Please call the employee and give him counciling and try to undersand why he is doing so & wat is his problem,termination is not a soluation. Vijay
From India, Madras
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From India, Madras
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Hi Radhika,
Absence without prior permission is not correct from the standpoint of organizational discipline. You may call him to inquire about his problem, offer support, and convey that HR is actively looking after employees. Make sincere efforts to resolve his issue. Enlighten him about the impact on his career and the consequences of being absent from duties without permission or notification.
If the situation persists, consider visiting his home to discuss their problems. I hope that he will surely show improvement.
Thanks and Regards,
Ranjeet Bhosale
From India, Thiruvananthapuram
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1Absence without prior permission is not correct from the standpoint of organizational discipline. You may call him to inquire about his problem, offer support, and convey that HR is actively looking after employees. Make sincere efforts to resolve his issue. Enlighten him about the impact on his career and the consequences of being absent from duties without permission or notification.
If the situation persists, consider visiting his home to discuss their problems. I hope that he will surely show improvement.
Thanks and Regards,
Ranjeet Bhosale
From India, Thiruvananthapuram
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The way I see this, I don't find any problem at all. Just increase his target by 10 or 20 percent. That's it. You get more done, plus he gets an incentive and reduces his number of days off. We are dealing with humans and therefore must be more concerned about them. There are places where you can make exceptions.
When you talk to him and still he doesn't open up, then it's time for you to sharpen your counseling skills. Try not to put the company's rules and regulations first when you talk to him personally.
From India, Selam
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When you talk to him and still he doesn't open up, then it's time for you to sharpen your counseling skills. Try not to put the company's rules and regulations first when you talk to him personally.
From India, Selam
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Dear Radhika,
Do you want your employees' physical attendance or their work completion? You decide first. In my view, in the present scenario, people are working from home and only visiting the office maybe once a week, so it shouldn't matter. You should assign them the work responsibilities and targets. If they accomplish the assigned work and meet the set targets, then your problem is solved. Why do you need their physical presence in your office? Think about it practically.
Bye,
Good Day
From India, Bangalore
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Do you want your employees' physical attendance or their work completion? You decide first. In my view, in the present scenario, people are working from home and only visiting the office maybe once a week, so it shouldn't matter. You should assign them the work responsibilities and targets. If they accomplish the assigned work and meet the set targets, then your problem is solved. Why do you need their physical presence in your office? Think about it practically.
Bye,
Good Day
From India, Bangalore
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Hi Radhika,
An employee is taking leave for four to five days every month. When can you issue a charge sheet regarding his continuous absences over the last few months and request a reply from him within two to three days?
If he does not respond to the charge sheet, you can assume that he is not improving his habits at the company. Therefore, you can dismiss him with leave without pay. Even if he does not show improvement, you can terminate him because we have all kinds of records related to his termination. This action pertains to industrial/organizational discipline that applies to all management and worker categories.
This is an industrial relations issue.
If you have any queries, please send them to my email address (dushyant_dbr@in.abb.com).
Dushyant
From India
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An employee is taking leave for four to five days every month. When can you issue a charge sheet regarding his continuous absences over the last few months and request a reply from him within two to three days?
If he does not respond to the charge sheet, you can assume that he is not improving his habits at the company. Therefore, you can dismiss him with leave without pay. Even if he does not show improvement, you can terminate him because we have all kinds of records related to his termination. This action pertains to industrial/organizational discipline that applies to all management and worker categories.
This is an industrial relations issue.
If you have any queries, please send them to my email address (dushyant_dbr@in.abb.com).
Dushyant
From India
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Hi Radhika,
As I read through your mail, I feel there can be multiple reasons and solutions to it. I am putting some below; please let me know your views.
1. Please speak with the employee and understand the actual reasons. If he has some justifiable concerns, then management should support him.
2. If he is doing it deliberately out of arrogance of being a good performer, then based on his capabilities, you can redefine his targets. Enhance his targets so that he doesn't get any time to avail leaves. If his performance deteriorates, then you have all the reasons to question him.
Please share your views on this solution.
Regards,
Smarika
From India, Bangalore
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As I read through your mail, I feel there can be multiple reasons and solutions to it. I am putting some below; please let me know your views.
1. Please speak with the employee and understand the actual reasons. If he has some justifiable concerns, then management should support him.
2. If he is doing it deliberately out of arrogance of being a good performer, then based on his capabilities, you can redefine his targets. Enhance his targets so that he doesn't get any time to avail leaves. If his performance deteriorates, then you have all the reasons to question him.
Please share your views on this solution.
Regards,
Smarika
From India, Bangalore
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As Radhika has not responded to questions raised, this thread is now closed. She has received enough advice. Please do not contribute anymore. Have a lovely day. Simhan
From United Kingdom
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From United Kingdom
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Hi Radhika,
Greetings of the day!
I agree with all the above replies from Senior/Experienced HR Professionals. In my view, you should talk to him to find out the root cause of this problem and help him get rid of it. I believe that is the reason the HR department exists for "Staff Welfare." However, if there is no valid reason, and he is behaving this way because he thinks he is a good performer and management will not terminate him, then you should terminate him according to your company policies.
Regards,
Jitendra
From India, Delhi
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Greetings of the day!
I agree with all the above replies from Senior/Experienced HR Professionals. In my view, you should talk to him to find out the root cause of this problem and help him get rid of it. I believe that is the reason the HR department exists for "Staff Welfare." However, if there is no valid reason, and he is behaving this way because he thinks he is a good performer and management will not terminate him, then you should terminate him according to your company policies.
