Hi all,
I joined company X on Jan 31, 2023, and my relieving date is June 31, 2023 (DOE is not yet updated in EPFO). I was on the bench at company X, and before my relieving, I joined another company Y on May 22, 2023, and I was relieved on Sep 22, 2023.
Now my concern is regarding dual employment. Company Y hasn't yet created a member ID for me. I have now joined Company Z on Oct 04, 2023, and they are going to create a member ID for me.
If company Y creates a member ID, then I may face an issue with dual employment.
May I have your suggestions on whether it is possible for Company Y to create a member ID for me now? Within how many days of an employee's joining can a company create a member ID? If company Y can create a member ID, can I ask them to update my DOJ to be some date in July 2023 and transfer my PF arrears for the months of May and June?
May I have your suggestions, please!
From India, Chennai
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5I joined company X on Jan 31, 2023, and my relieving date is June 31, 2023 (DOE is not yet updated in EPFO). I was on the bench at company X, and before my relieving, I joined another company Y on May 22, 2023, and I was relieved on Sep 22, 2023.
Now my concern is regarding dual employment. Company Y hasn't yet created a member ID for me. I have now joined Company Z on Oct 04, 2023, and they are going to create a member ID for me.
If company Y creates a member ID, then I may face an issue with dual employment.
May I have your suggestions on whether it is possible for Company Y to create a member ID for me now? Within how many days of an employee's joining can a company create a member ID? If company Y can create a member ID, can I ask them to update my DOJ to be some date in July 2023 and transfer my PF arrears for the months of May and June?
May I have your suggestions, please!
From India, Chennai
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An employer is expected to create a member ID on the UAN already established on the same day as the employee's joining. That is why the employer asks for your UAN upon joining. It is not the responsibility of the new employer, Z, to create the member ID. Any overlapping service should be addressed by the employee personally.
If you have worked at Company X until June 30th (there is no date called 31st June in my calendar!), you cannot join Company Y on May 22, 2023. If Company X has paid you until June 30th, they should have contributed to your PF until that date, making changing the date impossible. If Company Y has paid you from May 22, 2023, and contributed to your PF from that date, the joining date cannot be altered.
You mentioned that "Company Y hasn't yet created a member ID for me." If this indicates that Company Y has not registered you under EPF, you can request to change your joining date to July 1, 2023, if you have stated this date in your CV and application to Company Z. Company Y must be willing to accept that date. If Company Y has not registered you, they should not have made PF contributions. If they now create a member ID before July 1, they will be liable for interest and damages under relevant sections of the EPF and MP Act. Failure to remit PF deductions is a serious offense under the Indian Penal Code.
If you forget the PF of Company Y, there will be no overlapping service. Company Z can use the same UAN generated by the first company to create a member ID and begin contributions. You can inform the HR of Company Z that you did not have PF in Company Y. In Form 11, mention the UAN and member ID provided by Company X only.
Hope the above information is helpful.
From India, Kannur
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If you have worked at Company X until June 30th (there is no date called 31st June in my calendar!), you cannot join Company Y on May 22, 2023. If Company X has paid you until June 30th, they should have contributed to your PF until that date, making changing the date impossible. If Company Y has paid you from May 22, 2023, and contributed to your PF from that date, the joining date cannot be altered.
You mentioned that "Company Y hasn't yet created a member ID for me." If this indicates that Company Y has not registered you under EPF, you can request to change your joining date to July 1, 2023, if you have stated this date in your CV and application to Company Z. Company Y must be willing to accept that date. If Company Y has not registered you, they should not have made PF contributions. If they now create a member ID before July 1, they will be liable for interest and damages under relevant sections of the EPF and MP Act. Failure to remit PF deductions is a serious offense under the Indian Penal Code.
If you forget the PF of Company Y, there will be no overlapping service. Company Z can use the same UAN generated by the first company to create a member ID and begin contributions. You can inform the HR of Company Z that you did not have PF in Company Y. In Form 11, mention the UAN and member ID provided by Company X only.
Hope the above information is helpful.
From India, Kannur
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Hi Madhu,
Thank you so much for the reply and advice! Yes, I mistakenly mentioned my last working date with Company X as June 31, 2023. It is actually June 30, 2023. I asked HR of Company Y to change my joining date on the relieving letter, but they said it will be May 22, 2023 only.
They have deducted an amount from my salary every month towards PF but have not created a member ID for me yet. If they now create a PF for me, paying the amount from May 22, 2023, then I will be in trouble. So, I had asked them to put PF from July onwards, and I am still waiting for their reply. As per your advice, I won't insist on it again and will see what they come up with.
I also saw a video where it was mentioned that it is not possible to create a member ID post 60 days. I am not sure if it is relevant to my case. I am attaching the screenshot for your kind reference.
I have not shown my experience with Company Y to Company Z, and I am not going to show it in the future either. I just hope they don't create a PF account for me at all.
I appreciate your support.
From India, Chennai
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Thank you so much for the reply and advice! Yes, I mistakenly mentioned my last working date with Company X as June 31, 2023. It is actually June 30, 2023. I asked HR of Company Y to change my joining date on the relieving letter, but they said it will be May 22, 2023 only.
They have deducted an amount from my salary every month towards PF but have not created a member ID for me yet. If they now create a PF for me, paying the amount from May 22, 2023, then I will be in trouble. So, I had asked them to put PF from July onwards, and I am still waiting for their reply. As per your advice, I won't insist on it again and will see what they come up with.
I also saw a video where it was mentioned that it is not possible to create a member ID post 60 days. I am not sure if it is relevant to my case. I am attaching the screenshot for your kind reference.
I have not shown my experience with Company Y to Company Z, and I am not going to show it in the future either. I just hope they don't create a PF account for me at all.
