Hi everyone,
I have been facing a problem in one of our branches located in Delhi, wherein one of our employees was caught under the influence of alcohol during working hours. For this act, we issued him a "Show Cause Notice" to clarify his stance. The notice period given was 7 working days for him to respond, but we have not received any reply from him until now.
Can I terminate the employee for committing this grave mistake, as I do not want him to remain with us any longer?
We do not have a Substance Alcohol Abuse policy in our appointment letter. This is the first time we are encountering such a situation.
I am awaiting your earliest reply.
From India, Mumbai
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I have been facing a problem in one of our branches located in Delhi, wherein one of our employees was caught under the influence of alcohol during working hours. For this act, we issued him a "Show Cause Notice" to clarify his stance. The notice period given was 7 working days for him to respond, but we have not received any reply from him until now.
Can I terminate the employee for committing this grave mistake, as I do not want him to remain with us any longer?
We do not have a Substance Alcohol Abuse policy in our appointment letter. This is the first time we are encountering such a situation.
I am awaiting your earliest reply.
From India, Mumbai
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Hi Parab,
I have been in your situation 😊 Well, if the person does not respond, then you need to call over the phone and inquire. The seriousness of the issue is not understood by the person himself. First, try reaching him via phone. Remind him of the notice issued against him and put a stern warning over the phone and mail stating that his silence in reverting can cease the business contract between him and the employer. Such actions require a verbal warning instantly - was that done? Because after the first warning, the person should be given time to prove that he would not repeat that during business hours/business space henceforth. Why don't you want him to be with you anymore? Is it because of the alcoholic nature? Give time and a chance for him to prove his stance. You are in Mumbai - he is in Delhi. You even need investigation reps from trusted sources before you could finalize on anything.
From India, Madras
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57I have been in your situation 😊 Well, if the person does not respond, then you need to call over the phone and inquire. The seriousness of the issue is not understood by the person himself. First, try reaching him via phone. Remind him of the notice issued against him and put a stern warning over the phone and mail stating that his silence in reverting can cease the business contract between him and the employer. Such actions require a verbal warning instantly - was that done? Because after the first warning, the person should be given time to prove that he would not repeat that during business hours/business space henceforth. Why don't you want him to be with you anymore? Is it because of the alcoholic nature? Give time and a chance for him to prove his stance. You are in Mumbai - he is in Delhi. You even need investigation reps from trusted sources before you could finalize on anything.
From India, Madras
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Yes, you can issue a termination letter to him as this thing comes under "misconduct" or "offensive behavior". I hope the "misconduct" issue is mentioned in the appointment letter. Even if it's not mentioned, it's the sole discretion of management to decide whether to continue the employment of any employee or not. Also, take others' advice on whether he should be really terminated or not. Will the work be affected or not? You can also seek feedback from all employees. If termination is not preferred, you can take any other strict measure. But first, try to check why he came drunk, was he intoxicated by anyone or not. Does he have a drinking habit or not? This is a crucial matter, so act wisely.
Regards,
Gunjan
From India, New Delhi
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Regards,
Gunjan
From India, New Delhi
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Dear Parab,
Of course, it is a serious misconduct, but during this period, you should have taken a medical report. Now, tell me one thing: what is his designation and how much service has he had with the company? You cannot terminate straightaway.
Regards,
J. S. Malik
From India, Delhi
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Of course, it is a serious misconduct, but during this period, you should have taken a medical report. Now, tell me one thing: what is his designation and how much service has he had with the company? You cannot terminate straightaway.
Regards,
J. S. Malik
From India, Delhi
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To Ash,
Thanks a lot for your prompt reply. I would like to mention that the said employee had committed the same act thrice, for which he was given an oral warning and subsequently an Office Memo. In spite of that, he has not bothered to improve his performance and has continued with his indecent attitude.
I think now it is high time not to tolerate such a nuisance employee who can disturb the morale of our staff and working conditions, which can further lead to damage.
Awaiting your advice.
Thank you
From India, Mumbai
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Thanks a lot for your prompt reply. I would like to mention that the said employee had committed the same act thrice, for which he was given an oral warning and subsequently an Office Memo. In spite of that, he has not bothered to improve his performance and has continued with his indecent attitude.
I think now it is high time not to tolerate such a nuisance employee who can disturb the morale of our staff and working conditions, which can further lead to damage.