Regards,
Jitendra
From India, Delhi
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Hi All,
Why are all of you thinking about the negative side? How about the flexible working hours? First, identify his grievance, then try to find a solution within him, offer your support, or propose a flexible working schedule.
Thanks & Regards,
Nalin Basnayeka
From Sri Lanka, Colombo
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Why are all of you thinking about the negative side? How about the flexible working hours? First, identify his grievance, then try to find a solution within him, offer your support, or propose a flexible working schedule.
Thanks & Regards,
Nalin Basnayeka
From Sri Lanka, Colombo
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Hi Radhika,
I am involved in Sales Organisation Development somewhere in Pakistan. Such an employee is an asset of the company and has real value. If the asset (employee) is not managed properly, then the value can devalue.
1. In addition to that, how can an employee perform better or best if he skips 2 to 4 days out of 24 or 25 working days? I mean he must miss the objectives and deadlines that need to be achieved on those days (when he is not attending the office).
2. Referring to "The One Minute Manager" (a book by Ken Blanchard), the boss or coach needs to give the one-minute reprimand quickly if possible.
3. During his performance and appraisal review, the employee must be informed that he is lacking or violating the leave policy.
4. He should be informed about his leave balance versus absences; maybe this way, he can inform his supervisor.
Informally, his supervisor should know what type of problem he is facing by interacting with close friends in the office.
Samee
From Pakistan, Karachi
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I am involved in Sales Organisation Development somewhere in Pakistan. Such an employee is an asset of the company and has real value. If the asset (employee) is not managed properly, then the value can devalue.
1. In addition to that, how can an employee perform better or best if he skips 2 to 4 days out of 24 or 25 working days? I mean he must miss the objectives and deadlines that need to be achieved on those days (when he is not attending the office).
2. Referring to "The One Minute Manager" (a book by Ken Blanchard), the boss or coach needs to give the one-minute reprimand quickly if possible.
3. During his performance and appraisal review, the employee must be informed that he is lacking or violating the leave policy.
4. He should be informed about his leave balance versus absences; maybe this way, he can inform his supervisor.
Informally, his supervisor should know what type of problem he is facing by interacting with close friends in the office.
Samee
From Pakistan, Karachi
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Re: Case Study, solve this.
Well, according to me, if he is such a good performer, he is not having any kind of problem in his life; otherwise, it would have affected his performance as well. He is diligently taking the leave without prior intimation to the management. Because he knows that he is in the good books of his immediate seniors due to his performance. There are two solutions:
1) Find out some other potential equivalent to him.
2) Take disciplinary action according to the policy.
Regards,
Prabhjot Singh
From India, Jalandhar
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Well, according to me, if he is such a good performer, he is not having any kind of problem in his life; otherwise, it would have affected his performance as well. He is diligently taking the leave without prior intimation to the management. Because he knows that he is in the good books of his immediate seniors due to his performance. There are two solutions:
1) Find out some other potential equivalent to him.
2) Take disciplinary action according to the policy.
Regards,
Prabhjot Singh
From India, Jalandhar
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Absenteism is a menace in many organisations; it should be handled on a case-by-case basis. You cannot have a universal solution for all employees. An employee with good productivity is absenting himself more frequently, we need to understand his problem. If there is a solution to his problem that is possible to provide by the organisation, it should be done immediately. In most cases, the issue will be resolved, and the employee will be more loyal and productive.
There should be a step ladder procedure starting from counseling to reliability or counseling to termination. You can have the following steps:
1. Oral warning
2. Written warning
3. 2 days suspension
4. 5 days
5. 10 days
6. 15 days
7. 30 days
Each time, warn him and counsel him, and make all efforts to correct him, not to terminate. The termination for the misconduct of absenteeism is often not viewed as a disproportionate punishment.
From India, Madras
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There should be a step ladder procedure starting from counseling to reliability or counseling to termination. You can have the following steps:
1. Oral warning
2. Written warning
3. 2 days suspension
4. 5 days
5. 10 days
6. 15 days
7. 30 days
Each time, warn him and counsel him, and make all efforts to correct him, not to terminate. The termination for the misconduct of absenteeism is often not viewed as a disproportionate punishment.
From India, Madras
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Hi Radhika,
There are some parameters to consider when analyzing individual performance, such as:
- Target achievements (Job performance)
- Attitude
- Discipline
- Troubleshooting abilities, etc.
Everything should be on track for a perfect employee. Performance alone does not and should not speak for itself. Balancing all the parameters is crucial to forming a complete employee/position. The first step should be a personal discussion with motivation, followed by a warning letter, and then a show cause notice. Termination should only follow after considering the employee's response and completing a thorough analysis of the case.
Thanks & Regards,
CRK
crk.mbahr@yahoo.com
From India, Vijayawada
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There are some parameters to consider when analyzing individual performance, such as:
- Target achievements (Job performance)
- Attitude
- Discipline
- Troubleshooting abilities, etc.
Everything should be on track for a perfect employee. Performance alone does not and should not speak for itself. Balancing all the parameters is crucial to forming a complete employee/position. The first step should be a personal discussion with motivation, followed by a warning letter, and then a show cause notice. Termination should only follow after considering the employee's response and completing a thorough analysis of the case.
Thanks & Regards,
CRK
crk.mbahr@yahoo.com
From India, Vijayawada
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My opinion on this would be to provide counseling first. Even after that, if the employee continues with the same behavior, we may need to ask the employee to resign. Having one employee with such an attitude can negatively impact the entire team.
