We started a firm in January 2013 and closed in August\'13 due to loss and insufficient funds.
We hired a Creative head in january and he left organization on 17 May without information. He has filed a case for non-payment.
1. He has made a forged appointment letter with one of firm partners signatures on it.
2. We have not given any salary slip nor their is any receipt of acknowledgement.
3. Their is no proof of attendance as such.
P.S. : We need to pay him 8000/- as due balance but he is asking for 60,000/- as compensation now.
Please help. the matter is in court and 1st hearing is due for next week
From India, New Delhi
1We hired a Creative head in january and he left organization on 17 May without information. He has filed a case for non-payment.
1. He has made a forged appointment letter with one of firm partners signatures on it.
2. We have not given any salary slip nor their is any receipt of acknowledgement.
3. Their is no proof of attendance as such.
P.S. : We need to pay him 8000/- as due balance but he is asking for 60,000/- as compensation now.
Please help. the matter is in court and 1st hearing is due for next week
From India, New Delhi
Ishita, there is a solution in your posting only, when you know that there is a forged document on the opponent hands this is the base claim which your advocate has to make.. You have mentioned that you have to pay your ex creative head an amount of rs.8000/- let us please know why and how this claim?? on one hand you are mentioning that you have not given any appointment letter and pay slips by which virtually you can claim that you do not know him, on the other hand you are saying that you have to pay him 8000/- ??? in addition to this do you have any other dues payable to employees in any manner??? please check this with your advocate that if this dues are admitted in the court, it may be a negative hit on you!!!
From India, Hyderabad
From India, Hyderabad
Hi Ishita,
You have mentioned that the creative head had left your organization without informing, which is more or less an absconding case. Also I do believe that you have a notice period policy in your organization. Which in turn he had not served. Also about the forged appointment letter, are you sure that the signature on the letter is not signed by your partner?
Because your ex-employee would not approach the court for justice without any substantial record/paper. Also was he paid salary when he was associated with your organization? Please throw some light for better understanding.
From India, Bangalore
You have mentioned that the creative head had left your organization without informing, which is more or less an absconding case. Also I do believe that you have a notice period policy in your organization. Which in turn he had not served. Also about the forged appointment letter, are you sure that the signature on the letter is not signed by your partner?
Because your ex-employee would not approach the court for justice without any substantial record/paper. Also was he paid salary when he was associated with your organization? Please throw some light for better understanding.
From India, Bangalore
Hello Sriram,
Going by what Ishita mentioned, it looks as though the salary & other terms were 'VERBAL' than thru any Offer/Appointment Letter.
Ishita--pl confirm reg the above aspect.
Also pl clarify the points raised by Sriram.
Usually in such situations of 'lack of documentation', it becomes a double-edged weapon--BOTH parties can use it to their advantage. It just depends on the ability/smartness/ingenuity of the respective Advocate. So the Moral of the Story is: Hire a GOOD lawyer.
All the Best.
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
Going by what Ishita mentioned, it looks as though the salary & other terms were 'VERBAL' than thru any Offer/Appointment Letter.
Ishita--pl confirm reg the above aspect.
Also pl clarify the points raised by Sriram.
Usually in such situations of 'lack of documentation', it becomes a double-edged weapon--BOTH parties can use it to their advantage. It just depends on the ability/smartness/ingenuity of the respective Advocate. So the Moral of the Story is: Hire a GOOD lawyer.
All the Best.
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
Hi Ishita,
Further to the comments given by other members above.
What was the legal status of the firm?
Was it Sole Trader, Partnership or Limited?
If it was Sole Trader or Partnership, then the owners are liable to pay any dues etc.
If it was a Limited company then the liability is limited and if the firm has now gone out of business any monies or assets should have been liquidated and distributed to the creditors, which include employees.
As you have admitted that you owe him Rs 8,000. Then, the fact that an appointment letter or pay slips were not given, the courts will deem him to be an employee. Therefore, the absence of these documents will have no bearing, (after all it is the firm's fault that the documentation was not in place and not his).
He will be questioned about the company, other employees, the premises, company documentation, clients etc. to establish that his knowledge about such matters could only have come about by being an employee.
I suggest that you immediately pay him the Rs 8,000.This will stop the court from adding interest and penalties and make the Rs 60,000 compensation demand weak, as he left the firm without going through due process.
I hope the above has been of some help.
Regards,
Harsh
From United Kingdom, Barrow
Further to the comments given by other members above.