I appreciate your support.
From India, Chennai
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(Fact Check Failed/Partial)-The user's reply contains some inaccuracies regarding PF creation timeline and employer's obligations. It's essential to address these issues promptly.
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I don't think that with respect to any former employee, the company will create a PF account and incur penal interest and damages. Therefore, proceed with the assumption that you did not work with company Y.
It is interesting that a company is very adamant about not changing the date of joining, while the compliance aspect is very weak.
From India, Kannur
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It is interesting that a company is very adamant about not changing the date of joining, while the compliance aspect is very weak.
From India, Kannur
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(Fact Check Failed/Partial)-The user reply is incorrect. According to EPFO guidelines, it is mandatory for all employees to have a PF account, even for a short duration. Company Y should create a member ID for the employee, and the employee should ensure accurate records.
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Hello Sir,
Company Y said:
1. The PF system doesn't allow creating overlapping dates now, so they asked me to get the company X LWD to be before May 22, 2023, if I want PF money, and then they will put the PF amount for me, paying interest. They also said they will not create PF from July 1, 2023.
2. Else, to forego the PF.
So, I decided to forego PF.
Now, in my PF service history, company Y will not be listed. My concern is regarding Form 16. This company Y will be listed in Form 16 for this financial year.
I have the following question: Does company Y appearing on my Form 16 for this financial year will be a problem during any of my future BGV in new companies I am going to join? If it may be a problem, then how can I ask company Y to not include my details in Form 16? Thanks in advance!
From India, Chennai
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Company Y said:
1. The PF system doesn't allow creating overlapping dates now, so they asked me to get the company X LWD to be before May 22, 2023, if I want PF money, and then they will put the PF amount for me, paying interest. They also said they will not create PF from July 1, 2023.
2. Else, to forego the PF.
So, I decided to forego PF.
Now, in my PF service history, company Y will not be listed. My concern is regarding Form 16. This company Y will be listed in Form 16 for this financial year.
I have the following question: Does company Y appearing on my Form 16 for this financial year will be a problem during any of my future BGV in new companies I am going to join? If it may be a problem, then how can I ask company Y to not include my details in Form 16? Thanks in advance!
From India, Chennai
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(Fact Check Failed/Partial)-The information provided in the user reply is incorrect. According to EPF rules, overlapping dates are not allowed. Company Y should not create a member ID with overlapping dates. It's advisable to consult with HR experts for further guidance.
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The coverage or non-coverage under PF is not the headache of any background verification agency. If they talk about company Y, you can mention that they did not create a PF account for me, and that is not my concern. Can the background verification agency take action against company Y? No. Incorrectly inputting exit dates and overlapping services are common human errors, and for that, an employee cannot be penalized.
From India, Kannur
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From India, Kannur
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(Fact Check Failed/Partial)-The user reply contains incorrect information. The establishment of a PF account and compliance with dual employment laws are critical responsibilities for both employees and employers. It's essential to address discrepancies promptly to avoid legal repercussions.
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Hello Sir,
I am going to hide Company Y employment experience completely. As a PF account wasn't created for Company Y, it will not reflect in my EPFO portal. However, Company Y will be listed in Form 16 for this financial year.
Will my future employers be able to identify dual employment from Form 16? If Company Y appears on my Form 16 for this financial year, could it pose a problem during any future Background Verification (BGV) processes at new companies I am joining? If this could be an issue, how can I request Company Y to exclude my details from Form 16?
From India, Chennai
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I am going to hide Company Y employment experience completely. As a PF account wasn't created for Company Y, it will not reflect in my EPFO portal. However, Company Y will be listed in Form 16 for this financial year.
Will my future employers be able to identify dual employment from Form 16? If Company Y appears on my Form 16 for this financial year, could it pose a problem during any future Background Verification (BGV) processes at new companies I am joining? If this could be an issue, how can I request Company Y to exclude my details from Form 16?
From India, Chennai
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(Fact Check Failed/Partial)-The information provided is not entirely accurate. It is essential to address the issue of dual employment correctly to avoid legal implications.
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TDS and form 16 are personal documents and why should you keep it open to the background verification agency?
From India, Kannur
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From India, Kannur
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(Fact Check Failed/Partial)-The user reply is not relevant to the original post, which is about dual employment and EPFO member IDs. TDS and Form 16 are not the main concerns in this context.
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Hello, Sir,
Nowadays, background verification agencies are asking for consent to access the 26AS statement along with EPFO. I mistakenly mentioned Form 16 instead of 26AS, but companies are accessing employees' ITIR login by requesting acceptance through a software tool.
"Please provide consent to share your 26AS statement and/or EPFO Service History using your ITR login and/or EPFO login, respectively. If you are not a registered user, Google ITR registration and/or UAN registration to register."
I have attached an image for your kind reference.
From India, Chennai
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Nowadays, background verification agencies are asking for consent to access the 26AS statement along with EPFO. I mistakenly mentioned Form 16 instead of 26AS, but companies are accessing employees' ITIR login by requesting acceptance through a software tool.
"Please provide consent to share your 26AS statement and/or EPFO Service History using your ITR login and/or EPFO login, respectively. If you are not a registered user, Google ITR registration and/or UAN registration to register."
I have attached an image for your kind reference.
From India, Chennai
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(Fact Check Failed/Partial)-The information provided in the user reply is not accurate. The requirement to provide consent to access 26AS statement and EPFO details using ITR login is not a standard practice in the context of the original post. The attachment of an image for reference does not address the user's query about dual employment and PF transfer.
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(Fact Check Failed/Partial)-The user's reply contains inaccuracies regarding the creation of member IDs, contribution to PF, and legal implications. It is essential to ensure accurate PF contributions and compliance with labor laws.