Just one request to all HR professionals on this site: please refrain from using the term "Termination." Instead, consider using "Discharge of services," as it would be a more appropriate term to use.
From India, Chennai
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Just one request to all HR professionals on this site: please refrain from using the term "Termination." Instead, consider using "Discharge of services," as it would be a more appropriate term to use.
From India, Chennai
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Hi Radhika,
I agree with all those who say discipline is of prime importance in an organization. This particular employee needs to be disciplined, and doing so is your job as an HR person.
There are various ways to bring about this change. The first is obviously closed-door meetings with the concerned HR and the Management People. You would probably need to understand that this employee might be under certain stress and hence taking leaves. Or it might be that this employee has already understood that he does his job well and is good at it, hence it won't really matter to the Management if he/she takes a few days off without any notice.
Another solution is to ensure that the employee fills in the required hours as leave period in your Leave and Absence Management system, and thus, the organization ensures that the leaves this person is taking are accounted for with substantial reasons.
Apart from this, a probable training course on Organizational Behaviour and Etiquette, or training on professionalism, can be routed and made a part of his/her KPI. This should help.
Furthermore, you also need to analyze the organization itself. See if there is a laid-back attitude towards this situation simply because the employee is a good performer.
Another solution is to start deductions from his perks and salary, based on the number of days of absence and the related call of the HR person in charge.
This should be enough to make this person see the light of the day.
I would be happy to provide further guidance if required. Please do let me know the same.
Regards,
Mustafa Mazumdar,
Corporate Trainer - Human Efficiencies and Development.
From India
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I agree with all those who say discipline is of prime importance in an organization. This particular employee needs to be disciplined, and doing so is your job as an HR person.
There are various ways to bring about this change. The first is obviously closed-door meetings with the concerned HR and the Management People. You would probably need to understand that this employee might be under certain stress and hence taking leaves. Or it might be that this employee has already understood that he does his job well and is good at it, hence it won't really matter to the Management if he/she takes a few days off without any notice.
Another solution is to ensure that the employee fills in the required hours as leave period in your Leave and Absence Management system, and thus, the organization ensures that the leaves this person is taking are accounted for with substantial reasons.
Apart from this, a probable training course on Organizational Behaviour and Etiquette, or training on professionalism, can be routed and made a part of his/her KPI. This should help.
Furthermore, you also need to analyze the organization itself. See if there is a laid-back attitude towards this situation simply because the employee is a good performer.
Another solution is to start deductions from his perks and salary, based on the number of days of absence and the related call of the HR person in charge.
This should be enough to make this person see the light of the day.
I would be happy to provide further guidance if required. Please do let me know the same.
Regards,
Mustafa Mazumdar,
Corporate Trainer - Human Efficiencies and Development.
From India
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It does not appear to be a big problem.
First of all, let's have a re-look at the targets allocated to him. These targets should not be lower than his peer level and should reflect the market potential and opportunities available to him in his area of work.
Secondly, a senior functionary in your organization (not the Manager HR or his immediate Manager) should talk to him in confidence to find out the reason for his indisciplined behavior. If there are genuine reasons for his actions and if there is any way the organization can support him (for example, in cases of serious illness in his family that require his presence over his work commitments), then assistance can be provided.
Once the above issues are identified, the concerned employee should be positively motivated to understand his responsibilities towards the organization. It is crucial to consider who motivates him within the organization. It is recommended that the motivator should not be his immediate manager, the HR manager, or anyone junior in the hierarchy.
From India, Gurgaon
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First of all, let's have a re-look at the targets allocated to him. These targets should not be lower than his peer level and should reflect the market potential and opportunities available to him in his area of work.
Secondly, a senior functionary in your organization (not the Manager HR or his immediate Manager) should talk to him in confidence to find out the reason for his indisciplined behavior. If there are genuine reasons for his actions and if there is any way the organization can support him (for example, in cases of serious illness in his family that require his presence over his work commitments), then assistance can be provided.
Once the above issues are identified, the concerned employee should be positively motivated to understand his responsibilities towards the organization. It is crucial to consider who motivates him within the organization. It is recommended that the motivator should not be his immediate manager, the HR manager, or anyone junior in the hierarchy.
From India, Gurgaon
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Hi All,
I totally agree with what Madan_hrm had said, and disciplinary actions are necessary to be taken against him/her so that others should not take advantage if we favor an employee for completing targets.
Regards,
Sachin Kadam
From India, Pune
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I totally agree with what Madan_hrm had said, and disciplinary actions are necessary to be taken against him/her so that others should not take advantage if we favor an employee for completing targets.
Regards,
Sachin Kadam
From India, Pune
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Hi,
I am surprised by the speed with which the experts of HR jump the gun in the name of "discipline," even as so many questions remain unanswered in the so-called case study.
1. Is there a pattern in the leaves taken, apart from the fact that these are taken without prior approval?
2. Are there family issues requiring traveling that make this person rush somewhere? Health? Parents? Wife?
3. Is the discipline to be pursued without any reference to performance?
4. If the performance is consistent, then these absences are not hurting the performance.
5. Has the HR discussed the issue, the real reason for taking these leaves?
Between opinions and facts, there is something called the process of verification of core issues involved.
No consistent performer wants to undertake "indiscipline" to dilute his own credentials.
There is a need for proper and detailed investigation, and if HR cannot find out the inside story, then what is HR doing? Behaving like a glorified clerk, checking only the muster?
The concept of performance must guide the definition of what is discipline. The traditional ideas of discipline are undergoing change with technology.
