL and PROPORTIONAL TO TRAINING OBJECTIVES) NOTED IN EMPLOYEE(S) THAT HAD SUPPORTED SELF GROWTH FACTORS AND ALSO ALIGNED WITH ORGANISATIONAL GOALS, RESULTING IN ACHIEVING DESIRED PRODUCTIVITY/OUTPUT.
The surprising factor is that, You will also find employees(superiors) those who had been assigned an responsibility to evaluate their subordinates/team members POST TRAINING EFFECTIVENESS, they themselves are unaware "what has to be measured?" Why don't you treat SUPERIORS or EVALUATORS as FACILITATOR?
I am IN-HOUSE TRAINER and i haven't created POST TRAINING EVALUATION FROM - MEASURING EMPLOYEE EFFECTIVENESS ON JOB. I am more interested in AGENDA OF THE TRAINING MODULE & its OBJECTIVES on which EMPLOYEES NEED TO BE TRAINED or THEIR KNOWLEDGE BASE TO BE ENHANCED, OVER PERIOD OF TIME AND HOW TO CORRELATE WITH EMPLOYEE OR ORGANISATION'S GOALS.
Post Training, i am only interested to receive specific/precise feedback from EMPLOYEES in their own language, stating their HONEST VIEWS proportionate to the TRAINING OBJECTIVES aligning with a) ENHANCEMENT IN EMPLOYEE SKILLS/KNOWLEDGE BASE and b) ORGANISATION GOALS. OUTCOME should benefit both. My total concentration is on EMPLOYEE and everyday i motivate them to think about CONTINUOUS SELF DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.
I would suggest you to create your own TEST rather depending upon any modules available ONLINE. You can study those module and understand the process rather just replicating it. The more you spend time in preparing SELF ASSESSMENT TOOLS the more you will succeed in understanding HUMAN PSYCHOLOGY/MENTALITY/ATTITUDE/BEHAVIOR/LEARNING STYLES and kindly avoid pushing things TOO HARD.
At times, psychometric test had presented wrong results because whatever submitted by employee is not found proportionate to his/her ACTUAL LIVING STYLE either at WORKPLACE or in PERSONAL LIFE. I would love to say that MOST OF THE EMPLOYEES ARE VERY SMART.
With profound regards
From India, Chennai
I had gone through your query and excellent views/suggestions/comments posted by distinguished members of this community. I second to Mr. Dinesh and other members posting relevant information.
We want to measure everything but it was just limited to PAPER or QUESTIONNAIRE based on models or self designed as per requirements. Its just like a NUMBER GAME. Many ORGANISATIONS are trying their best in CAPTURING LIVE/PHYSICAL CHANGES(FUNCTIONAL/NON-FUNCTIONAL and PROPORTIONAL TO TRAINING OBJECTIVES) NOTED IN EMPLOYEE(S) THAT HAD SUPPORTED SELF GROWTH FACTORS AND ALSO ALIGNED WITH ORGANISATIONAL GOALS, RESULTING IN ACHIEVING DESIRED PRODUCTIVITY/OUTPUT.
The surprising factor is that, You will also find employees(superiors) those who had been assigned an responsibility to evaluate their subordinates/team members POST TRAINING EFFECTIVENESS, they themselves are unaware "what has to be measured?" Why don't you treat SUPERIORS or EVALUATORS as FACILITATOR?
I am IN-HOUSE TRAINER and i haven't created POST TRAINING EVALUATION FROM - MEASURING EMPLOYEE EFFECTIVENESS ON JOB. I am more interested in AGENDA OF THE TRAINING MODULE & its OBJECTIVES on which EMPLOYEES NEED TO BE TRAINED or THEIR KNOWLEDGE BASE TO BE ENHANCED, OVER PERIOD OF TIME AND HOW TO CORRELATE WITH EMPLOYEE OR ORGANISATION'S GOALS.
Post Training, i am only interested to receive specific/precise feedback from EMPLOYEES in their own language, stating their HONEST VIEWS proportionate to the TRAINING OBJECTIVES aligning with a) ENHANCEMENT IN EMPLOYEE SKILLS/KNOWLEDGE BASE and b) ORGANISATION GOALS. OUTCOME should benefit both. My total concentration is on EMPLOYEE and everyday i motivate them to think about CONTINUOUS SELF DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.
I would suggest you to create your own TEST rather depending upon any modules available ONLINE. You can study those module and understand the process rather just replicating it. The more you spend time in preparing SELF ASSESSMENT TOOLS the more you will succeed in understanding HUMAN PSYCHOLOGY/MENTALITY/ATTITUDE/BEHAVIOR/LEARNING STYLES and kindly avoid pushing things TOO HARD.
At times, psychometric test had presented wrong results because whatever submitted by employee is not found proportionate to his/her ACTUAL LIVING STYLE either at WORKPLACE or in PERSONAL LIFE. I would love to say that MOST OF THE EMPLOYEES ARE VERY SMART.
With profound regards
From India, Chennai
Dear Dinesh,
Thanks for your wonderful example! I am really looking at you as my mentor!!
I am not only looking for the means. I just wanted to get clarified the effectiveness of OBT and its facilitator. I am no way opponent of in-house training program. Also I do not favour any particular HR intervention. As an HR business partner, I look for the business results by proper HR interventions.
I thank you and look forward for your continued guidance.
Manish
From India, Nagpur
Thanks for your wonderful example! I am really looking at you as my mentor!!
I am not only looking for the means. I just wanted to get clarified the effectiveness of OBT and its facilitator. I am no way opponent of in-house training program. Also I do not favour any particular HR intervention. As an HR business partner, I look for the business results by proper HR interventions.
I thank you and look forward for your continued guidance.
Manish
From India, Nagpur
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