I want to understand that what is the salary entitlement of a person who joins a company and leaves within 10days. Is the company liable to pay any salary such individual. he has not wasted time of recruitment but also training.
From India, Delhi
From India, Delhi
" He has not (only) wasted (the) time of recruitment but also (that of the) training " - so what, it is the botheration of the employer. If training is an inseparable part of the job i.e,. on the job training as per the appointment orders, the individual though leaving after a short duration is entitled to salary.
From India, Salem
6018From India, Salem
You have a standard notice period. If the person has left without completing notice period, then the notice pay (gross not basic) can be deducted from pay of the first 10 days.
If you have no notice pay, then you are supposed to pay the employee his salary.
However, if the person was in training during this time and has not worked then you may have some defence.
In reality you can tell him to take a hike and get lost. The chances of legal action on this matter is very slim.
From India, Mumbai
If you have no notice pay, then you are supposed to pay the employee his salary.
However, if the person was in training during this time and has not worked then you may have some defence.
In reality you can tell him to take a hike and get lost. The chances of legal action on this matter is very slim.
From India, Mumbai
Mr. Aman,
Recruitment process, drawl of salary for working period of an employee and disciplinary action or recovery of the notice period pay are three different processes, not to be clubeed in any manner. So, irrespective of the waste of time by the company in recruitment/ training process, the salary has to be drawn, not to say of 10 days, but even for one day of work of an employee. No law permits a company not to draw salary of any employee irrespect of his work period being a few days or a longer period.
Contrarily, the management is free to take two kinds of action against the employee, i.e., (1) disciplinary action, as per rules prescribed for conduct and discipline of the employees, for unauthorised absence or desertion from duty, if he has left service without getting due approval of his resignation/ formal relief from his job; and (2) initiate action for recovery of notice period pay from the employee subject to adjustment of the duty pay toeards the dues recoverable from the employee.
So, nothing informal should be there or out of record of the organisation.. Notice period pay is just like compensation for the expenditure or overheads of recruitment or say waste of time of the company in making recruitment or training. However, if the organisation works only by hit and trial basis without having or following any set of rules, only the organisation can be blamed for not following the law of the land.
By the way, what type of training can be possible within 10 days. He must have rendered his service in doing work of the company?
.
From India, Delhi
Recruitment process, drawl of salary for working period of an employee and disciplinary action or recovery of the notice period pay are three different processes, not to be clubeed in any manner. So, irrespective of the waste of time by the company in recruitment/ training process, the salary has to be drawn, not to say of 10 days, but even for one day of work of an employee. No law permits a company not to draw salary of any employee irrespect of his work period being a few days or a longer period.
Contrarily, the management is free to take two kinds of action against the employee, i.e., (1) disciplinary action, as per rules prescribed for conduct and discipline of the employees, for unauthorised absence or desertion from duty, if he has left service without getting due approval of his resignation/ formal relief from his job; and (2) initiate action for recovery of notice period pay from the employee subject to adjustment of the duty pay toeards the dues recoverable from the employee.
So, nothing informal should be there or out of record of the organisation.. Notice period pay is just like compensation for the expenditure or overheads of recruitment or say waste of time of the company in making recruitment or training. However, if the organisation works only by hit and trial basis without having or following any set of rules, only the organisation can be blamed for not following the law of the land.
By the way, what type of training can be possible within 10 days. He must have rendered his service in doing work of the company?
.
From India, Delhi
Simply put-the person is entitled for 10 days pay.
Pay cannot be denied legally if he claims it.
it is another thing,that the person may not claim it if he has to fight a legal battle for 10 days pay.
From India, Pune
Pay cannot be denied legally if he claims it.
it is another thing,that the person may not claim it if he has to fight a legal battle for 10 days pay.
From India, Pune
Dear all,
How I wish our experts raise questions to get a clear picture of the scenario and the motive behind the blogger asking a question. I very much appreciate what nathrao has done at https://www.citehr.com/539849-un-paid-salary.html
Amankbansal has not told us whether it is a hypothetical question (May be a question at an interview) for which he is seeking an answer or whether he works in HR department and is seeking a solution to a problem faced.
Many of the responses are conditional based on assumptions. Instead of assuming the scenario, we should ask questions to help the blogger clearly explain the scenario, to help us to give precise suggestions.
I hope experts take these comments in the right spirit and will not get offended. I am sorry if I have ruffled the feathers as the saying goes.
From United Kingdom
How I wish our experts raise questions to get a clear picture of the scenario and the motive behind the blogger asking a question. I very much appreciate what nathrao has done at https://www.citehr.com/539849-un-paid-salary.html
Amankbansal has not told us whether it is a hypothetical question (May be a question at an interview) for which he is seeking an answer or whether he works in HR department and is seeking a solution to a problem faced.