Contribution, productivity, performance, organizational goals, and the pursuit of excellence should be our guide, not just physical attendance as an end in itself.
Today, one does not need a desk to contribute, nor a follower to be a leader.
Contribution and work come through many other avenues than merely physical presence.
Do some homework, don't just report "facts" like a newspaper journalist. Find out the real reason for absence since there is a pattern. Then there must be some personal issue, which requires tact and understanding, not just demands.
Terminating a performer without adequate understanding of the issue does not augur well for any HR professional. There are ways to discipline or deduction to compensate. But first things first. Find all the facts first.
Radhika, first, you show some substance in your capacity to comprehend the issues involved.
Hi,
An employee in a company who is very good in his performance - every month he reaches his targets. But that employee takes 3-5 days of leave every month without any intimation to management. Once the manager gave him a serious warning not to repeat this. Even though he repeated the same.
So, what can we do with that employee?
Awaiting your response.
Radhika.
From India, Pune
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I am surprised by the speed with which the experts of HR jump the gun in the name of "discipline," even as so many questions remain unanswered in the so-called case study.
1. Is there a pattern in the leaves taken, apart from the fact that these are taken without prior approval?
2. Are there family issues requiring traveling that make this person rush somewhere? Health? Parents? Wife?
3. Is the discipline to be pursued without any reference to performance?
4. If the performance is consistent, then these absences are not hurting the performance.
5. Has the HR discussed the issue, the real reason for taking these leaves?
Between opinions and facts, there is something called the process of verification of core issues involved.
No consistent performer wants to undertake "indiscipline" to dilute his own credentials.
There is a need for proper and detailed investigation, and if HR cannot find out the inside story, then what is HR doing? Behaving like a glorified clerk, checking only the muster?
The concept of performance must guide the definition of what is discipline. The traditional ideas of discipline are undergoing change with technology.
Contribution, productivity, performance, organizational goals, and the pursuit of excellence should be our guide, not just physical attendance as an end in itself.
Today, one does not need a desk to contribute, nor a follower to be a leader.
Contribution and work come through many other avenues than merely physical presence.
Do some homework, don't just report "facts" like a newspaper journalist. Find out the real reason for absence since there is a pattern. Then there must be some personal issue, which requires tact and understanding, not just demands.
Terminating a performer without adequate understanding of the issue does not augur well for any HR professional. There are ways to discipline or deduction to compensate. But first things first. Find all the facts first.
Radhika, first, you show some substance in your capacity to comprehend the issues involved.
Hi,
An employee in a company who is very good in his performance - every month he reaches his targets. But that employee takes 3-5 days of leave every month without any intimation to management. Once the manager gave him a serious warning not to repeat this. Even though he repeated the same.
So, what can we do with that employee?
Awaiting your response.
Radhika.
From India, Pune
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It is the responsibility of HR to find out the real problems this employee is facing and try to sort them out. At the same time, the company should not tolerate his indiscipline at any cost as it may set a bad precedent for other employees. The employee should be given an opportunity to improve. If he doesn't improve, he should be dismissed from services.
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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The employee is an asset to the company, and finding another job would never be a problem for him. You can't let this person go. It's better to have a T-group session and figure out what's going on with him. There must be an issue with him; otherwise, no sane person would risk their career like this.
From India, Delhi
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From India, Delhi
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Dear Radhika,
The case you presented before all of us is not a real-world example; it's just a case study as you mentioned. If it is indeed a real case, then the HR department must investigate properly and provide him with proper counseling where he is lacking. Termination is not an appropriate solution. If you have a better substitute for him, then go for such action.
Discipline is undoubtedly very important, but termination does not make sense in this situation. If many good employees start doing this, then the company will be ready to terminate all. Is it really possible?
Thank you.
From India, Bhopal
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The case you presented before all of us is not a real-world example; it's just a case study as you mentioned. If it is indeed a real case, then the HR department must investigate properly and provide him with proper counseling where he is lacking. Termination is not an appropriate solution. If you have a better substitute for him, then go for such action.
Discipline is undoubtedly very important, but termination does not make sense in this situation. If many good employees start doing this, then the company will be ready to terminate all. Is it really possible?
Thank you.
From India, Bhopal
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Dear Radhika,
In a pure concept, the first obligation of the HR is towards the employee, although some companies don't admit. The course of action should be:
(A)
1. Find the Cause
2. Counsel
3. Arrive at a resolution with mutual consent
4. Maintain Harmony & Improve Employee Satisfaction
or
(B)
1. Have a discussion with employee & management on one board
2. Take a decision on the output
3. In case it becomes imperative for the employee to exit, maintain the decorum & let him resign.
4. NO TERMINATION
Regards,
Niky P.
From India, Indore
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In a pure concept, the first obligation of the HR is towards the employee, although some companies don't admit. The course of action should be:
(A)
1. Find the Cause
2. Counsel
3. Arrive at a resolution with mutual consent
4. Maintain Harmony & Improve Employee Satisfaction
or
(B)
1. Have a discussion with employee & management on one board
2. Take a decision on the output
3. In case it becomes imperative for the employee to exit, maintain the decorum & let him resign.
4. NO TERMINATION
Regards,
Niky P.
From India, Indore
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Radhika,
These situations are really very problematic when it is related to a performing employee, and also, no doubt, performance is not above the discipline/ethics of the organization.
My suggestion:
1. Discuss his problem personally; give him a hearing.
2. Tell him about the possible effects of this indiscipline on his job/career.
3. Instead of termination, issue him a warning letter that if such indiscipline is repeated, then he will be disqualified for any promotion/incentive/bonus.