What was the legal status of the firm?
Was it Sole Trader, Partnership or Limited?
If it was Sole Trader or Partnership, then the owners are liable to pay any dues etc.
If it was a Limited company then the liability is limited and if the firm has now gone out of business any monies or assets should have been liquidated and distributed to the creditors, which include employees.
As you have admitted that you owe him Rs 8,000. Then, the fact that an appointment letter or pay slips were not given, the courts will deem him to be an employee. Therefore, the absence of these documents will have no bearing, (after all it is the firm's fault that the documentation was not in place and not his).
He will be questioned about the company, other employees, the premises, company documentation, clients etc. to establish that his knowledge about such matters could only have come about by being an employee.
I suggest that you immediately pay him the Rs 8,000.This will stop the court from adding interest and penalties and make the Rs 60,000 compensation demand weak, as he left the firm without going through due process.
I hope the above has been of some help.
Regards,
Harsh
From United Kingdom, Barrow
Dear Ishita
Looking into the nature of the case, and the facts such as these given below; and the interpretation thereof:
"We started a firm in January 2013 and closed in August\'13 due to loss and insufficient funds."
It speaks itself on the state of affairs. A firm folding up within 8 months indicates its premature death caused by lack of planning - financial and otherwise and the managerial acumen of the promoters.
"We hired a Creative head in january ..... "
" We have not given any salary slip nor their is any receipt of acknowledgement."
"Their is no proof of attendance as such."
In such a case, where there is no proper documentation;one can not blame him for his action that ".... he left organization on 17 May without information."
Perhaps he was wise enough to know that the ship is sinking and got away to safety.
There is no question of any Notice or Notice Period; as there was no documentation from your side.
"We need to pay him 8000/- as due balance...."
When he left in the month of May itself; Why the dues was not paid??
Perhaps, he would NOT have gone in for a Court Case, if the outstanding amount was paid to him in time.
It is difficult to imagine this person going to Court with a "forged" appointment letter. On the other hand, it is more likely that he "persuaded" that partner to sign a letter purporting to be an appointment letter. Whether the partner was authorised to do it or not is another matter, but if his signatures are 'real' /authentic; then it can not be called a forged appointment letter - just because your firm does not issue any appointment letter.
I think your firm should not have let this matter go into the Court. There is still time to cut your losses. You can go in for an out-of-court settlement; and pay him his rightful dues along with interest and some compensation for the trouble he went through.
Hope better sense prevail, and the matter is settled out of the court amicably.
Warm regards.
From India, Delhi
Looking into the nature of the case, and the facts such as these given below; and the interpretation thereof:
"We started a firm in January 2013 and closed in August\'13 due to loss and insufficient funds."
It speaks itself on the state of affairs. A firm folding up within 8 months indicates its premature death caused by lack of planning - financial and otherwise and the managerial acumen of the promoters.
"We hired a Creative head in january ..... "
" We have not given any salary slip nor their is any receipt of acknowledgement."
"Their is no proof of attendance as such."
In such a case, where there is no proper documentation;one can not blame him for his action that ".... he left organization on 17 May without information."
Perhaps he was wise enough to know that the ship is sinking and got away to safety.
There is no question of any Notice or Notice Period; as there was no documentation from your side.
"We need to pay him 8000/- as due balance...."
When he left in the month of May itself; Why the dues was not paid??
Perhaps, he would NOT have gone in for a Court Case, if the outstanding amount was paid to him in time.
It is difficult to imagine this person going to Court with a "forged" appointment letter. On the other hand, it is more likely that he "persuaded" that partner to sign a letter purporting to be an appointment letter. Whether the partner was authorised to do it or not is another matter, but if his signatures are 'real' /authentic; then it can not be called a forged appointment letter - just because your firm does not issue any appointment letter.
I think your firm should not have let this matter go into the Court. There is still time to cut your losses. You can go in for an out-of-court settlement; and pay him his rightful dues along with interest and some compensation for the trouble he went through.
Hope better sense prevail, and the matter is settled out of the court amicably.
Warm regards.
From India, Delhi
Dear Ishita ji,
Normally I do not make any comment on any legal issue without studying all the relevant documents in regards.
Still I wish to state here that the onus lies on you to disprove the complaint but you are agreeing that Rs. 8000/- is not paid by you. Therefore the matter is not in your favour, which seems to me.