Many of the responses are conditional based on assumptions. Instead of assuming the scenario, we should ask questions to help the blogger clearly explain the scenario, to help us to give precise suggestions.
I hope experts take these comments in the right spirit and will not get offended. I am sorry if I have ruffled the feathers as the saying goes.
From United Kingdom
I second you Simhan.
And to your line "hypothetical question..........for which he is seeking an answer or whether he works in HR department and is seeking a solution to a problem faced......", let me add 'OR is he the employee concerned'.
There have been many Postings by members who post putting themselves as some outsider trying to help.....with whatever intent.
Though this sounds really tough/impersonal or 'seems' to go against the basic/core tenets of CiteHR, I can see the only way to ensure members who post such half-hearted/incomplete/inaccurate Postings VALUE OTHER'S time & effort is to STOP responding to such Postings.
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
And to your line "hypothetical question..........for which he is seeking an answer or whether he works in HR department and is seeking a solution to a problem faced......", let me add 'OR is he the employee concerned'.
There have been many Postings by members who post putting themselves as some outsider trying to help.....with whatever intent.
Though this sounds really tough/impersonal or 'seems' to go against the basic/core tenets of CiteHR, I can see the only way to ensure members who post such half-hearted/incomplete/inaccurate Postings VALUE OTHER'S time & effort is to STOP responding to such Postings.
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
TS
WRT your above post see this post;https://www.citehr.com/539894-taking...ce-period.html
I am trying to be aware of what could possibly go against me by gathering information from you people .. when you say "declared absconding" is that a legal term ?
Sometimes the forum is being used as a sounding board for garnering opinions and ideas.
Hypothetical questions are raised usually by saying -my friend working in X organisation has this problem------
As always helpful members think on all angles,aspects keep answering.Well I guess in a public forum such queries are to be expected.
Members need to exercise their own mind and avoid giving replies if query is a fishing expedition.
From India, Pune
WRT your above post see this post;https://www.citehr.com/539894-taking...ce-period.html
I am trying to be aware of what could possibly go against me by gathering information from you people .. when you say "declared absconding" is that a legal term ?
Sometimes the forum is being used as a sounding board for garnering opinions and ideas.
Hypothetical questions are raised usually by saying -my friend working in X organisation has this problem------
As always helpful members think on all angles,aspects keep answering.Well I guess in a public forum such queries are to be expected.
Members need to exercise their own mind and avoid giving replies if query is a fishing expedition.
From India, Pune
Dear Members
Thanks for responding to the question!!
Further I would like to assure you all this not a hypothetical question and not fishing in any manner. BTW this was my 1st experience with citeHR where someone suggested that this a forum wherein you can get opinion leaders give you right advice for making policies. I didn't actually thought that it is not a 'forum' by the spirit of it. 'Internet Forum' usually meant you're free to ask questions and people choose to respond or not - generally different from taking a service from a company.
I head a startup organization as a CEO, so we came across such a situation lately, though we have a notice period of 45 days for leaving the employment but still we want to be on the right side of the law. I hope the forum members appreciate that. It should not only get to legal claim etc.
Further one member asked "By the way, what type of training can be possible within 10 days. He must have rendered his service in doing work of the company?" - I am unsure what work/service can be expected rendered in 10 days.
Question 1
Is there is a possibility of a 'free-look' agreement for 1st 10 days where both parties are on same footing; of course the employee will have a choice not to enter such agreement. I am asking you all experts what is the right method of making sure that no party ends up losing. It should be win-win for both parties.
I will appreciate that readers who think this question not right or is fishing - DO NOT RESPOND. It only discourages new users like us.
Regards
Aman
From India, Delhi
Thanks for responding to the question!!
Further I would like to assure you all this not a hypothetical question and not fishing in any manner. BTW this was my 1st experience with citeHR where someone suggested that this a forum wherein you can get opinion leaders give you right advice for making policies. I didn't actually thought that it is not a 'forum' by the spirit of it. 'Internet Forum' usually meant you're free to ask questions and people choose to respond or not - generally different from taking a service from a company.
I head a startup organization as a CEO, so we came across such a situation lately, though we have a notice period of 45 days for leaving the employment but still we want to be on the right side of the law. I hope the forum members appreciate that. It should not only get to legal claim etc.
Further one member asked "By the way, what type of training can be possible within 10 days. He must have rendered his service in doing work of the company?" - I am unsure what work/service can be expected rendered in 10 days.
Question 1
Is there is a possibility of a 'free-look' agreement for 1st 10 days where both parties are on same footing; of course the employee will have a choice not to enter such agreement. I am asking you all experts what is the right method of making sure that no party ends up losing. It should be win-win for both parties.