Awaiting your advice.
Thank you
From India, Mumbai
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To Malik & Gunjan,
Thank you very much for your quick help. The designation offered to him is that of Counter Staff (a very junior-level position), and the same person has repeatedly committed the same nuisance. We have already given him oral warnings and an "Office Memo" to improve his performance. Despite this, he has not shown any improvement to date, which has negatively affected the performance and morale of our staff. Additionally, this individual has a habit of consuming alcohol (addictive).
The employee has been working with us for over 1 year and 2 months.
From India, Mumbai
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Thank you very much for your quick help. The designation offered to him is that of Counter Staff (a very junior-level position), and the same person has repeatedly committed the same nuisance. We have already given him oral warnings and an "Office Memo" to improve his performance. Despite this, he has not shown any improvement to date, which has negatively affected the performance and morale of our staff. Additionally, this individual has a habit of consuming alcohol (addictive).
The employee has been working with us for over 1 year and 2 months.
From India, Mumbai
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Hey Parab,
If this is the case, then fire him. Make sure all the proofs supporting the warnings, and his acknowledgment on the same, are ALWAYS ready with you, and a copy of the same with any HR coordinator reporting to you from Delhi (if any).
We came across the same situation, and the person was just over the line. The worst situation which triggered the FIRING in our case was when he called his assistant and drank along with him during office hours.
On the weekend, he went to another subordinate's house and forced him to drink, causing the subordinate to inform Management that he would not come to work anymore. It was a huge issue, and I was away from the plant, located at the Corporate Office, so I understand the situation you are going through.
We came up with a one-line policy added to your appointment letter that if an employee is found indulging in alcoholism during work hours, or even in the workspace or client campus, it will lead to immediate termination.
Such people who can't control their habit must not be given another chance; they have been having that throughout their life. Not at the cost of the Corporate Image!
From India, Madras
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If this is the case, then fire him. Make sure all the proofs supporting the warnings, and his acknowledgment on the same, are ALWAYS ready with you, and a copy of the same with any HR coordinator reporting to you from Delhi (if any).
We came across the same situation, and the person was just over the line. The worst situation which triggered the FIRING in our case was when he called his assistant and drank along with him during office hours.
On the weekend, he went to another subordinate's house and forced him to drink, causing the subordinate to inform Management that he would not come to work anymore. It was a huge issue, and I was away from the plant, located at the Corporate Office, so I understand the situation you are going through.
We came up with a one-line policy added to your appointment letter that if an employee is found indulging in alcoholism during work hours, or even in the workspace or client campus, it will lead to immediate termination.
Such people who can't control their habit must not be given another chance; they have been having that throughout their life. Not at the cost of the Corporate Image!
From India, Madras
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No Ravi - at that ponint I remember I was hyper tensed. Now when I think over it I feel liek laughing... ;-)
From India, Madras
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From India, Madras
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Are you sure you dont want to banned once again? Mannipp kelung - enkittey!! Maap para - ennod! (In malayalam) ;-)
From India, Madras
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From India, Madras
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In our office, the same incident happened. One of our employees came drunk and was abusing all office staff. We simply fired him without any notice because we don't have any policy related to the issue. Is this the right decision?
From India, Hyderabad
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From India, Hyderabad
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Hi Parab,
From your message, it appears the person in question is a habitual alcoholic and a repeat offender.
While it seems proper to show him the way out, as he has repeated the offense more than thrice, my suggestion is that before you dismiss the person, please hold a formal domestic inquiry and complete the process and keep all your support documents in place.
The memo that was issued earlier cautioning him to refrain from such an act must be there in the original.
In case he does not respond to the "show cause notice," send the same to his officially registered residential address by Registered post, and if the same returns back unaccepted, then you publish an advertisement in the vernacular newspaper asking the person to report at the office within a specified date or else his employment shall stand terminated.
Also, it is suggested to go through the "Administrative Manual" or "Standing Orders" governing the service conditions in your organization, as regards the procedure to be followed while terminating an employee for gross indiscipline of this sort.
We must keep in mind that the "Principle of Natural Justice" is to be followed in any such termination in order to avoid any future legal repercussions.
You may please take your decision accordingly.
Regards,
Probhat
From India
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From your message, it appears the person in question is a habitual alcoholic and a repeat offender.