At last, if nothing improves, replace him because "One bad apple can destroy all the apples in the basket."
Regards,
AKG
From India, Delhi
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These situations are really very problematic when it is related to a performing employee, and also, no doubt, performance is not above the discipline/ethics of the organization.
My suggestion:
1. Discuss his problem personally; give him a hearing.
2. Tell him about the possible effects of this indiscipline on his job/career.
3. Instead of termination, issue him a warning letter that if such indiscipline is repeated, then he will be disqualified for any promotion/incentive/bonus.
At last, if nothing improves, replace him because "One bad apple can destroy all the apples in the basket."
Regards,
AKG
From India, Delhi
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Hi Radhika,
If this is happening consistently, then give a written warning stating that he will be fired without any notice if he continues the same behavior. Even though he is a good performer, such actions can disrupt the existing office atmosphere and distract others.
Meanwhile, start looking for a suitable candidate to recruit.
Thanks,
Kumar
From India, Hyderabad
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If this is happening consistently, then give a written warning stating that he will be fired without any notice if he continues the same behavior. Even though he is a good performer, such actions can disrupt the existing office atmosphere and distract others.
Meanwhile, start looking for a suitable candidate to recruit.
Thanks,
Kumar
From India, Hyderabad
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Hi Radhika,
I do agree with Minesh that if an employee is a good worker, he cannot be so irregular and irresponsible. There must be some specific reason or some personal problem. Try to speak to that person and clarify to him that taking leave without intimation is not a good habit. If he needs 2-3 days off every month, he should inform his boss well in advance. However, if the problem still persists, his services may be terminated after giving him one harsh warning.
Rgds,
Jyoti Negi
From India, Delhi
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I do agree with Minesh that if an employee is a good worker, he cannot be so irregular and irresponsible. There must be some specific reason or some personal problem. Try to speak to that person and clarify to him that taking leave without intimation is not a good habit. If he needs 2-3 days off every month, he should inform his boss well in advance. However, if the problem still persists, his services may be terminated after giving him one harsh warning.
Rgds,
Jyoti Negi
From India, Delhi
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Discipline is the most important, and it is the duty of the HR Dept to maintain that. By doing so, it creates a bad impact on other employees as well, which is not good for your organization. But the dilemma here is that the employee has been a "good performer"; if it had been a poorly performing employee, there would not be any hesitance to remove him/her. However, to remove an employee who excels at their duties is something the management rarely agrees to.
We as HR can suggest removing him/her, but the management never agrees. I have faced the situation myself and found no solution to it, however hard I tried, other than trying patiently and assertively to change the employee through emails, warnings, salary deductions, meetings, etc.
From India, Madras
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We as HR can suggest removing him/her, but the management never agrees. I have faced the situation myself and found no solution to it, however hard I tried, other than trying patiently and assertively to change the employee through emails, warnings, salary deductions, meetings, etc.
From India, Madras
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Dear All,
I have read the case and various solutions suggested. The employee achieves the target which speaks of his competence and usefulness to the organization. However, he remains absent from work without information, almost regularly. Warning has not changed him.
Giving another warning letter or calling for his explanation may not work in this case. To my mind, proper counseling would work best in this situation. He would be the best person to resolve his problem related to work situations or personal issues and to improve his behavior if he is counseled. As HR Manager, I suggest that counseling should be used as the tool to improve the behavior of the employee rather than terminating him.
MPA
From India, Bhopal
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I have read the case and various solutions suggested. The employee achieves the target which speaks of his competence and usefulness to the organization. However, he remains absent from work without information, almost regularly. Warning has not changed him.
Giving another warning letter or calling for his explanation may not work in this case. To my mind, proper counseling would work best in this situation. He would be the best person to resolve his problem related to work situations or personal issues and to improve his behavior if he is counseled. As HR Manager, I suggest that counseling should be used as the tool to improve the behavior of the employee rather than terminating him.
MPA
From India, Bhopal
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Dear, Here, performance is a different issue than discipline. He should be made clear that if three notices are served he will be fired.
From India, New Delhi
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From India, New Delhi
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If your organization offers the option of accruing leaves, I would suggest planning leaves well in advance. This will allow for redundancies if needed. If taking leave is a requirement, it should not hinder performance. In BPOs, we do not have the luxury of taking long leaves, such as two months, as in other industries. However, it should be permitted as long as it is planned and there are no backlogs or requirements during that time.
From India, Bangalore
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From India, Bangalore
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Well, it is challenging for Admin to deal with such employees. Termination is not the only solution. If HR could not elicit the reason for his absence, that means they lack the art of persuasion. Or he is incorrigible. Or he is highly introverted and does not want to share his problems with someone else. Find out reasons from his confidants. Take him to a congenial place, use your skills to know. Or the target fixed may be low. Fix the targets high and watch. Agreed, discipline is paramount. His indiscipline is only about attendance. Assuming his behavior otherwise is alright, wait and watch as details of other aspects are not clear in the letter. Maybe he is frustrated in the company for not getting a promotion and his needs are not properly addressed.
From India
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From India
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Hi,
If the employee is really good, then you should give one chance and speak personally, and if possible, try to solve his/her problem. After that, if the situation has not changed, then you should recommend to the management to terminate him/her.
I have one question that arises after going through the replies of members: if that employee is a favorite of his boss, and his boss wants to retain him/her, and you are also reporting on the same person, then being an HR person, how can I handle the situation?