I will appreciate that readers who think this question not right or is fishing - DO NOT RESPOND. It only discourages new users like us.
Regards
Aman
From India, Delhi
Hello Aman,
I think you could have saved all of us the trouble in posting the type of postings/responses had you given these details a bit earlier.
Frankly, I [or maybe 'we'] should have checked out your membership Date :-)
Vis-a-vis your line ''Internet Forum' usually meant you're free to ask questions and people choose to respond or not', that's what makes CiteHR different. It's not just a platform to get solutions for real-time/life problems but ALSO a learning mechanism for those who wish to learn.....the idea being to enable others AVOID making the same mistake & enable them to learn from OTHER'S mistakes.
Coming to the issue at-hand, the possibility of such an employee going 'legal' for 10 days salary is very remote.....UNLESS he/she has a lot of money to blow OR his parent is a litigant advocate [if you know what I mean].
So let you decision NOT be guided by THIS factor.
And as the CEO, the options available to you would be many....unlike for a typical HR person.
About "possibility of a 'free-look' agreement for 1st 10 days"--
I am with you that 10 days is too short a time for anyone to be productive....in Training OR @ work.
But this very fact would make your query redundant. How can you make a judgement call in 10 days as far as 'both parties are on same footing' aspect is concerned? At the most, you can see IF this guy is serious or is still looking for other jobs.....depending on his seriousness in the job/training. I guess, that's just about it. UNLESS you meant anything else by this statement?
Generally speaking, that's what the Probation Period is supposed to be achieving.
There's another aspect to this. Suggest DON'T get into the trap of laying down systems/procedures/policies based on one-off situations. That will constrict your options as your Company grows.
To give you a comparision, the innumerable Laws in this country, many of which are redundant now & are being weeded out.
Have you faced this situation multiple times? If Yes, then MAYBE it's time you also have a relook @ your hiring methods. Such guys ought NOT to have been hired in the first place.......the focus on WHY the candidate is preferring your Company during the I/V becomes important. If it's just another job OR just for a salary hike, then you better be careful with such guys.......interviewing more candidates may be worth it rather than deciding in a hurry.
If you wish to know more on identifying such guys during the I/V process, pl PM me....shall be glad to discuss to evolve a solution to preempt such situations.
Coming to this specific employee...HAS he asked for his salary? OR is it YOUR initiative?
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
I think you could have saved all of us the trouble in posting the type of postings/responses had you given these details a bit earlier.
Frankly, I [or maybe 'we'] should have checked out your membership Date :-)
Vis-a-vis your line ''Internet Forum' usually meant you're free to ask questions and people choose to respond or not', that's what makes CiteHR different. It's not just a platform to get solutions for real-time/life problems but ALSO a learning mechanism for those who wish to learn.....the idea being to enable others AVOID making the same mistake & enable them to learn from OTHER'S mistakes.
Coming to the issue at-hand, the possibility of such an employee going 'legal' for 10 days salary is very remote.....UNLESS he/she has a lot of money to blow OR his parent is a litigant advocate [if you know what I mean].
So let you decision NOT be guided by THIS factor.
And as the CEO, the options available to you would be many....unlike for a typical HR person.
About "possibility of a 'free-look' agreement for 1st 10 days"--
I am with you that 10 days is too short a time for anyone to be productive....in Training OR @ work.
But this very fact would make your query redundant. How can you make a judgement call in 10 days as far as 'both parties are on same footing' aspect is concerned? At the most, you can see IF this guy is serious or is still looking for other jobs.....depending on his seriousness in the job/training. I guess, that's just about it. UNLESS you meant anything else by this statement?
Generally speaking, that's what the Probation Period is supposed to be achieving.
There's another aspect to this. Suggest DON'T get into the trap of laying down systems/procedures/policies based on one-off situations. That will constrict your options as your Company grows.
To give you a comparision, the innumerable Laws in this country, many of which are redundant now & are being weeded out.
Have you faced this situation multiple times? If Yes, then MAYBE it's time you also have a relook @ your hiring methods. Such guys ought NOT to have been hired in the first place.......the focus on WHY the candidate is preferring your Company during the I/V becomes important. If it's just another job OR just for a salary hike, then you better be careful with such guys.......interviewing more candidates may be worth it rather than deciding in a hurry.
If you wish to know more on identifying such guys during the I/V process, pl PM me....shall be glad to discuss to evolve a solution to preempt such situations.
Coming to this specific employee...HAS he asked for his salary? OR is it YOUR initiative?
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Employee Salary file - India 2016 AB.xls
Legal Clarification on Absconding Employee, Contract Labour Engagement & Leave Entitlement Ammen.pdf