While it seems proper to show him the way out, as he has repeated the offense more than thrice, my suggestion is that before you dismiss the person, please hold a formal domestic inquiry and complete the process and keep all your support documents in place.
The memo that was issued earlier cautioning him to refrain from such an act must be there in the original.
In case he does not respond to the "show cause notice," send the same to his officially registered residential address by Registered post, and if the same returns back unaccepted, then you publish an advertisement in the vernacular newspaper asking the person to report at the office within a specified date or else his employment shall stand terminated.
Also, it is suggested to go through the "Administrative Manual" or "Standing Orders" governing the service conditions in your organization, as regards the procedure to be followed while terminating an employee for gross indiscipline of this sort.
We must keep in mind that the "Principle of Natural Justice" is to be followed in any such termination in order to avoid any future legal repercussions.
You may please take your decision accordingly.
Regards,
Probhat
From India
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Dear All, Please Help me in this problem, I am working as Admin & Coordinator ,pls can eany body help me what all my Jobs & what i can bring new ids to my company.. Help me Pleace
From India, Bangalore
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From India, Bangalore
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Sir, I just want to say that you should give him a chance to respond to your company as many times as possible. If possible, you can personally have a meeting with the particular employee. Ask your managers to go for counseling, which can change the behavior of the employee. If all else fails, then fire him, but only after completing all the formalities. This includes conducting a domestic inquiry, proving him guilty of the misconduct he has committed, and keeping all the documentary evidence as proof. If the employee is not responding, prepare a charge sheet and send it to his address. Make sure that an acknowledgment is received.
From India, Vijayawada
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From India, Vijayawada
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please make sure that the steps taken by u are in good faith of both the emplooyee and for ur company.
From India, Vijayawada
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From India, Vijayawada
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Hi Pranab,
You should be gentle in addressing this issue, but also take firm action by imposing a penalty. By implementing a significant fine, the employee will realize the seriousness of the problem with drinking. Indeed, fines can be an effective solution; many government organizations levy fines in cases involving alcohol consumption.
Best regards,
Sajid Ansari
Delhi
From India, Delhi
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You should be gentle in addressing this issue, but also take firm action by imposing a penalty. By implementing a significant fine, the employee will realize the seriousness of the problem with drinking. Indeed, fines can be an effective solution; many government organizations levy fines in cases involving alcohol consumption.
Best regards,
Sajid Ansari
Delhi
From India, Delhi
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If it is the very first time that an incident happened, it is very difficult to prove that the person was drunk in a domestic enquiry. You need to have a medical report of the person for support, which is the process for dismissal.
Vivek Kumar
09891151873
From India, Bangalore
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Vivek Kumar
09891151873
From India, Bangalore
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Dear friends,
These are all critical issues that need to be handled very carefully. First, check whether your organization has standing orders or certified rules and regulations. If the number of employees is low, you have to establish rules and regulations that need to be certified by management and employees. After that, you can follow these procedures - like issuing a show cause notice, preparing a charge sheet, conducting an inquiry, investigation, and maintaining records. Based on all these steps, you can terminate the delinquent employee because nowadays, everyone is educated and aware of the law. Therefore, in the future, you may encounter problems. Without proper documentation and evidence, nobody will agree with you. If the issue becomes serious, even management may turn against you.
Regards, Ramnath G Naik
From India, Bangalore
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These are all critical issues that need to be handled very carefully. First, check whether your organization has standing orders or certified rules and regulations. If the number of employees is low, you have to establish rules and regulations that need to be certified by management and employees. After that, you can follow these procedures - like issuing a show cause notice, preparing a charge sheet, conducting an inquiry, investigation, and maintaining records. Based on all these steps, you can terminate the delinquent employee because nowadays, everyone is educated and aware of the law. Therefore, in the future, you may encounter problems. Without proper documentation and evidence, nobody will agree with you. If the issue becomes serious, even management may turn against you.
Regards, Ramnath G Naik
From India, Bangalore
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Hi,
If no direct clause is written for "under the influence of alcohol during working hours," you must have some clause for misconduct and unethical behavior in the workplace. You can place this case under that clause with grave repercussions for the same. Since you have already warned him earlier, also ask him either to resign or begin the termination process with all supporting documents. Take serious action to set an example.
Add a clause for handling such cases in the appointment letter for the future.