Thanks,
Jayant
From India, Delhi
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If the employee is really good, then you should give one chance and speak personally, and if possible, try to solve his/her problem. After that, if the situation has not changed, then you should recommend to the management to terminate him/her.
I have one question that arises after going through the replies of members: if that employee is a favorite of his boss, and his boss wants to retain him/her, and you are also reporting on the same person, then being an HR person, how can I handle the situation?
Thanks,
Jayant
From India, Delhi
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Hi Radhika,
Terminating that employee would not be a good decision because hiring a new employee and providing training to him will be cost-effective. After all that, it is not certain that he will provide benefits to the organization. As a good HR manager, it is your responsibility to ask him what the reason is behind taking leaves. A person who is good at his work also knows that taking these leaves will affect his job, so you should inquire about the reason.
If there is no valid reason, then consider cutting his salary. Make him aware that if he repeats this behavior in the future, one week's salary will be deducted.
Regards,
Kanika
From India, Kota
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Terminating that employee would not be a good decision because hiring a new employee and providing training to him will be cost-effective. After all that, it is not certain that he will provide benefits to the organization. As a good HR manager, it is your responsibility to ask him what the reason is behind taking leaves. A person who is good at his work also knows that taking these leaves will affect his job, so you should inquire about the reason.
If there is no valid reason, then consider cutting his salary. Make him aware that if he repeats this behavior in the future, one week's salary will be deducted.
Regards,
Kanika
From India, Kota
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Hello All,
Kindly go through this...
I really wonder why nobody is bothered about this, that where is the thread owner?
What does she think about all the advice provided by all of you?
And how can you, as members, provide advice without full information?
I kindly request all of you to read all the replies by members before giving your own, only if the advice is genuinely given.
Thanks and full support to Nashbramhall Sir.
"As Radhika has not responded to the questions raised, this thread is now closed. She has received enough advice.
Please do not contribute anymore.
Have a lovely day.
Simhan"
From India, Delhi
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Kindly go through this...
I really wonder why nobody is bothered about this, that where is the thread owner?
What does she think about all the advice provided by all of you?
And how can you, as members, provide advice without full information?
I kindly request all of you to read all the replies by members before giving your own, only if the advice is genuinely given.
Thanks and full support to Nashbramhall Sir.
"As Radhika has not responded to the questions raised, this thread is now closed. She has received enough advice.
Please do not contribute anymore.
Have a lovely day.
Simhan"
From India, Delhi
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Dear All,
No doubt, discipline is to be maintained. However, wisdom and propriety dictate that if the milching cow kicks you sometime, please bear it patiently. Take the concerned employee into confidence. Tell him, no, explain to him how his frequent absence from duty affects discipline adversely. Make him speak out about his difficulties if any. In all fairness, good work and other positive aspects should take priority. Frequent absence may be his weakness, but it should be addressed as a last resort. He may have some serious problems that he is not making public. If he shares his difficulties, help him in all possible ways. If he has no such serious problems and the frequent absence is only to show his indispensability, he should be punished with a reduction of pay and not, I repeat, not termination. This should be the last course of action when all other options fail.
Shyam Agrawal
From India, Pune
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No doubt, discipline is to be maintained. However, wisdom and propriety dictate that if the milching cow kicks you sometime, please bear it patiently. Take the concerned employee into confidence. Tell him, no, explain to him how his frequent absence from duty affects discipline adversely. Make him speak out about his difficulties if any. In all fairness, good work and other positive aspects should take priority. Frequent absence may be his weakness, but it should be addressed as a last resort. He may have some serious problems that he is not making public. If he shares his difficulties, help him in all possible ways. If he has no such serious problems and the frequent absence is only to show his indispensability, he should be punished with a reduction of pay and not, I repeat, not termination. This should be the last course of action when all other options fail.
Shyam Agrawal
From India, Pune
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As he is a good performer who achieves targets even after taking 2-3 days off every month, he should definitely be retained. If the official warnings do not yield results, please delve into the root cause through his close friends for his frequent absences. If he is facing family problems or health disorders, someone could assist him. He is, after all, our colleague who is in trouble. However, if he is involved in freelance jobs during those days, he will have to be terminated.
Rani
HR Manager
From India, Madras
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Rani
HR Manager
From India, Madras
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Termination is not a big thing. You can take action anytime against those who remain absent without prior permission. Before that, try to evaluate the specific reason behind absenteeism. Check his background to see if he has been absent on specific dates, specific days, or specific days in a week. If there is any resemblance, then you may find out the reason and perhaps prevent him from being absent by offering counseling or official help to change his behavior.
In the interest of the organization, HR should function first as an improver and then as a terminator.
Thanks & Regards,
Prakash Salunkhe
From India, Pune
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In the interest of the organization, HR should function first as an improver and then as a terminator.
Thanks & Regards,
Prakash Salunkhe
From India, Pune
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Hi, I think being a good performer you should take him in confidance and ask him the reason. It is quit possible that there must be some genuine reason for his absenteeism
From India, Thana
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From India, Thana
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Friends,
When we talk about termination of employment, we must look at the legal provisions and trends of judicial pronouncements. If an employee is terminated, ultimately the matter will go to court, and no court agrees to such termination, especially of a good performer. Consequently, the employee may come back with back wages and all benefits, possibly even after 3-5 years. HR will lose face, and the company will have to pay back wages. Even in the case of a poor performer or an employee displaying severe indiscipline, when termination is being considered, a case should be built by issuing letters, memos, charge sheets, warnings, etc. Subsequently, a departmental inquiry should be conducted, and if guilt is proven, termination can be pursued, considering the individual's past record, which should have been documented during the inquiry.