Now the question of compensation, it is the court who has to decide the quantum on various parameters.
From India, Mumbai
Normally I do not make any comment on any legal issue without studying all the relevant documents in regards.
Still I wish to state here that the onus lies on you to disprove the complaint but you are agreeing that Rs. 8000/- is not paid by you. Therefore the matter is not in your favour, which seems to me.
Now the question of compensation, it is the court who has to decide the quantum on various parameters.
From India, Mumbai
Hellow Ishitaji. In this cas employee leftinMay,2013 and your organisation was closed during August. That means the individual aemployee left the
organisation without any
information and you might have issued a letter to the individual about his absconding from duty. If it is so this letter will suffice for not reporting
before closure of the orgn.
and not collecting his dues. So question of claiming compensation does
not arise. More over the
individual is probation period and claiming of compensation does not arise. Anyhow, I just put
my views and Lawyer is the
right person to advise you
keeping the opinions of
all the cite persons in view.
Eswararao Ivaturi.
From United States, Cupertino
organisation without any
information and you might have issued a letter to the individual about his absconding from duty. If it is so this letter will suffice for not reporting
before closure of the orgn.
and not collecting his dues. So question of claiming compensation does
not arise. More over the
individual is probation period and claiming of compensation does not arise. Anyhow, I just put
my views and Lawyer is the
right person to advise you
keeping the opinions of
all the cite persons in view.
Eswararao Ivaturi.
From United States, Cupertino
Hi,
After analyzing the above post, I opine as under:
You should not fully deny relationship of master & servant with the employee as he might have some documents relating to your company whether same are fabricated or not. After all onus will be on you to prove fabrication. Moreover you have to take one stand during the course of proceedings before the court. Further, if we deny relationship with the employee, we can not reply and justify one question 'Why he has filed case against you ? So I give you draft as under:
We started our company in Jan 13 and engaged the employee in Jan 13 itself as head to guide and lead the unit to survive & flourish the business as he informed us during interview that he is expert in the line. Unit was fully under his guidance. But he put the unit in trouble and we started facing losses though we were making unit viable. Finding himself incapable, he abruptly in May 13 left the job without informing us. Our unit was at the initial stage, so we had no policy or documents pertaining to appointment or discharge of the employees. All dealings with the employees were verbal in good faith at that point of time. On his absconding, we contacted him to come back help us to make the unit viable. Finding no way, we have to close down the unit after suffering huge losses and reputation in the market in Aug 13.. All this is attributable to him only.
Now he has filed case against us to coin the situation. However, we owe payment of Rs...........(Here you should have documents/details of calculation to prove before the court) to him and for which we have no objection to sort out the matter amicably. If he is ready to accept and close the matter, he may be directed to report to the management within 30 days Here we plead that our unit stands closed and case is not tenable against us.
With the above backgrounds, I am hopeful that court will take positive view against you and will not grant more amount than you accepted.
Wish you all the best.
V K Gupta
From India, Panipat
After analyzing the above post, I opine as under:
You should not fully deny relationship of master & servant with the employee as he might have some documents relating to your company whether same are fabricated or not. After all onus will be on you to prove fabrication. Moreover you have to take one stand during the course of proceedings before the court. Further, if we deny relationship with the employee, we can not reply and justify one question 'Why he has filed case against you ? So I give you draft as under:
We started our company in Jan 13 and engaged the employee in Jan 13 itself as head to guide and lead the unit to survive & flourish the business as he informed us during interview that he is expert in the line. Unit was fully under his guidance. But he put the unit in trouble and we started facing losses though we were making unit viable. Finding himself incapable, he abruptly in May 13 left the job without informing us. Our unit was at the initial stage, so we had no policy or documents pertaining to appointment or discharge of the employees. All dealings with the employees were verbal in good faith at that point of time. On his absconding, we contacted him to come back help us to make the unit viable. Finding no way, we have to close down the unit after suffering huge losses and reputation in the market in Aug 13.. All this is attributable to him only.
Now he has filed case against us to coin the situation. However, we owe payment of Rs...........(Here you should have documents/details of calculation to prove before the court) to him and for which we have no objection to sort out the matter amicably. If he is ready to accept and close the matter, he may be directed to report to the management within 30 days Here we plead that our unit stands closed and case is not tenable against us.
With the above backgrounds, I am hopeful that court will take positive view against you and will not grant more amount than you accepted.
Wish you all the best.
V K Gupta
From India, Panipat
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