Cheers,
Sheetal Sehgal
From India, New Delhi
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If no direct clause is written for "under the influence of alcohol during working hours," you must have some clause for misconduct and unethical behavior in the workplace. You can place this case under that clause with grave repercussions for the same. Since you have already warned him earlier, also ask him either to resign or begin the termination process with all supporting documents. Take serious action to set an example.
Add a clause for handling such cases in the appointment letter for the future.
Cheers,
Sheetal Sehgal
From India, New Delhi
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Dear,
On the date when this employee was in a drunken state, you should have had him medically examined and issued a show cause notice, with at least two witnesses who could testify that he was intoxicated during office hours inside the office premises.
Whether you have a substance abuse policy or not, it does not matter; he can simply be terminated for his irresponsible behavior.
Send him an expedited notice and request a reply to your show cause notice. If he fails to respond this time, terminate his service. For more details, you can contact me at 09990231262.
Major Anand
From India, Delhi
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On the date when this employee was in a drunken state, you should have had him medically examined and issued a show cause notice, with at least two witnesses who could testify that he was intoxicated during office hours inside the office premises.
Whether you have a substance abuse policy or not, it does not matter; he can simply be terminated for his irresponsible behavior.
Send him an expedited notice and request a reply to your show cause notice. If he fails to respond this time, terminate his service. For more details, you can contact me at 09990231262.
Major Anand
From India, Delhi
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Dear,
The services of an employee cannot be terminated without giving him an opportunity to explain as a principle of natural justice. However, you can issue him a charge sheet and conduct an inquiry before the termination of his services. If the employee does not cooperate, the inquiry can proceed ex parte. This is in accordance with the law regarding the termination of an employee.
K.K. Panigrahi
From India, Calcutta
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The services of an employee cannot be terminated without giving him an opportunity to explain as a principle of natural justice. However, you can issue him a charge sheet and conduct an inquiry before the termination of his services. If the employee does not cooperate, the inquiry can proceed ex parte. This is in accordance with the law regarding the termination of an employee.
K.K. Panigrahi
From India, Calcutta
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Hi Parab,
In most organizations, they have a DAP (Disciplinary Action Policy) along with a CAP (Corrective Action Policy) to take care of serious issues with zero tolerance, such as drinking alcohol, theft, sexual abuse, insubordination, instigation, etc. If you are not following any drafted policy in your organization until now, I would advise you to draft one and start implementing it to prevent future occurrences of such incidents in your organization.
Best Regards,
Minakshi
From India, Mumbai
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In most organizations, they have a DAP (Disciplinary Action Policy) along with a CAP (Corrective Action Policy) to take care of serious issues with zero tolerance, such as drinking alcohol, theft, sexual abuse, insubordination, instigation, etc. If you are not following any drafted policy in your organization until now, I would advise you to draft one and start implementing it to prevent future occurrences of such incidents in your organization.
Best Regards,
Minakshi
From India, Mumbai
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Hi,
In all disciplinary matters, the essence is how swift you are in dealing with the cases. Coming to work under the influence of alcohol is a serious misconduct and must be dealt with. If a show cause notice has been issued and receipt acknowledged, you may send him a second letter informing him of the date and time of the inquiry and directing him to remain present before the inquiry authority. It should be made clear to him that if he fails to remain present, the inquiry will be held ex-parte, and no further explanation will be entertained. It is then left to the inquiry authority to hold the inquiry and submit his report.
While we are obliged to follow the principles of natural justice before taking action, we should not be too defensive in dealing with the cases. We should reasonably be prompt in disciplining the employees who must get a clear message that indiscipline is not tolerated by the organization.
Cyril
From India, Nagpur
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In all disciplinary matters, the essence is how swift you are in dealing with the cases. Coming to work under the influence of alcohol is a serious misconduct and must be dealt with. If a show cause notice has been issued and receipt acknowledged, you may send him a second letter informing him of the date and time of the inquiry and directing him to remain present before the inquiry authority. It should be made clear to him that if he fails to remain present, the inquiry will be held ex-parte, and no further explanation will be entertained. It is then left to the inquiry authority to hold the inquiry and submit his report.
While we are obliged to follow the principles of natural justice before taking action, we should not be too defensive in dealing with the cases. We should reasonably be prompt in disciplining the employees who must get a clear message that indiscipline is not tolerated by the organization.
Cyril
From India, Nagpur
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