In the present case, it appears that the employee in question has some serious problems. He does not require advice or the threat of termination; instead, he needs proper counseling by a professional counselor, which the company should either have or organize. Such counseling can greatly benefit him, leading to improvement. This approach will also set a positive example, and all employees will take pride in working for an organization that genuinely cares for its employees.
From India, Mumbai
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When we talk about termination of employment, we must look at the legal provisions and trends of judicial pronouncements. If an employee is terminated, ultimately the matter will go to court, and no court agrees to such termination, especially of a good performer. Consequently, the employee may come back with back wages and all benefits, possibly even after 3-5 years. HR will lose face, and the company will have to pay back wages. Even in the case of a poor performer or an employee displaying severe indiscipline, when termination is being considered, a case should be built by issuing letters, memos, charge sheets, warnings, etc. Subsequently, a departmental inquiry should be conducted, and if guilt is proven, termination can be pursued, considering the individual's past record, which should have been documented during the inquiry.
In the present case, it appears that the employee in question has some serious problems. He does not require advice or the threat of termination; instead, he needs proper counseling by a professional counselor, which the company should either have or organize. Such counseling can greatly benefit him, leading to improvement. This approach will also set a positive example, and all employees will take pride in working for an organization that genuinely cares for its employees.
From India, Mumbai
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When we talk about termination of employment, we must look at the legal provisions and trends of judicial pronouncements. If an employee is terminated, the matter will go to court, and no court agrees to such termination, especially of a good performer. The employee may return with back wages and all benefits, potentially even after 3-5 years. HR will lose face, and the company will have to pay back wages. Even in the case of a poor performer or a highly undisciplined employee where termination is necessary, a case should be built by issuing letters, memos, charge sheets, warnings, etc. Subsequently, a departmental inquiry should be conducted. If guilt is proven, termination is justified, taking into account the individual's past record, which should be documented during the inquiry.
In the current scenario, it appears the concerned employee is facing serious issues. They do not require advice or threats of termination but rather need proper counseling from a professional counselor. The company should have or organize such counseling, which can significantly benefit the employee, leading to improvement. This approach sets a positive example, and all employees will take pride in working for an organization that cares for its employees.
From India, Mumbai
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In the current scenario, it appears the concerned employee is facing serious issues. They do not require advice or threats of termination but rather need proper counseling from a professional counselor. The company should have or organize such counseling, which can significantly benefit the employee, leading to improvement. This approach sets a positive example, and all employees will take pride in working for an organization that cares for its employees.
From India, Mumbai
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Achieving targets and adhering to policy are two separate things. Good performance doesn't guarantee you the opportunity to take advantage and engage in misconduct. A good employee should also maintain discipline within the company to set an example for others.
In my view, this employee is taking undue benefit and tarnishing the company's image. Because unavoidable problems cannot arise every month, and he is not even informing the management before taking unapproved leaves.
I don't think he should be given another chance. He should be terminated in the company's interest.
Thanks and Regards,
Alok R. Srivastava
From India, Pune
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In my view, this employee is taking undue benefit and tarnishing the company's image. Because unavoidable problems cannot arise every month, and he is not even informing the management before taking unapproved leaves.
I don't think he should be given another chance. He should be terminated in the company's interest.
Thanks and Regards,
Alok R. Srivastava
From India, Pune
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If an employee is a good performer, you should ask the reason for taking leave because a well-performing employee may not typically be so irregular and undisciplined. You should give them a chance to manage their leave. If they continue to not follow the rules of discipline, I believe you should terminate them. Discipline is crucial, and it is the HR Department's duty to uphold it. When one employee breaks the rules and regulations, it may set a precedent for others to do the same.
Both the organization and the employee are important, but maintaining discipline is essential. Giving the employee a chance to improve, followed by a warning letter, is important due to the employee's good performance and their significance to the organization.
My suggestion is to TERMINATE HIM.
From India, Hyderabad
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Both the organization and the employee are important, but maintaining discipline is essential. Giving the employee a chance to improve, followed by a warning letter, is important due to the employee's good performance and their significance to the organization.
My suggestion is to TERMINATE HIM.
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Radhika,
As per this case study, the employee is a good performer but is not maintaining organizational discipline. As an HR professional, you have a moral duty to:
1. Counsel him personally to understand if he has any personal, family, or other issues, if any.
2. Warn him about his actions.
3. If he continues, issue a charge sheet outlining reasons for potential action and provide a specific timeframe for improvement; termination may be necessary.
4. Alternatively, consider transferring him to another department for job rotation to assess his performance; if it declines, termination for poor performance can be justified.
5. Have a one-on-one discussion with him to explore either his resignation or termination, leaving the choice to him.
I hope one of these approaches will be beneficial to you.
Warm Regards,
Darshan Dusane
From India, Aurangabad
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As per this case study, the employee is a good performer but is not maintaining organizational discipline. As an HR professional, you have a moral duty to:
1. Counsel him personally to understand if he has any personal, family, or other issues, if any.
2. Warn him about his actions.
3. If he continues, issue a charge sheet outlining reasons for potential action and provide a specific timeframe for improvement; termination may be necessary.
4. Alternatively, consider transferring him to another department for job rotation to assess his performance; if it declines, termination for poor performance can be justified.
5. Have a one-on-one discussion with him to explore either his resignation or termination, leaving the choice to him.
I hope one of these approaches will be beneficial to you.
Warm Regards,
Darshan Dusane
From India, Aurangabad
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He may be willfully absenting himself for the fear of rejection of his leave application. He may have some genuine reasons for the absence. If the organization has a history of rejecting leave applications, such cases will develop. I propose,
(1) he should be counseled, taken into confidence, and ascertain why he needs the leave
(2) The leave should be granted if he is eligible and the reasons are genuine.
These should be irrespective of the fact whether he is a good performer or otherwise. The rules, norms, and guidelines should be uniform, irrespective of staff's performance.
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(1) he should be counseled, taken into confidence, and ascertain why he needs the leave
(2) The leave should be granted if he is eligible and the reasons are genuine.
These should be irrespective of the fact whether he is a good performer or otherwise. The rules, norms, and guidelines should be uniform, irrespective of staff's performance.
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Firstly, you should talk to that employee because management may not agree to remove that employee so easily. Try to solve his problem. If you find that he creates more problems, then give a notice and terminate that employee.
With regards,
Sandeep
From India, Delhi
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With regards,
Sandeep
From India, Delhi
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Hi all,
I agree with everybody that such kind of behavior cannot and should not be tolerated. But my question is, what do you want from an employee - his presence or perfection in his work? Attitude and discipline are made for man, but man is not made for these things. I think he doesn't want to share his problem with others. So, please give him a chance to be free from his problem but warn him to inform before taking leave.
Thanks,
Ganesh
One Indiscipline Employee
From India
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I agree with everybody that such kind of behavior cannot and should not be tolerated. But my question is, what do you want from an employee - his presence or perfection in his work? Attitude and discipline are made for man, but man is not made for these things. I think he doesn't want to share his problem with others. So, please give him a chance to be free from his problem but warn him to inform before taking leave.
Thanks,
Ganesh
One Indiscipline Employee
From India
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It seems from the case study that the person can be from the sales force as he is meeting his targets month on month. If he is from sales, there must be a sales incentive portion attached to his salary. Some media should be devised through which his sales incentive would dip if he takes any holiday without prior notice or permission.
As the employee is really good, it would not make much sense to terminate him. Something like the above can be done first to give him harsh warnings.
From India, Mumbai
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As the employee is really good, it would not make much sense to terminate him. Something like the above can be done first to give him harsh warnings.
From India, Mumbai
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Hi Radhika,
I do agree with Jyothi Jain. We should keep in mind that he is the top performer. At the same time, if we leave him without just by warning him, some other person might take advantage of this. We should give him a final warning, and we can block his incentives until he turns up. I believe we can change his behavior.
Thanks & Regards,
Chiru
From India, Hyderabad
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I do agree with Jyothi Jain. We should keep in mind that he is the top performer. At the same time, if we leave him without just by warning him, some other person might take advantage of this. We should give him a final warning, and we can block his incentives until he turns up. I believe we can change his behavior.
Thanks & Regards,
Chiru
From India, Hyderabad
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Res. Radhika, HR,
In my opinion, such type of behavior is not tolerable. In my organization, I might have tolerated it once only. Though he is talented and a good person, such a working style is not tolerable. Apart from this, he should not feel that he is above the organization. If such an irresponsible, indisciplined person is kicked out, nothing will happen to the organization. No one is more important than the law and rational code of conduct. Everyone should perform with passion.
From India, Pune
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In my opinion, such type of behavior is not tolerable. In my organization, I might have tolerated it once only. Though he is talented and a good person, such a working style is not tolerable. Apart from this, he should not feel that he is above the organization. If such an irresponsible, indisciplined person is kicked out, nothing will happen to the organization. No one is more important than the law and rational code of conduct. Everyone should perform with passion.
From India, Pune
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Hi all!
The question is: why do employees adopt such attitudes? Is there a reason behind it? Any good organization never wants to lose its productive employees, but there should be management that thinks positively. This is a problem-solving matter, and issuing a warning is not the proper way to identify the reasons.
It is very simple to resolve the matter if you have confidence. Just interview the concerned employee and try to find out the reasons behind their absence. In my opinion, there is something wrong, and you can easily address it by interviewing them. Find out the reasons, solve their problems step by step, and improve their confidence and faith.
Love to all & Regards,
Amjad Ali Anjum
From Pakistan, Islamabad
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The question is: why do employees adopt such attitudes? Is there a reason behind it? Any good organization never wants to lose its productive employees, but there should be management that thinks positively. This is a problem-solving matter, and issuing a warning is not the proper way to identify the reasons.
It is very simple to resolve the matter if you have confidence. Just interview the concerned employee and try to find out the reasons behind their absence. In my opinion, there is something wrong, and you can easily address it by interviewing them. Find out the reasons, solve their problems step by step, and improve their confidence and faith.
Love to all & Regards,
Amjad Ali Anjum
From Pakistan, Islamabad
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Dear Radhika,
Handling the situation with the employee requires emphasizing the importance of submitting a leave application before taking time off. It's like giving a heads-up to the team, helping everyone plan better and ensuring a smoother workflow. Encouraging this practice isn't just about rules; it's about fostering a cooperative and organized work environment where everyone's on the same page.
Best Regards,
Joneselly
From India, Mumbai
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Handling the situation with the employee requires emphasizing the importance of submitting a leave application before taking time off. It's like giving a heads-up to the team, helping everyone plan better and ensuring a smoother workflow. Encouraging this practice isn't just about rules; it's about fostering a cooperative and organized work environment where everyone's on the same page.
Best Regards,
Joneselly
From India, Mumbai
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Ascent - Attendance & Leave Management - Presentation.pp s
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LEAVE-ATTENDANC E POLICY.doc